Game Thread Nov 17, 2024 07:00PM MT: Utah Jazz @ LA Clippers

[Saint Cy of JFC]

What's not surprising is that Flip couldn't guard Zubac down low. He's not an NBA center.

What's absolutely terrible is that both Zubac and Bamba were able to guard Flip like he was Kessler. Those guys just chilled under the hoop while Flip was spinning like a top at the perimeter, looking for someone to hand the ball off to, scared to shoot. You can guess what that stuff does to our spacing.

Lue was pretty much the first coach this season who decided that his team isn't gonna respect Flip at all until he starts taking and making his shots. And there's gonna be a steady menu of this from now on.

As nice as it is to see Filipowski making good reads and passing the ball, he can't be this guy. His inability to shoot is a much bigger problem than his cheerleaders on this site are admitting, and, in hindsight, probably the biggest reason he dropped in the draft.

Brother he's a rookie. Of course he's going to get washed by veterans at times.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Brother he's a rookie. Of course he's going to get washed by veterans at times.

As I said, I don't care that he couldn't guard Zubac. That's expected.

What does give me pause is looking like Kessler at the perimeter, with nobody even near him. Can't turn those shots down

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

As I said, I don't care that he couldn't guard Zubac. That's expected.

What does give me pause is looking like Kessler at the perimeter, with nobody even near him. Can't turn those shots down

He's operating at the 3pt line as playmaking hub, not a shooter. You dont have to take every open 3 if you are getting other stuff out of your sets. He will be fine. Again, he's a freaking rookie. He probably just didnt know how to handle not being guarded and started to doubt himself. He's a rookie, it's very common. You arent going to get proven right by your doubt, just give it up.

 

[jazznik]

What's not surprising is that Flip couldn't guard Zubac down low. He's not an NBA center.

What's absolutely terrible is that both Zubac and Bamba were able to guard Flip like he was Kessler. Those guys just chilled under the hoop while Flip was spinning like a top at the perimeter, looking for someone to hand the ball off to, scared to shoot. You can guess what that stuff does to our spacing.

First of all, Bamba played against Filipowski for the grand total of 3 minutes. Second, Zubac defends close to the basket and avoids the perimeter against pretty much all teams: he is slow and knows that. Filipowski defended Zubac better than anyone else on the Jazz. And he was scoring per minute just slightly less than Zubac while playing in his 8th NBA game matched against the 9-year NBA veteran.

You picked up a very weird matchup to get worked up about, with Kyle clearly being the best young Jazz player that game.

 

[jazznik]

If Filipowski was matching the impact of Zubac (a top 15 center) in his very first NBA games he would be the runaway favorite for ROY.

 

[KqWIN]

Hardy says that he started Collier in the second half over Keyonte because of defensive effort. This feels like one of the first clear on court consequences that they have given Keyonte. It will be interesting to see how he responds.

Before this game Keyonte had just had one of his better 6 game stretches.

Probably the first sign of "accountability" shown Keyonte's way....but at the same time he still ended up with 33+ minutes and Sexton was the one who go the short end of the stick. Things are just different for Keyonte, he get's by far the most leeway out of any of the young players, but maybe not for long.

I'm glad Key's defense is at least on Hardy's mind because even though we focus on Key's offensive struggles, he's been one of the worst defenders in the league since he entered.

 

[KqWIN]

I'm so happy that Collier is back and healthy. There may be a time where his lack of finishing/shooting limits him, but he plays very hard and is also out there to play for his teammates. I can live with him being turnover prone for the moment. We need a guy like him to offset all the ballhogs/non ballhandlers on roster. He makes us much more watchable.

 

[TheGoldStandard]

I feel like they are wasting a lot of shots that could potentially be going to Brice (Juzang or fill in the name). Even if Clarkson does raise his value it won't be much..Maybe an expiring + protected SRP? They are losing games with JC so might as well give the minutes to the kids and see what they got moving forward.

The Jazz have done an excellent job showcasing why no other team should want him. Loose handles, poor decision making, poor defense and streaky shooting.

