Yep. What I said.
It's Over - Ne Deal for Gtime - RFA time
- Thread starter udflyer
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Yep. What I said.
Litany
Well-Known Member
Which is why I still like Hayward but I can't deny that it does make me like less.
He could have signed for 12 million (overpay imo) and gotten this behind him but he wanted to pound his chest for the POSSIBILITY at another 2-4 Million after taxes.
Bad move IMO. Very bad one. I say trade him of you get a chance at a top 5 pick in 2014.
Bobcats are trying to win. Trade him there for their unprotected pick.
I think talk about trading him is premature. We have not even seen him play out more then 1 game as a main focal point of the team. Lets give it a month or two before we start in on that.
I don't get holding this against Hayward. This is a situation that will work itself out. No one was injured here.
He either earns the money he wants and gets it, hopefully from us at that point or,
He doesn't deserve the money he wants but some team gives it to him anyway or,
It becomes clear to him and the rest of the NBA that what the Jazz offered was about right and he takes an offer similar to what we offered him.
The good news is that the Jazz didn't act like a desperate old maid for once. No knock on Hayward.
He either earns the money he wants and gets it, hopefully from us at that point or,
He doesn't deserve the money he wants but some team gives it to him anyway or,
It becomes clear to him and the rest of the NBA that what the Jazz offered was about right and he takes an offer similar to what we offered him.
The good news is that the Jazz didn't act like a desperate old maid for once. No knock on Hayward.
Litany
Well-Known Member
I'm holding it against him because he wasn't reasonable and has an overinflated sense of his worth and ultimately gave the finger to the Jazz for a couple million. The jazz were more than generous in their offer and he knew they had room to pay him more and he just said FU.
I'm not angry more disappointed. He could have put this behind him and gotten a good deal based on all reports but he chose not to and now he's the one at risk and its going to be a distraction all season.
Maybe another thing in disappointed in is we can't use him in draft night trades if we wanted to
I'd do that all day. Nothing against Hayward.
I can't say much more than Gameface, who has more or less nailed it with his posts. I see this move by Hayward as an opportunity to show that he can perform at the highest level with even more pressure on him. We saw how he wilted with his post season performance. We saw how he had extreme focus problems with his jump shot in his first two years on the team when he shot an egregiously low three point percentage. We've rarely seen him show that he is a clutch performer in the NBA.
If Hayward kills it and still plays with his teammates, then he has succeeded in a high pressure situation. Thus he deserves big money. If he wilts again, then we know really what kind of player he is. This is Hayward's chance to earn his money. I feel that his weaknesses will be exposed, and we will sign him for about 11 million per...just a guess. We can't get on Hayward too bad since he is listening to his agent, whom he hired to handle this, and Hayward has never done this before, so let's cut him a little slack...but just a little.
If Hayward kills it and still plays with his teammates, then he has succeeded in a high pressure situation. Thus he deserves big money. If he wilts again, then we know really what kind of player he is. This is Hayward's chance to earn his money. I feel that his weaknesses will be exposed, and we will sign him for about 11 million per...just a guess. We can't get on Hayward too bad since he is listening to his agent, whom he hired to handle this, and Hayward has never done this before, so let's cut him a little slack...but just a little.
Now that I'm thinking about it, he has a history of being incredibly fickle. His first car was a Honda Accord. So I'm really not all that surprised he's trying so hard for more money.
mellow
Well-Known Member
Yep. I like the show of strength and resolve by the FO. Paying players above their level is a surefire way to continue bouncing between 8th seed and lottery. Now the pressure and spotlight is on Hayward, lets see how he does.
Too much anti-Hayward sentiment in this thread. The man didn't do anything wrong. He feels (or his agent) he's worth more than he was offered, and he wants to prove it. Let him. This makes sense for both parties. Let's wait and see what he's made of. I'm really happy he wasn't paid on 'potential'.
Sexual Favors
Well-Known Member
This what happens when you don't play your lottery picks--you and they don't know what they're worth.
Yes he is restricted, but yes we could be forced to overpay to keep him. I personally have been less impressed with DL than some other fans (Burke pick, keeping Ty, not getting Bledsoe for Sap, pa king preseason with scrubs that ate too many minutes un too many games, favoritism of JLIII, and now noy getting Hayward deal done).
