I think that's the argument. And unfortunately I think it will catty weight.
Police Power and Racial Tensions in Ferguson, Missouri
- Thread starter HighlandHomie
- Start date
I think that's the argument. And unfortunately I think it will catty weight.
candrew
Well-Known Member
Ultimately no one knows except Wilson; but I don't believe for a second that Brown "went for" the cops gun. I think Wilson drew the gun first and then Brown grabbed for it. That would explain why the gun went off in the car while Wilson maintained possession of it.
Perhaps but this leads us into Zimmerman/Martin territory in that it's all speculation. Sure your scenario is plausible Candrew. But so is Brown going for his gun. Neither are known to be facts.
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
That's kind of a weird thing to say. Why is it hard to believe he went for the gun? He shouldn't have his hands anywhere near the cops gun in the first place. It doesn't matter if he's trying to stop the cop from pulling the gun or going for it. It's the same thing. Why is he even in a situation where he is that close to the cop and fighting with him in the first place?
Why is it so hard to believe that Michael Brown, who just committed strong arm robbery, would be trying to avoid arrest? Even if the cop doesn't know what just happened, Michael Brown DID know what just happened. He is probably assuming he is being shook down because of the robbery. Which would explain why he would do anything to escape. In his mind, he is going to jail for a long time.
And by the way. The cops story is leaking and it's saying that at first he was unaware of the robbery, but gets the call about what happened and at the time of the altercation he knew of the robbery then. If that's the case, then he has to assume the man is dangerous. And if you get punched in the face and he attempts to take your gun then you know he is.
candrew
Well-Known Member
Are you kidding me - there is a huge difference.
J
JAZZGASM
Guest
So you are a cop, and trying to subdue a perp. He lunges for your gun. Do you need to let him grab it before you shoot him?
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
So in your opinion. It's ok to try and stop a cop from pulling his gun? I don't get what you are saying. Elaborate please. I can't see any situation where it's a good idea, or you should be denying a cop from pulling his gun. Imo, that's a very bad idea, and is asking for trouble. And I'm quite sure that the law states you are not allowed to do that. Also, how does the cop know what his intentions are?
In the heat of the moment does the cop know that? If a cop draws his gun you don't fight with him for control of it.
If I was a cop that would make me think he was after the gun and my life was in danger.
After going back and rereading, I see that I wasn't clear at all. Dude, I am a fan of marijuana. I think it should be legal. I have zero problem with anyone that wants to use it. Unfortunately, it currently is a crime though, and unlike other ridiculous laws (J-walking for instance), it is highly prosecuted. You know the stats as well as I do. So, knowing that if you get caught you're probably in deep ****, I automatically think the kid is a moron and has little regard for the law. Do I think that marijuana, assuming he did the things that are being reported, had anything to do with the alleged attack on the officer? No, not really, but the fact that he willingly and blatantly committed at least two serious crimes (in the eyes of the law, and frankly, to a lot of people) crushes his credibility. My admittedly bad rape example was in reference to someone who posted that he could have smoked that weed at anytime and that it stays in the system for a good amount of time. I am strictly talking about credibility and this kids choices to break the law.
No, I don't think it should carry any weight, although it surely will.
Others have already commented with the same incredulity that I'm feeling, so I'll just save my comment. That being said, would you mind explaining to me how you come to your answer? I'm not trolling, I sincerely want to know if I've missed something huge.
Ya, they are spelled totally different. That's about it though.
Pretty much this. The only scenario I can think of goes back to OneBrows theory that the cop is a psycho, racist, sociopath who pulled up next to these guys and stated something insane like, "I'm going to kill you, ******, and your ****** friend too. Then I'm going to kill your ****** mom and your ****** family, and there's nothing you can do about it." and then started to pull out his gun to do just that. In that highly improbable scenario, I can see someone trying to stop the cop from pulling leather.
I would believe Obama has extra terrestrials living in the Whitehouse before I believed that particular scenario, but I suppose it could happen.
Going for the cops gun is 100% justification for using deadly force.
I think those defending the cop in this situation are doing a great job stating black and white factual information and I agree with most of it.
All you're missing is a **** load of context you can't even begin to fathom.
Your opinions are nice and all, but please remember that's all they are. Extremely uninformed, culturally biased, opinions.
My opinion? **** the police. Everyday.
All you're missing is a **** load of context you can't even begin to fathom.
Your opinions are nice and all, but please remember that's all they are. Extremely uninformed, culturally biased, opinions.
My opinion? **** the police. Everyday.
candrew
Well-Known Member
You're clueless
If Brown reached for the gun then Wilson is certainly within his right to use deadly force. That goes without saying - at least I thought it did. If "X" happened (we don't know what) which resulted in Brown and Wilson getting in a physical altercation and Wilson removed his gun from his holster, what would you do. Just let him shoot you?
Well, duh. Of course they are opinions, since nobody actually has all of the facts. There are people, like the dumb **** who made the thread, who don't care about facts, but for the most part, it sure seems like most people are being respectful and thoughtful. (As in, full of thought)
Since you've clearly got all the answers and evidence that we're missing out on, why not enlighten us instead of insulting our intelligence? Or are we too stupid to understand?
As for this:
I can't think of a bigger indicator of "Extremely uninformed, culturally biased, opinion" than a statement like that.
Dat NWA, doe.
For sure. I don't know ****. One of my good friends is a cop. Still, **** the police. Right in the ***.
Well, I don't want to use my experience because it is not the same as an actual police officer's experience or training and there's no way I'm going to be able to do this without sounding lame as hell...
When I was on my first deployment in the Navy I was assigned temporary duty to shipboard security. As shipboard security I was armed. I had to go through some training, although in my opinion the training was pretty micky-mouse. Anyway, one of the training sessions was "weapon retention" and it was all about not letting anyone, ever, under any circumstances, take your firearm or gain control of it in any way. As I was trained, someone attempting to take control of your weapon escalated the situation up what they called the ladder of force (aka the use of force continuum) to the highest level, lethal force.
That's what my statement is based on. Not sure if my statement sounds different to everyone else but to me it makes sense.
Not once did I claim to have any answers here. I have my opinion of course. I'm not any smarter than you here, actually thats not true, I'm definitely smarter than your dumb ***. But I digress.....
I really enjoy a bunch of white dudes from Utah (i know some of you are not, and I don't care anyway) spouting off about what a white cop should do when dealing with a black, unarmed kid. It's awesome, really awesome.
I read too much into your statement, which I do all the time. In context, I have no experience here so I defer to your experience.
How dare white guys have opinions. Or even talk about a case that involves anyone not white. Jerks
Now if you actually want to point out something not brought up or offer a different viewpoint then by all means. I'd like to hear it.
LogGrad98
Well-Known Member
Contributor
20-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
Just curious, whose opinion would be valid then? A black cop? Any black person? A white person from another state?
It seems to be that anyone who can think and does not have all the facts can have a valid opinion. In fact I would hope that lots of different groups are forming opinions and discussing them in an open way over this entire issue, be they black white asian or martian. No way does only one person or one ethnic group have all the best answers to this case or cases like it. We need open dialogue about it, not closed-minded rhetoric.