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Las Vegas: Worst Mass Shooting in US History

Why have any regulation on silencers if regulation doesn't work and bad mean people will just find a way to break the law anyway? Wouldn't it be better to get rid of all background checks and mandatory waiting periods? Don't these only hurt good law abiding citizens since regulation doesn't work?

I am not sure if you are being facetious but the regulations are working that is why they should keep them. I also think they should expand this type of regulation to more things with guns. It sounds like research has shown this to be effective with silencers. It seems to reason it would be effective with all guns or certain types of guns or modification parts.
 
I am not sure if you are being facetious but the regulations are working that is why they should keep them. I also think they should expand this type of regulation to more things with guns. It sounds like research has shown this to be effective with silencers. It seems to reason it would be effective with all guns or certain types of guns or modification parts.

Facetious. I’m just trying to use gun nut logic.
 
1. Private gun sales are what he was discussing with his original point which is not addressed. But I agree current laws should be worked with and better enforced. So I agree with his final point but he missed a lot
2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_Square_shooting
Guess he didnt research that one much. I am guessing there are more since he missed a big recent one. His logic in general is just poor on this as well. H is using individual cases and not statistics to make his point seem stronger.
3. I agree with his critic of this point. We cant preemptively take away peoples guns if they have not been convicted of something. This would be abused. But it is a good example of the dangers of guns and why deaths decrease with less guns around. People generally act rashly and will reconsider later.
4. Again very poor logic and preying on recency bias to make his point seem stronger. Also building a silly straw mans argument with soda. Studies pretty convincing show that the more planning it takes the less likely it is to happen. This seems like a good suggestion and compromise from the original author. Who needs to buy more guns at once and isnt willing to wait?
5. Who did it might have been solved but not where the guns came from. That is part of solving the crime. Although I would not trust someone just basing it on his memory with no evidence to back it up. (like all of his points)
6.They do work. Politicians are opposed to them as are gun companies and lobbyist. Again he makes claims with no evidence. They could work and they would help in mass shootings and more importantly they would help a lot in gun deaths such as suicide and homicide. If police could turn off bad guys guns that would be effective. Even if the owner was the only one with control it would help and it would make it easier to track guns. There has been data on smart guns that is very promising. I would like to see his evidence of it not working.
7. He is focusing on mass shootings again even though that is a small part of gun deaths. This would have prevented at least 1 mass shooting I can think of off the top of my head so probably more. This would greatly reduce other gun deaths. He makes another claim with no evidence which is not true. There has been a lot of links to gun ownership and suicide. There is also evidence of more suicides in states with more guns, Australia suicide levels decreased by 70% with the ban of guns and lots and lots of more data. Its people like this spewing out garbage claims that make this debate more difficult because people believe him, and its harder to prove wrong later once people have been show false evidence.
8. He focuses on one part of the argument and runs with it making another crappy straw mans argument. But again he makes a claim with no proof that is unlikely to be true. Researching would be helpful. It makes him sound very ignorant to claim otherwise.

Overall a garbage piece presented here. Despite agreeing with a couple of his points he makes no attempt to actually argue with good points and just throws out crap and claims it as true. He mostly just creates strawman arguments and provides 0 data. This is the type of article and information going around that is very hurtful to everyone that reads it. This guy should be ashamed of this piece. There was plenty to critic with the original article but he did nothing to argue against it.

thank you for taking the time to resond. i disagree with you. but your input is apreciated
 
So I don't get it.

Why have any traffic signs or seat belts if we still have car accidents?
Why have any airport security if mean bad guys will ignore the laws and regulations?
Why have any law if 100 percent of the population doesn't obey them?

I'm just following gun addicts to the natural conclusion of their arguments.

If safety procedures don't prevent bad guys from doing bad things, if regulation doesn't work, and if laws are ineffective, why have any regulations, regulations, or laws in the first place?

If gun regulation is unconstitutional and more guns make us all safer, why can't I stock up on machine guns, bazookas, nerve gas, and nuclear weapons? After all, any regulation is an infringement on my freedom, right?

And the more weapons the safer we will all be? Right?


99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of legal gun owners never commited a gun crime. so let's punish them! take their right away from them!
 