Hayward may say he wants to be in Utah, and I want to believe him, but it's tricky. Celtics, Suns, and Clippers are all known to covet him. Celtics and Suns would maximize his talents (instead of rotating him un and out of the game in such a way that causes him to go cold, or asking him to be leading scorer, and leading playmaker for others because the GM decided to draft the one person they didn't work out).
I could see Hayward having a bad year, and still getting offered a lot of money by someone else who realizes how badly we mismanaged him. Scary. Hayward isn't a #1 guy, his ceiling could be like a Scottie Pippen (#2 guy on a dynasty team). I don't see us winning any championships with him as the #1 guy, but I don't see us getting there without him.
Yes he is restricted, but yes we could be forced to overpay to keep him. I personally have been less impressed with DL than some other fans (Burke pick, keeping Ty, not getting Bledsoe for Sap, pa king preseason with scrubs that ate too many minutes un too many games, favoritism of JLIII, and now noy getting Hayward deal done).
Hayward may say he wants to be in Utah, and I want to believe him, but it's tricky. Celtics, Suns, and Clippers are all known to covet him. Celtics and Suns would maximize his talents (instead of rotating him un and out of the game in such a way that causes him to go cold, or asking him to be leading scorer, and leading playmaker for others because the GM decided to draft the one person they didn't work out).
I could see Hayward having a bad year, and still getting offered a lot of money by someone else who realizes how badly we mismanaged him. Scary. Hayward isn't a #1 guy, his ceiling could be like a Scottie Pippen (#2 guy on a dynasty team). I don't see us winning any championships with him as the #1 guy, but I don't see us getting there without him.
Ohhh.. important distinction. Thanks for bringing me back down to reality. The overall dollars makes much more sense.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
I think that passing on the offer reveals a lot about his attitude toward this team. He knows that the more money we spend on him the less we can pay his teammates. From my perspective it looks like he has an incredible situation here and it definitely concerns me that he would put so much at risk because he believes he can extract a couple million more from this team or another one. Maybe the problem is that declining $10 million a year is so mind boggling to me. Favors played this whole situation in exactly the opposite way, and my respect for him has grown as a result... especially because of the way he has performed since putting the contract behind him. I'd like to see a team made up of guys who are more committed to winning than getting paid. It might sound like a fairy tale, but a team with a Stockton-like mentality would be fun to cheer for again. It sure beats a team with a Boozer-like mentality.
LifeOnaPlate
Well-Known Member
I think this is mostly a win-win. Now we get Hayward on a contract year to see him at his peak effort. I think it's too bad that he would hog up some resources that might go to surrounding him with a championship team. But maybe he really is worth more. Now we'll know.
fishonjazz
Well-Known Member
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He still drive that accord
Marc Stein: League sources sat Hayward was NOT seeking four-year max but parties couldn't close gap even after Jazz CEO Greg Miller spoke optimistically Twitter @ESPNSteinLine
Marc Stein: Extension deadline officially passes w/no deal for Utah's Gordon Hayward. Sides were negotiating 4-year deal, sources say, but no agreement Twitter @ESPNSteinLine
Shams Charania: For Hayward, there will undoubtedly be transition back into complete focus on basketball. Negotiations weighed heavily on him, sources said. Twitter @ShamsCharania
Marc Stein: Jazz & Suns decide they prefer matching potentially rich offers to Hayward & Bledsoe in restricted free agency rather than spend big now Twitter @ESPNSteinLine
Plus several tweets/quotes about Hayward having strong ties to Utah and liking it here from his agent. PR stuff.
Marc Stein: Extension deadline officially passes w/no deal for Utah's Gordon Hayward. Sides were negotiating 4-year deal, sources say, but no agreement Twitter @ESPNSteinLine
Shams Charania: For Hayward, there will undoubtedly be transition back into complete focus on basketball. Negotiations weighed heavily on him, sources said. Twitter @ShamsCharania
Marc Stein: Jazz & Suns decide they prefer matching potentially rich offers to Hayward & Bledsoe in restricted free agency rather than spend big now Twitter @ESPNSteinLine
Plus several tweets/quotes about Hayward having strong ties to Utah and liking it here from his agent. PR stuff.