 

[jom2003]

I'm so happy that Collier is back and healthy. There may be a time where his lack of finishing/shooting limits him, but he plays very hard and is also out there to play for his teammates. I can live with him being turnover prone for the moment. We need a guy like him to offset all the ballhogs/non ballhandlers on roster. He makes us much more watchable.

Wanna watch more of Collier/Sexton just for the pure energy they bring onto the court

 

[underdog]

Hardy says that he started Collier in the second half over Keyonte because of defensive effort. This feels like one of the first clear on court consequences that they have given Keyonte. It will be interesting to see how he responds.

Before this game Keyonte had just had one of his better 6 game stretches.

Yeah, Collier was defending well last night. Had 8 assists, too, in 26 mins.

 

[framer]

I have worried if Hardy's green light and "tolerance for youth mistakes" was eternal for Keyonte, but obviously lately Key has been restricted to lower usage and now Hardy going out and throwing him under the bus for defensive effort are definitely signs that he is switching approach.

This is only possible because Collier has been overperforming.

 

[Shad]

We need more collier and keyonte off ball sample sizes. I'm glad hardy is swapping to someone when keyonte cries for calls and doesn't get back on defense. Can't stand it

 

[framer]

He's operating at the 3pt line as playmaking hub, not a shooter. You dont have to take every open 3 if you are getting other stuff out of your sets. He will be fine. Again, he's a freaking rookie. He probably just didnt know how to handle not being guarded and started to doubt himself. He's a rookie, it's very common. You arent going to get proven right by your doubt, just give it up.

He is obviously just running the sets the coaching staff is working with him on. If he starting saying "screw that, I'm going to freelance!" He'd likely get pulled.

 

[NUMBERICA]

What's not surprising is that Flip couldn't guard Zubac down low. He's not an NBA center.

What's absolutely terrible is that both Zubac and Bamba were able to guard Flip like he was Kessler. Those guys just chilled under the hoop while Flip was spinning like a top at the perimeter, looking for someone to hand the ball off to, scared to shoot. You can guess what that stuff does to our spacing.

Lue was pretty much the first coach this season who decided that his team isn't gonna respect Flip at all until he starts taking and making his shots. And there's gonna be a steady menu of this from now on.

As nice as it is to see Filipowski making good reads and passing the ball, he can't be this guy. His inability to shoot is a much bigger problem than his cheerleaders on this site are admitting, and, in hindsight, probably the biggest reason he dropped in the draft.

My god, shut the hell up. He’s 21, we got him with a garbage pick in a garbage draft, and he is one of the best rookies in the class. After a terrible shooting night that bent his season percentages meaningfully downward, he’s shooting right at the bar from 3 (33.3%) on significant volume.

But you’re right, all signs point to that he’s probably peaked.

 

[jazznik]

Collier had an interesting game: he was looking for his shot way less and really focused on passing and keeping everyone involved. I wonder if that's what the Jazz want him to do instead.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

He is obviously just running the sets the coaching staff is working with him on. If he starting saying "screw that, I'm going to freelance!" He'd likely get pulled.

He definitely is not doing that. He has pretty free reign to do what he wants.

 

[KqWIN]

Both Collier and Flip will have to answer questions about their shooting/general ability to put the ball in the basket as time goes on. That was my worry for the both of them during predraft. Flip has actually been exceptionally good inside the paint, so I'm interested to see how that holds up over time. But what's encouraging to me is that they both seem to have the baseline skill to play in the NBA and show good effort levels. I know that doesn't sound like a huge endorsement, but I'm not sure it's the case for some of the other young players. I believe in them as defenders and if they can make some improvements with their scoring/shooting it will have exponential effect on their games because they already have the playmaking.

Collier got too much hate for his defense in college. I thought he looked good on film and on paper and that seems to be true. I had worried about Flip as a C defensively, and that concern still exists, but he's probably good enough to be a defensive four. His defensive feet are ok on the perimeter and his defensive hands are good. I still think it would be a huge plus if he can develop more big man attributes, however.

 

[Tanktastic]

He is obviously just running the sets the coaching staff is working with him on.

The Jazz have sets? And are running them?

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

The Jazz have sets? And are running them?

Some of the best in teh NBA

 

[kabenac]

Collier turned 20 last month and he's playing pretty damn well. I'm excited to see how much better the rookies are by April.