99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of legal gun owners never commited a gun crime. so let's punish them! take their right away from them!

99.9999999 percent of drivers won’t ever be in a car accident. So let’s get rid of seat belts, speed limits, and traffic signals.
 
Now a story is developing. Huge development if true...

http://abcnews.go.com/US/investigat...s-shooting-chilling-details/story?id=50273390

Speaking this evening, Lombardo said that there is evidence that indicates Paddock, a 64-year-old resident of Mesquite, Nevada, planned to escape.

However, Lombardo did not provide any details on what the evidence was or why he believes that.

Lombardo added that there are indications Paddock had some kind of help.

More:

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-las-vegas-shooting-20171004-story.html

Thanks for posting. But really not much to either article.

Probably a callous thing to say but if I was this woman I would have never come back to the US. Between being out of town when it went down and the 100K wire - it just "looks bad". The longer authorities go without answers the more they'll get frustrated and the more likely they are to throw this woman under the bus as a form of closure.
 
Thanks for posting. But really not much to either article.

Probably a callous thing to say but if I was this woman I would have never come back to the US. Between being out of town when it went down and the 100K wire - it just "looks bad". The longer authorities go without answers the more they'll get frustrated and the more likely they are to throw this woman under the bus as a form of closure.

I don't know. I think the fact, if it is a fact, that he was not planning to die, does change the story somewhat, as does the belief that he was not acting alone. Investigators, for instance are now searching for a "mystery women", obviously not his girlfriend, seen with him in the days prior.

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/l...king-mystery-woman-seen-vegas-shooter-n807801

Receipts have also emerged showing he checked in earlier then originally reported, and a room service receipt showing 2 guests were listed on a food order that included 2 Pepsies. As well, it is known that some 45 minutes before the attack began, a woman was in the crowd harassing people and yelling "you're all going to die tonight". That woman, and a male companion, was thrown out of the venue. That may have just been a sheer coincidence, there is an interview in which a female concert goer described that incident.

https://hotair.com/archives/2017/10...strange-woman-vegas-concert-shooting-started/

Really chilling is the fact that one window was broken, apparently, because it gave a line of site to two aviation fuel tanks, which were hit by gunfire, as I posted earlier...
 
A.Lots of thing can make things more deadly but shouldn't be banned.
B.i don't have enough data to have an opinion on the legality of suppressors.
Part of why I wanted to discuss it.

Just made common sense to me that quieter might be preferable to louder if you are a shooter who wants to either get away or evade capture/detection as long as possible to take out as many people as possible.

I didn't think my line of thinking was unreasonable or unique or controversial or anything.

List of 10 reasons Boris would want a suppressor.

1. To kill people.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
 
A.Lots of thing can make things more deadly but shouldn't be banned.
B.i don't have enough data to have an opinion on the legality of suppressors.
Part of why I wanted to discuss it.

Just made common sense to me that quieter might be preferable to louder if you are a shooter who wants to either get away or evade capture/detection as long as possible to take out as many people as possible.

I didn't think my line of thinking was unreasonable or unique or controversial or anything.

Yeah, and since the sheriff now believes he did plan on escaping, with 50 pounds of explosives and 1600 rounds of ammo in his car, and since he planned this for so long and so meticulously, it does make one wonder why he did not also use something that might have helped him in that respect. Personally, I think people dropping all around was far more then enough to cause the stampede that ensued, even if people thought it was firecrackers momentarily. I'm not really convinced suppressors would have delayed realization and stampeding. Something like that happens fast once those in the area where people were first dropping begin to run, panic spreads very fast.
 
Yeah, and since the sheriff now believes he did plan on escaping, with 50 pounds of explosives and 1600 rounds of ammo in his car, and since he planned this for so long and so meticulously, it does make one wonder why he did not also use something that might have helped him in that respect. Personally, I think people dropping all around was far more then enough to cause the stampede that ensued, even if people thought it was firecrackers momentarily. I'm not really convinced suppressors would have delayed realization and stampeding. Something like that happens fast once those in the area where people were first dropping begin to run, panic spreads very fast.
Ya im not convinced a suppressor would have changed anything either. I was simply trying to have a discussion of whether there is a possibility that one could. I certainly think there are reasons to believe that it could have been even worse. Certainly not convinced of that possibility though.

