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Kanter and Nike Hoop Summit History

gregbroncs said:
Pretty sure the part in red is wrong. They were talking with Calipari and saying how Kanter did practice with the team this year. He was ineligible to play but that does not mean he could not practice.

I don't have an opinion one way or the other on Kanter but none of your arguments here are convincing in any way. I see Knight/Williams and even Irving as almost as big of risks as Kanter. At least Kanter has the size for his position and is not seen as a tweener.

I don't really want Knight at 3 I think a better PG can be had next year. Any of DWill, Irving or Kanter and I'll be happy with this pick. There is 3 or 4 pretty good player's in your lists. Were any of the rest even 1st round picks? Take out every player that was not and maybe your list would hold a little weight. Other wise I could start listing 2nd round scrubs to prove that none of the american college players are worth the risk.
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I agree with everything other than a PG in next years class. I don't even think there's a PG, at this point, in the year after that. I've believed for some time now that KOC will either draft Knight at #3 or go the FA route for a PG.
 
Thee jazz fan said:
No...... You proved otherwise, like I stated before most of those players listed were considered scrubs the four players that were considered first round talent three of the four ended up being decent to great players. That's a 75% success rate.

Enough said.
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forgot to put in the quot when I wrote this. Was referring to the first post.
 
Borat said:
I don't claim to be draft guru, but it looks to me Irving, Williams, and Knight have a much better risk/reward parameters than that of Kanter. Kanter just seems like a complete crap shot. Like buying a lottery ticket. It's an investment based on complete speculation, with historically nearly non existent return.
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All of the players in the draft are lottery tickets with much better odds of success. Hell you think Portland is happy with the way their pick of Oden turned out? He was the "safer" pick over Durant. How about Orlando who took a risk and drafted Dwight Howard instead of Okafor? Okafor was also the "safer" pick. Personnally I want the guy that has the best chance of being a franchise player. From what I have heard and seen those players are DWill, Irving and Kanter. Knight is definitely the "safer" pick but he also seems to have a lower ceiling that the other 3.
 
Borat said:
https://www.kentucky.com/2010/10/02/1459745/ncaa-says-kanter-must-stop-practicing.html#ixzz1189tOHL4
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He was re-instated to practice after UK petitioned the NCAA. He then had another extension and so he practiced for a few months with the team before being deemed 'permanently ineligible.' After that, though, UK made him a (I forget the title) consultant/team trainer/student-trainer ... something like that .. and he was able to assist with teaching his back-up .. Josh Harrelson. Josh went from a 2-minute per game player to the SEC's leading rebounder. Because of Kanter? Not saying that .. but maybe.
 
PKM said:
I agree with everything other than a PG in next years class. I don't even think there's a PG, at this point, in the year after that. I've believed for some time now that KOC will either draft Knight at #3 or go the FA route for a PG.
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Isn't there a pretty good freshman pg for UK. that is suppose to be pretty good?
 
gregbroncs said:
Other wise I could start listing 2nd round scrubs to prove that none of the american college players are worth the risk.
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This is not accurate. I listed ALL world team guys who scored 15 plus and had great games in summit. Nearly all of them were busts. That shows having a great game at summit alone for worlds team does not mean you are deserving a top 3 pick. That means you can't just look at this game and make this conclusion. You need to look at other serious games. And in case of Kanter there is nothing to look at. The game, which I just proved shows nothing, is all we got. And based on that game Kanter is top 3? Do you see the point now?
 
PKM said:
He was re-instated to practice after UK petitioned the NCAA. He then had another extension and so he practiced for a few months with the team before being deemed 'permanently ineligible.' After that, though, UK made him a (I forget the title) consultant/team trainer/student-trainer ... something like that .. and he was able to assist with teaching his back-up .. Josh Harrelson. Josh went from a 2-minute per game player to the SEC's leading rebounder. Because of Kanter? Not saying that .. but maybe.
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So, he practiced for a few months, not ENTIRE year, that's your point?
 
Yep, Marquis Teague. He'll be a really good college player. I'd be hesitant to project a 6'1 pg with questionable shooting very high at this point. Most mocks project him around 10 - 20. Have to see how well he runs the team next year ... it'll be a DAMN good team, so he'll have options.
 
Borat said:
So, he practiced for a few months, not ENTIRE year, that's your point?
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My point was what I said. That the article is incorrect. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything here. Just stating facts, if you don't like them, then believe what you want.
 
Well he did practice with the team even though it wasn't for the whole year. I remember the other Kentucky center mentioning in an interview during the final four that his own improvement was due to playing against Kanter. He also practices against former NBA players who coached at Kentucky. Kanter and his Hoop Summits game was not his coming out game, he has been considered a top European big man for three years in Turkey.

