Israel Commences Ground Invasion into Gaza.

[DutchJazzer]

Thanks for reading, then. Respect your opinion.

i just think if the arab nation is united israel cant do a thing.

the difference is world war 2/ the holocaust united the jews as 1.
i got some old family members who whore not allowed to marry each other because one was Ashkenazim and 1 was sephardic, they did anyway. they where both kicked out the respective synagoge. years later they wher eboth welcomed back though.


the arabs as a whole have nothing to unite them that strongly. all of em have different vision about islam. and that keeps them apart.
dont get me wrong jews still have different vision on judiasm, but that does not divide them anymore

 

[Hax0rs]

ooh ok, it says in wikipedia so it is indisputable truth.

OK!

Happy to point morons in the right direction bro.

 

[DutchJazzer]

Forty cats don't come up to a lion[/I]. It so fits the situation here. United or not, the Arabs just can't cope with Israel and USA.

btw been thinking of this saying.
so why do 2 cats take on the lion while the other 38 live in lavish luxury?

 

[The Blue Elephant]

Let's just put up a fence, not allow anything in or out of the greater area and whichever side is left standing wins.

Does this include the 8.5 million dollars the US gives Israel on the daily? You know it is illegal for a United States Citizen to boycott Israel products. A citizen can have a fine up 50,000 dollars and prison for up to 10 years for boycotting Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boycotts_of_Israel#Penalties

God I hoped Ron Paul was elected president. He would have stopped aid to Israel. That alone is reason enough to elect him.

 

[Stoked]

Does this include the 8.5 million dollars the US gives Israel on the daily? You know it is illegal for a United States Citizen to boycott Israel products. A citizen can have a fine up 50,000 dollars and prison for up to 10 years for boycotting Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boycotts_of_Israel#Penalties

God I hoped Ron Paul was elected president. He would have stopped aid to Israel. That alone is reason enough to elect him.

We should suspend aid to everyone. Then review each individual aid reason/amount/receipient and determine what we still want to spend on and what we don't. Not surprised to see you take this stance though.

 

[One Brow]

They lost at least 3 major wars to Israel. They still want to destroy Israel and kill all the Jews they can. How can you still ask for anything from Israel at this point?

When, in modern or ancient history, has a thoroughly defeated side been able to dictate peace terms to the victors?

Giving people the basics of human dignity is something you do because they are people, regardless of how they feel about you. Being treated like full citizens should not need to be dictated in peace terms, it should be an automatic assumption.

 

[One Brow]

Israel is willing to give them their own country and some form of self-rule.

I marvel at the mental agility required to contradict yourself in a single sentence like that. If the Palestinians to not have true self-rule, it is not their own country. Your ethical core seems to be "might makes right", I fundamentally disagree.

 

[One Brow]

Does this include the 8.5 million dollars the US gives Israel on the daily? You know it is illegal for a United States Citizen to boycott Israel products. A citizen can have a fine up 50,000 dollars and prison for up to 10 years for boycotting Israel.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boycotts_of_Israel#Penalties

God I hoped Ron Paul was elected president. He would have stopped aid to Israel. That alone is reason enough to elect him.

From your own article:

In July 2010, the Olympia food co-op in the State of Washington in the United States decided to stop selling products from Israel in its two grocery stores. A board member of the co-op said concerning the boycott that "any product that is made (...) to improve the conditions of the Palestinians will be exempted."

Any word on prosecutions of this co-op?

Also, what is actually illegal?

The scope of the EAR, as defined by Section 8 of the EAA, is limited to actions taken with intent to comply with, further, or support an unsanctioned foreign boycott.

Boycotting for internal reasons is not prohibited, and such a prohibition would be unconstitutional.

 

[Jamezz]

i just think if the arab nation is united israel cant do a thing.

the difference is world war 2/ the holocaust united the jews as 1.
i got some old family members who whore not allowed to marry each other because one was Ashkenazim and 1 was sephardic, they did anyway. they where both kicked out the respective synagoge. years later they wher eboth welcomed back though.


the arabs as a whole have nothing to unite them that strongly. all of em have different vision about islam. and that keeps them apart.
dont get me wrong jews still have different vision on judiasm, but that does not divide them anymore

What about the orthodox jews who are opposed to the Zionist state? The US is not supporting the jewish people but the Zionist state, which has been the biggest travesty in this country's history, in part due to the fact that Zionism has infiltrated our government, as it has been infiltrating many other governments since at least WWI. There's a difference between being antisemitic (which is straight up racist) and being anti-zionist.

 

[MVP]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY

 

[DutchJazzer]

What about the orthodox jews who are opposed to the Zionist state? The US is not supporting the jewish people but the Zionist state, which has been the biggest travesty in this country's history, in part due to the fact that Zionism has infiltrated our government, as it has been infiltrating many other governments since at least WWI. There's a difference between being antisemitic (which is straight up racist) and being anti-zionist.

sure there are some small outliers.
some small groups. but all in all they stand together

 

[Jamezz]

sure there are some small outliers.
some small groups. but all in all they stand together

Yeah, I guess they do all stand together...

