Lockout!!!

[r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t]

The incompetent NBAPA has utterly failed in its attempts to put pressure on ownership to cut a deal (hey, let's annoy everyone with tweets!). Simmons and the city of Memphis are stepping into the breach:

https://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7123705/locked-nhl-arms
https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/b...ring-suing-the-NBA-if-the-lock?urn=nba-wp9506

 

[TheItinerantSon]

the league is not losing money. stop it. it defies all logic. everyone admits that revenue is at a record-high. everyone admits that player salaries as a portion of that revenue has held constant over the last 11 years. What are the expenses that are rising so dramatically that the league is losing money? And why are franchise values appreciating at a healthy rate of return if the league has been losing money so consistently.

the league has not opened up its sales prospectuses not even for player inspection let alone for public consumption. the league is NOT losing money. they claim to have lost money for 11 straight years without having done anything about it? that defies belief. how did they stay open? how did they prop up a franchise in new orleans? how did they run the WNBA?????

in what other business do you become less profitable as you get more revenue?

 

[Nate505]

I never claimed the league was losing money. I claimed that franchises were, and I did not to intend to claim that all franchises were, but if it looks like that then I will make that clarification.

 

[TheItinerantSon]

ok well in that case...a losing team in a place like milwaukee or sacremento will never make money...those markets just aren't big enough. i'm not sure that lowering players takes to the break even level of the worst franchises is the best way to address this problem.


also, the league is claiming that the league as a whole has lost money for 11 straight years. which cannnot possibly be true.

 

[carolinajazz]

Results of todays meetings?

"Stern left after talks surpassed the seven-hour mark Wednesday to attend an owners' planning committee meeting at another hotel."

"However, little progress was made on minor issues according to a person who attended who requested anonymity because of Cohen's request to stay silent. The person also had no expectations regarding progress Wednesday on the major issues: the split of basketball-related income and the system in which that money is distributed to players."

EXCELLENT!!!

 

[My2Cents]

in what other business do you become less profitable as you get more revenue?

Are you serious? No disrespect intended, but are you really suggesting that expenses can't outpace increases in revenue? The average price of gas in 2005 (the last year the CBA was signed) was $2.30. Business expenses like travel, insurance, accounting services, attorneys fees, capital expenditures, and office supplies and equipment, especially expenses tied to the price of gas, are through the roof. I don't know, and neither do you, how much money the league is losing, but I do know that increased revenue does not always result in an increase in net income.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

There is an underlying race issue surrounding this lockout that few here care to admit. Yes, the players may not be handling this situation very well, but their concerns over treatment by the league and owners can't be ignored.

If you're going to pull the race card you'd better back it up. I see nothing racist about not being willing to pay the players such a huge percentage of the revenue that you can't balance the books.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

......you better believe there is an underlying race issue here!....one I've been trying to point out for months! Old school owners against the hip hop culture and "hopper" ball! The owners have been had over the past 10 years, paying these pathetic looking dummies all that money for all those years....with diminishing returns and a watered down product that has completely lost corporate middle class America...and now it's pay back time....BIG TIME!

Newsflash: You don't have to keep following this league you hate so much.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Couple the Celtics together with the fact that Stern has turned this league into a bunch of guys who you're more likely to see demonstrating "public displays of affection" than get into a fight and you get trickle down effect of Miami, Melo, DWill and soon to be CP3 & Mr. Schrute.

What do you mean by this? What has Stern done to promote PDA? This makes no sense to me.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Thank you for explicitly acknowledging that "hopper" is a coded race word. I will remember this in the future.

Well put.

 

[InGameStrategy]

the league is not losing money. stop it. it defies all logic. everyone admits that revenue is at a record-high. everyone admits that player salaries as a portion of that revenue has held constant over the last 11 years. What are the expenses that are rising so dramatically that the league is losing money? And why are franchise values appreciating at a healthy rate of return if the league has been losing money so consistently.

Other expenses, of course.

https://static8.businessinsider.com/image/4e1fa8d949e2ae0e64060000/nba-revenues-and-expenses.jpg

But you still don't get it (or like to beat a dead horse). It doesn't matter whether the NBA is profitable or not; if it is, then not by much, and it is not unreasonable for owners to want to boost their return on investment (ROI), especially when revenues are uncertain, some non-salary expenses continue to rise, and the other major sports unions receive a percentage far lower than 57%.

the league has not opened up its sales prospectuses not even for player inspection let alone for public consumption. the league is NOT losing money. they claim to have lost money for 11 straight years without having done anything about it? that defies belief. how did they stay open? how did they prop up a franchise in new orleans? how did they run the WNBA?????

