Questions About Unjust Police Conduct

[Gameface]

I'm curious. How are the State Police in Utah? In Jersey, they're generally speaking, excellent. Obviously there can be the occasional loose cannon but those are very few and far between and dudes are really effing good. They are para-military trained essentially and have high standards in most ways. So I'm curious how they are in Utah and compare to regular ol' municipality cops.

Maybe I don't know how it all works but I think we call out State Police here Sheriffs. The Sheriff's deputies are by far the best police to deal with. Since the Sheriff is elected he doesn't generally want his deputies going around strong arming his constituents. They generally are the easiest going least "hard-on" having police.

West Valley has the most aggressive, I think SLC is a mixed bag, but maybe they've gotten worse. I live in West Jordan and they have been decent when I've had to deal with them. We now have a Unified Police department that covers several cities, not sure what they're like. The Utah Highway Patrol are extortionists.

 

[♪alt13]

Maybe I don't know how it all works but I think we call out State Police here Sheriffs. The Sheriff's deputies are by far the best police to deal with. Since the Sheriff is elected he doesn't generally want his deputies going around strong arming his constituents. They generally are the easiest going least "hard-on" having police.

West Valley has the most aggressive, I think SLC is a mixed bag, but maybe they've gotten worse. I live in West Jordan and they have been decent when I've had to deal with them. We now have a Unified Police department that covers several cities, not sure what they're like. The Utah Highway Patrol are extortionists.

The only statewide police forces that I am aware of are the Highway Patrol and Parole officers. We have county Sherriffs. TBH, I prefer police chiefs that have to answer to a Mayor and City council to directly elected sherriffs who lack that oversight.

 

[Gameface]

The only statewide police forces that I am aware of are the Highway Patrol and Parole officers. We have county Sherriffs. TBH, I prefer police chiefs that have to answer to a Mayor and City council to directly elected sherriffs who lack that oversight.

You ever have to deal with the Sheriffs? They've always been the nicest cops I've ever dealt with.

 

[♪alt13]

You ever have to deal with the Sheriffs? They've always been the nicest cops I've ever dealt with.

A Utah County Sherriff and he was an *******.

I don't think being directly elected protects us from people who will abuse their position. It likely gives them a greater freedom to do so. Joe Arpaio(probably spelled wrong) Maricopa County AZ is a good example. He cost his county millions in litigation fees. Perhaps if he answered to the Mayor of PHX changes wold have been made if for no other reason than to avoid those litigation fees.

 

[Gameface]

A Utah County Sherriff and he was an *******.

I don't think being directly elected protects us from people who will abuse their position. It likely gives them a greater freedom to do so. Joe Arpaio(probably spelled wrong) Maricopa County AZ is a good example. He cost his county millions in litigation fees. Perhaps if he answered to the Mayor of PHX changes wold have been made if for no other reason than to avoid those litigation fees.

Okay, I'm just relaying my experiences.

 

[The Thriller]

Makes it even more interesting. The man they were illegally trying to draw blood from IS an Idaho police officer who also drives trucks. The Idaho Police Dept didn't even know about this before the nurse released this video and are now thanking her for standing up to the SLPD:

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireSt...lt-lake-nurse-accepts-chiefs-apology-49572069

An Idaho police department is thanking a Utah nurse for stopping a Salt Lake City officer from obtaining a blood sample from one of their reserve officers who was unconscious in a hospital.

Police in the eastern Idaho town of Rigby said Friday that William Gray was severely injured in a Utah crash in July when the semi-truck he was driving for work was hit by another car.

Rigby police said in a statement they didn't know until Thursday that the nurse was arrested after refusing to allow blood to be drawn from Gray.

The department thanked the nurse, Alex Wubbels, and hospital "for standing firm" and protecting the Gray's rights.

It says he is still hospitalized.

Pretty sad how the SLPD tried to sweep this under the rug quickly before even the Idaho PD could find out about it.

 

[colton]

Makes it even more interesting. The man they were illegally trying to draw blood from IS an Idaho police officer who also drives trucks. The Idaho Police Dept didn't even know about this before the nurse released this video and are now thanking her for standing up to the SLPD:

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireSt...lt-lake-nurse-accepts-chiefs-apology-49572069



Pretty sad how the SLPD tried to sweep this under the rug quickly before even the Idaho PD could find out about it.

I'm confused. I thought the guy they tried to draw the blood from had died. No?

 

[Gameface]

I'm confused. I thought the guy they tried to draw the blood from had died. No?

The person the police were chasing died in the accident. The person they tried to draw blood from was just an innocent truck driver (who was also a reserve police officer in Idaho) who was injured when the person fleeing the police crashed into him.

What I imagine was going on was that the police feared they would be found liable for the injuries to the truck driver because they engaged in a dangerous high-speed chase. But if they could show that the truck driver smoked pot (at some point in the last month) they could say he contributed to the accident because he was impaired. Obviously if they found something like cocaine, opioids (like heroin or pain pills), or meth, stuff that would have been consumed within 72hrs, then boom, jackpot. If he had alcohol in his system then home run.

They were just trying to protect themselves from liability by fishing for something in his blood. He was 100% innocent.

 

[Cappy_Smurf]

A Utah County Sherriff and he was an *******.