 

[DutchJazzer]

Yeah, I guess they do all stand together...

View attachment 3682

so what?

the jewish people still stands united. ofcourse there will be a few outliers.
but look at the big picutre.
those jews only number in the 5000.


if 99.99% stands united. the 0.01 can do as they please.
but my point still stands as compared to the arabs. they are far from united.
atleast jews are close. if i may not say they are united because of a select few

 

[The Blue Elephant]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY

Hmm interesting this video was created by a Jewish Woman. Didn't expect that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nina_Paley

 

[Hantlers]

I don't like it when JimLes and OB argue with each other, because then I don't know which one of them to pick to annoy. So much easier when they get along.

 

[JimLes]

I marvel at the mental agility required to contradict yourself in a single sentence like that. If the Palestinians to not have true self-rule, it is not their own country.

What country has true self-rule these days? North Korea, maybe? We live in an age where sovereignty is given up in order to achieve things like economic cooperation, peace, etc.

 

[♪alt13]

The Explosive, Inside Story of How John Kerry Built an Israel-Palestine Peace Plan—and Watched It Crumble

https://www.newrepublic.com/article/118751/how-israel-palestine-peace-deal-died

 

[eacioban]

Hmm interesting this video was created by a Jewish Woman. Didn't expect that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nina_Paley

As a jew and as an Israeli, I say this video is dumb.
Over simplifying the complex reality always results in an unbelievable propaganda effort. I get it that starting to explain reality to someone who has no clue about it is impossible, but dumbing them down is worst.
I usually do not comment here on political subjects, but I do want to send one clear message to you all:

Most of you probably have no real understanding about the nature of the Israeli-Hamas conflict. Take notice I do not classify it as Israeli-Palestinian conflict. A lot of you sound very reasonable opinions that are based on poor or incomplete knowledge. I strongly support humane attitudes, but relaying on them alone is nothing more than wishful thinking. If you do want to understand, I urge you study the conflict before you share your opinion. I say this as a true believer in peaceful conflict resolution and as an historian. When I was researching the American colonies - Native American conflict, I quickly realized i'm in no position to declare any moral opinion about it as I can not paint a detailed enough picture of it for me to learn from. I sure had some thoughts about it, but the facts kept tilting them from side to side.

I advise you and urge you to do the same.

 

[♪alt13]

As a jew and as an Israeli, I say this video is dumb.
Over simplifying the complex reality always results in an unbelievable propaganda effort. I get it that starting to explain reality to someone who has no clue about it is impossible, but dumbing them down is worst.
I usually do not comment here on political subjects, but I do want to send one clear message to you all:

Most of you probably have no real understanding about the nature of the Israeli-Hamas conflict. Take notice I do not classify it as Israeli-Palestinian conflict. A lot of you sound very reasonable opinions that are based on poor or incomplete knowledge. I strongly support humane attitudes, but relaying on them alone is nothing more than wishful thinking. If you do want to understand, I urge you study the conflict before you share your opinion. I say this as a true believer in peaceful conflict resolution and as an historian. When I was researching the American colonies - Native American conflict, I quickly realized i'm in no position to declare any moral opinion about it as I can not paint a detailed enough picture of it for me to learn from. I sure had some thoughts about it, but the facts kept tilting them from side to side.

I advise you and urge you to do the same.

Do you believe Israelis and Palestinians can live in a single state? (non-apartheid) Cuz it seems that Israel is making a future Palestinian state less viable with every passing year.

Honestly this thread needs a reasonable Israeli perspective. Dutch is making y'all look bad.

 

[eacioban]

Do you believe Israelis and Palestinians can live in a single state? (non-apartheid) Cuz it seems that Israel is making a future Palestinian state less viable with every passing year.

Honestly this thread needs a reasonable Israeli perspective. Dutch is making y'all look bad.

I believe a single state solution is not a solution at all, but a contradiction to both sides' aspirations. Unlike the case of South Africa, and more like the cases of former Yugoslavia, former Czechoslovakia, former Austro-Hungarian Empire, Spain and the Basks, you can't have two, or more, nationally different populations living together in good terms. I do believe that the two nations solution is slowly heading in the right direction as we speak. You see, Hamas actually drive the Palestinians closer to Israel than they wish. I think the Palestinian people start to realize that residing next to Israel is not that bad of a way to live. I think that the fact that Hamas and its leaders spent literally hundreds of millions dollars on weapons and tunnels that mostly failed, shows that they can't be the solution. On the other hand, If the Palestinians can guarantee to stop all terror attempts, they will enjoy Israel's and the world's financial and infrastructure support. Just so you know, most of the tunnels that Hamas built are made of Israeli concrete that was sent to the Gaza strip in order to rebuild it after the 2008 operation.

Sadly, I believe the current conflict was unavoidable due to Hamas's persistence to harm Israel, even if that means hurting the Palestinians even more.
Even more saddening is the fact that the current conflict strengthened the rightist radicals in Israel, and more people than I would like started to support their views. It is a natural and frightening phenomena, but it happens everywhere in the world, much like what happened after 9/11 in the US.