I am not saying he is going to be good or bad because no one knows how kids adjust to playing in the NBA. No one thought Stockton and Malone were future HOFs but few people knew about their work ethic. It is Funny how some people want to draft Biyombo and he has way more question marks than Kanter has.
 
PKM said:
My point was what I said. That the article is incorrect. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything here. Just stating facts, if you don't like them, then believe what you want.
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Is it a fact that he did not practice with the team for NEARLY entire year, outside of a few months?
 
Borat said:
This is not accurate. I listed ALL world team guys who scored 15 plus and had great games in summit. Nearly all of them were busts. That shows having a great game at summit alone for worlds team does not mean you are deserving a top 3 pick. That means you can't just look at this game and make this conclusion. You need to look at other serious games. And in case of Kanter there is nothing to look at. The game, which I just proved shows nothing, is all we got. And based on that game Kanter is top 3? Do you see the point now?
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Didn't someone just post on this board that Kanters greatness was compared to Rubios greatness back in 2008 when everyone thought he was a can't miss prospect.
 
PKM said:
I agree with everything other than a PG in next years class. I don't even think there's a PG, at this point, in the year after that. I've believed for some time now that KOC will either draft Knight at #3 or go the FA route for a PG.
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Maybe. I don't actually know that much about next years draft yet. However would you have said that there were going to be no PG's in this draft? Walker was going to be there but Irving and Knight may or may not have been.
 
cowhide said:
Well he did practice with the team even though it wasn't for the whole year. I remember the other Kentucky center mentioning in an interview during the final four that his own improvement was due to playing against Kanter. He also practices against former NBA players who coached at Kentucky. Kanter and his Hoop Summits game was not his coming out game, he has been considered a top European big man for three years in Turkey.

I am not saying he is going to be good or bad because no one knows how kids adjust to playing in the NBA. No one thought Stockton and Malone were future HOFs but few people knew about their work ethic. It is Funny how some people want to draft Biyombo and he has way more question marks than Kanter has.
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Harrelson, in an interview was asked, "Who's the best center you've played against during your four years at UK?" Harrelson said, "Enes." He was then specifically asked if Kanter is better than Cousins. Harrelson said, "It's not even close."

My point? Don't have one, just sharing.
 
Borat said:
The only reason Kanter was considered a top HS recruit and the only reason he is being considered for top 3 selection is that great Summit game a year ago. Before that he was not considered anywhere near the top guy coming out of HS, and after that he did not play a competitive game and lost development time due to inability to not only play, but even practice with the team this year. To get a historical perspective of how top scorers from the World's team do in NBA, I looked at previous Summits starting at 1995. I am going to list top scorers from Worlds team, who got at least 15 points with their scores in parenthesis.

Here they are: Zemljic(22), Bogojevic(22), Palladino(16), I. Rakocevic (17), J. Victoriano (16), D. Nowitzki (33), M. Neilsen (23), V. Illijevski (19), Fotsis (15), T. Parker (20), O. Oyediji (19), L.Bogdanovic (20), Martynas Pocius (20), Sakota (15), M Tepic (16), Mouhamed Saer Sene (15), Batum (23), Motiejunas(21), Macvan (23), Enes Kanter (34).

Now, granted only Dirk and Kanter crossed 30, but if you look at this list in general, there are many guys who had terrific games at the Summit, but weren't even good enough to make it as a third stringer in NBA. Out of this entire list, only Dirk and Parker are starting caliber players. Batum is a good back-up, and others don't even belong in NBA. And these are top world team guys we are talking about here. Now, we have Kanter, whose only claim to fame was that he did great in that game. Even from US team, if you look, there are few (if any) guys who did great in that game who are actually deserving of top 3 pick. Casey Jacobsen put up 31 points, and he is not even NBA player.

The point is, this game historically, especially when you look at world's team, shows very little as far player's potential and worthiness of top selection. And yet that game is the only reason why Kanter is considered as the top pick.
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I really think people are blowing the fact that he couldn't play last year out of proportion. The only result of that is the fact that he is now harder to evaluate. I would argue that the consensus #1 overall pick lost more "development" time/opportunities last year than Kanter.
 
Borat said:
Is it a fact that he did not practice with the team for NEARLY entire year, outside of a few months?
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College teams only practice for a bit anyway. So he was declared ineligible in october, When was he okayed to begin again. From october on that was only 5 months. So he missed a month or 2 of practice? I guarantee he was still working on his own during that time.
 
gregbroncs said:
Maybe. I don't actually know that much about next years draft yet. However would you have said that there were going to be no PG's in this draft? Walker was going to be there but Irving and Knight may or may not have been.
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I would have projected Knight as a lottery pick while he was a SR in HS ... #3, not sure about that ... but a definite lottery pick. There are NO kids in high school right now that have the credentials even close to Knight did.
 
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