I don't think being directly elected protects us from people who will abuse their position. It likely gives them a greater freedom to do so. Joe Arpaio(probably spelled wrong) Maricopa County AZ is a good example. He cost his county millions in litigation fees. Perhaps if he answered to the Mayor of PHX changes wold have been made if for no other reason than to avoid those litigation fees.

I grew up in Talorsville and had many experiences with the police from 16 to my early twenties. I completely agree with BP that dealing with sheriffs is much preferable to police or even HWP. I don't think it has anything to do with being elected, though. Just a different philosophy in what they are providing to the community. Sheriffs are much more likely to let you off with a warning, regardless of what you're busted for. They don't have quotas like the HWP for writing tickets.

Anyway, don't know if that's the case everywhere, but it was in SLC during the 80s/early 90s.

 

[fishonjazz]

Are police not supposed to pursue criminals in high speed chases? That seems to be what I'm getting from a few of the posts in this thread.

If this is the case then it would seem easy to get away from police. Just drive fast and the cops should give up?

 

[LogGrad98]

Are police not supposed to pursue criminals in high speed chases? That seems to be what I'm getting from a few of the posts in this thread.

If this is the case then it would seem easy to get away from police. Just drive fast and the cops should give up?

I think this is a difficult balancing act. On the one hand they do cause collateral damage in high-speed cases a fairly high percentage of the time (can't remember exactly, but I read somewhere it was like 40% of the time some damage or injuries occur) but at the same time they have to take your point into account. If a perpetrator knows they will not, due to policy or whatever, engage in a high-speed pursuit then they just have to take off and they will not be caught the majority of the time. As it is a decent percentage actually are not apprehended if they run, but if they make the rule that police are not allowed to give chase that percentage will go up a lot.

Here is something about people who run and how often they get away.

http://www.vocativ.com/underworld/crime/car-chase-video/

Suspects in police chases get away more than 35 percent of the time, according to a study by the International Association of Chiefs of Police. But you wouldn’t think it. Over a 36-hour period on Monday and Tuesday, which saw four high-speed police chases in counties across the U.S., precisely zero chase suspects eluded the police.

The study, which looked at law enforcement agencies in several states, found that suspects outrun the police in 17.9 percent of chases. In the remaining 17.6-percent of instances where the suspect gets away, it’s because an officer or a supervisor suspends the chase.

The study also found that 35.7 percent of police chases come to an end when the suspect stops on his or her own. In other cases they crash of their own volition. In other cases the police call off the chase. Direct intervention from law enforcement only ended 6 percent of pursuits. The most common method police use to end a pursuit, the report shows, is by popping the suspect’s tires with tools like spike strips.

 

[colton]

The person the police were chasing died in the accident. The person they tried to draw blood from was just an innocent truck driver (who was also a reserve police officer in Idaho) who was injured when the person fleeing the police crashed into him.

Thanks. I thought they had both died in the accident for some reason.

 

[JazzGal]

I would think the crime involved would contribute to the decision to pursue. If they are chasing someone who has violated probation/parole, shoplifting, drug crimes, etc., it doesn't seem worth the risk to the public to continue a chase. They will likely be able to find them later. But if they are pursuing someone who committed a serious crime, or is armed and a real threat, by all means the chase should continue.

 

[Cappy_Smurf]

Are police not supposed to pursue criminals in high speed chases? That seems to be what I'm getting from a few of the posts in this thread.

If this is the case then it would seem easy to get away from police. Just drive fast and the cops should give up?

Most police agencies have adopted very restrictive policies for high speed chases. They will still chase certain people they consider to be a risk, such as a murder suspect, but otherwise data has shown that a lot of people run for stupid reasons, and the chase itself presents more of a risk than letting someone go and trying to track them down later by their plates.

 

[fishonjazz]

Most police agencies have adopted very restrictive policies for high speed chases. They will still chase certain people they consider to be a risk, such as a murder suspect, but otherwise data has shown that a lot of people run for stupid reasons, and the chase itself presents more of a risk than letting someone go and trying to track them down later by their plates.

So people who steal cars should always run. Plates won't help in catching them later.

 

[Rubashov]

Drove past an accident a few months ago, 20 year old on his way to work killed by a gang of armed robbers fleeing a crime scene. Looked like a small plane crash the debris was everywhere, cops caught the guys that did it, they should be charged with murder.

 

[FalseFlagg K]

Drove past an accident a few months ago, 20 year old on his way to work killed by a gang of armed robbers fleeing a crime scene. Looked like a small plane crash the debris was everywhere, cops caught the guys that did it, they should be charged with murder.

they'll no doubt get a slap on the wrist, suspended sentence and maybe even some tickets to the granny from some do-gooder magistrate who will reassure them that it probably wasn't their fault because getting chased by the police all the time has caused them a terrible case of PTSD

 

[Rubashov]

they'll no doubt get a slap on the wrist, suspended sentence and maybe even some tickets to the granny from some do-gooder magistrate who will reassure them that it probably wasn't their fault because getting chased by the police all the time has caused them a terrible case of PTSD

Social workers!!!! That's what these poor young criminals need! But if you're a taxpayer and you J walk you'll cop a 260 buck fine.

 

[FalseFlagg K]

or go 3 km over the speed limit.

 

[Rubashov]

or go 3 km over the speed limit.

They brought the bloke into work who smashed windows and attacked the cops in fed square yesterday cause he said he smokes pot and has schizophrenia, there was nothing wrong with him, he was just a prick. 20 years ago they would have charged him and given him a hiding.