They ran the WNBA at a loss; that's pretty intuitive. And they assumed the risk during this past contract, whereas the players did not. Although the owners were foolish to not rein in salary expenses, they now have the ability to do so during contract negotiation. Perfectly rational and reasonable.

Even after taking out every unreasonable expense, there are still several teams that are unprofitable. The attendance and other revenue simply isn't there--and that's just to get to profitability and positive cash flow. It's not unreasonable to demand the players to absorb some of this change in economic reality--just like any other company would do.

in what other business do you become less profitable as you get more revenue?

In businesses where costs are growing at a faster rate than revenue.

BTW, our beloved (and usually well-run) Jazz are one team that has been cited among the majority of teams operating at a loss.
https://bizofbasketball.com/index.p...-broken&catid=42:articles-a-opinion&Itemid=57

With more restrictions in place for big-spending franchises to rein in spending (and possibly with a hard (or less soft) cap, it is likely that Utah will be even less inclined to dip in luxury-tax territory. (Unfortunately, it might make things easier or harder to attract players to Utah. Could work both ways.)

 

[NUMBERICA]

Revenue sharing.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Thank you for explicitly acknowledging that "hopper" is a coded race word. I will remember this in the future.

So does that mean he gets banned starting five years ago if we were to retroactively apply his racist bull ****?

 

[shadler]

BTW, our beloved (and usually well-run) Jazz are one team that has been cited among the majority of teams operating at a loss.
https://bizofbasketball.com/index.p...-broken&catid=42:articles-a-opinion&Itemid=57
)

Good read and numbers on teams that have lost money.

 

[r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t]

Various local and state governments have spent hundreds of millions of dollars (or maybe even billions) building NBA arenas, presumably because of the economic benefits that NBA games provide in their communities. The NBA owners are now cancelling games and denying those benefits. They're all but flushing taxpayer money down the toilet. Those governments should be at least trying to intervene.

 

[jope]

Various local and state governments have spent hundreds of millions of dollars (or maybe even billions) building NBA arenas, presumably because of the economic benefits that NBA games provide in their communities. The NBA owners are now cancelling games and denying those benefits. They're all but flushing taxpayer money down the toilet. Those governments should be at least trying to intervene.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Isn't memphis threatening to sue the nba for that reason?

 

[green]

Various local and state governments have spent hundreds of millions of dollars (or maybe even billions) building NBA arenas, presumably because of the economic benefits that NBA games provide in their communities. The NBA owners are now cancelling games and denying those benefits. They're all but flushing taxpayer money down the toilet. Those governments should be at least trying to intervene.

LOL. That's all this world needs. More government intervention. SAVE US OBAMA!

 

[InGameStrategy]

Various local and state governments have spent hundreds of millions of dollars (or maybe even billions) building NBA arenas, presumably because of the economic benefits that NBA games provide in their communities. The NBA owners are now cancelling games and denying those benefits. They're all but flushing taxpayer money down the toilet. Those governments should be at least trying to intervene.

Wow--I didn't expect to agree with something that rustbucket writes.

It would be totally appropriate for, say, the governors or mayors of cities/states suffering from the NBA lockout to band together and approach the owners, NBA leadership, and/or the players and tell 'em to get a deal done. Given that the both the union and the NBA have agreed to stay hush-hush (at least through the mediation process) having some outside peer pressure--out in the public--would hopefully help the process along. Heck, they can approach both sides privately first if they want.

I'd suggest taking it to the national Congress, given that they've stuck their noses in sports before (e.g., drugs in baseball), but many of them would be reluctant to ruffle the feathers of (or support) the union--even one in which the average salaray is several million dollars.

 

[billyshelby]

Revenue sharing.

Enhanced revenue sharing does not fix the problems. And realistically, the players have to understand that the owners are going to get over on this deal. The owners will get a CBA that gets them in the black, and THEN they'll realign revenue sharing that gets them blacker (no racicisistical pun intended.)

I would hope the mediator is stressing to owners that estimated revenue sharing should be incorporated in the proposals. But as I said in another post, the players need to stop looking for fair and start looking for practical. They would have leverage if the majority of owners weren't prepared to take the losses of not playing. That's an unwinnable scenario.

 

[write4u]

Yes, the owners are a bunch of filthy rich one-percenters and I don't have any sympathy for them, but let's face it, professional athletes are most overpaid employees in existence. How can you be on their side? They need to get a deal done because it's hurting the 99 percent of us poor slobs.