Just seems to me that as a target/victim I would prefer to have the ability to hear a gun shooting at me rather than not hear it. And if I were a shooter I would prefer for my targets not to hear my gun if at all possible or even have it be harder to hear if I couldn't eliminate the sound completely. That's just me though.

Maybe the shooter made a mistake. Could happen I suppose.
 
Receipts have also emerged showing he checked in earlier then originally reported, and a room service receipt showing 2 guests were listed on a food order that included 2 Pepsies. As well, it is known that some 45 minutes before the attack began, a woman was in the crowd harassing people and yelling "you're all going to die tonight". That woman, and a male companion, was thrown out of the venue. That may have just been a sheer coincidence, there is an interview in which a female concert goer described that incident.

I read up on that - probably just a sad coincidence. I think that woman was just some random nut. Other eyewitnesses were saying she was doing other crazy things and screaming at people in the crowd for supposedly pushing her before she got tossed.
 
The way some here talk about guns, and gun lovers in general, kinda sound like addicts. As an addict, I know an addict when I see one. Just sayin.
 
I think I agree with [MENTION=3073]JustTheTip[/MENTION] on the silencer thing. From what research I can see very few crimes are committed with Silencers. The laws and regulations we have seem to be fairly effective. .

The laws we have now are fine, and are probably the reason this guy didn't have any suppressors. As far as research, people are using that as a reason to make these things much more accessible to the public, which is laughable. If nobody hears a shot and nobody gets caught for a murder, how in the hell is anyone ever going to put that into statistics?
 
Anyway, for those who still doubt that a suppressor could have made a difference, here is some video of when the shots first started firing. There is nothing graphic, but I'm sure some people would still rather not watch this, so don't watch it if you're easily disturbed. What it shows is that shots can be heard over the music, and no reaction at first. Then, in several areas, there are some stampedes, but many people in the same area don't react at all. People started running away from people who had been hit, but many didn't react, even with people running next to them.

It's not like people got hit and then everybody suddenly realized what was happening. Even hearing the shots and seeing a stampede, many people didn't react. A suppressor could have made it sound like something way off in the distance, and most people's brains wouldn't associate that sound with a gun in the immediate area. I encourage anyone with doubts to watch this video and then the one I posted earlier comparing an unsuppressed rifle to one with a suppressor.

EDIT: To be totally fair, I can understand why some people don't believe it would've had mattered. Some suppressors don't make a whole lot of difference, compared to the one in the first video I posted. Having said that, I'll amend my statements that a suppressor would've made a difference, and just say that in the right setup, it could have.

With as much planning as this guy put into this, I think he could've set himself up in an even more lethal position with the right combination of rifle and suppressor.



[video=youtube_share;nQJ2yIXrky8]https://youtu.be/nQJ2yIXrky8
 
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the left must be some special kind of stupid!


they have been calling trump hitler for over 2 years now! yet they want him to take their guns!


ahahhahahahaha
hahahaha\
hjahahahah
hahahaha
hahahaha

hahhaahha


that is some special kind of *******. wanting the guy you think is like hitler to take the guns!

this is record breaking special kind of stupid!


Eidt: i did not want to trigger people and get an infraction so i retracted the offensive R word
 
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/us/las-vegas-shooting.html

NRA just came out in support of restrictions on bump stocks.

I've been doing some research on other modifications as well. There is something called a binary trigger that will fire when the trigger is pulled and also when it is released. When you pull the trigger as fast as you can, it is very similar to automatic fire, although a little more herky jerky. There's also a crank similar to a gatlin gun.

I think it's gotten to the point that if somebody wanted to turn a semi-auto into full auto, they will figure out a modification.

I kinda wonder if the Vegas shooter wasn't using binary triggers as well as bump stocks, although I haven't read anything to that effect.
 
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Last I read is that he had 12 weapons equipped with bump stocks, so that should take care of any comments in this thread about barrels or suppressors overheating. Not an issue with that many weapons to switch out.
 
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