Racism and privilege

[Stoked]

I think that sometimes calling attention to the subtle "biases" in a person's language is counterproductive as it can make that person feel very self-conscious and resentful that they can't make a simple statement without others reacting to it in a way that had nothing to do with the speaker's intent when making the statement

yes, it may make that person think twice before they say something that you might find offensive - - or it can make them just keep their mouth shut and decide they don't want to talk to you at all. My personal choice ( and yes, this is a choice) would be to say "happy holidays" and take my chances that you aren't overly offended that I didn't say "Merry Christmas" - - although, as it gets to be within a day or two of Christmas, I just might say "merry christmas" - again, with the hope that you won't be overly offended.

by the way, when is Festivus this year?

I say Merry Christmas as that is what I am celebrating. If someone told me Happy Kwanza or Happy Ramaddan (spelling?) I would be just fine with that. It is a sign from that person that they wish good things for me. I would not be offended at all.

 

[One Brow]

Gave you a list. If you choose to ignore it that is on you.

I'm not choosing to ignore it, I'm asking you for details.

I know you are used to calling people things and not getting called out on it. The whole board knows that.

I call statements made by people things. I don't call people things, because all people say things that deserve to be called things, including me. So, I don't get called out for what I don't do.

Furthermore, as I am a white male and the source of the worlds ills, according to you in your numerous posts, why should you care what I think?

1) I haven't made that statement
2) Change is easier when you have privilege

I'm done watching you try and pass some deep seated guilt you have onto everyone else.

I'm sure this rationalization makes you more comfortable.

If you feel bad and that you have work to do then great. Go do so but stop passing that on to others.

Why would I feel bad about having work to do? Having work to do is the human condition.

 

[One Brow]

I say Merry Christmas as that is what I am celebrating.

So, who's tried to stop you?

 

[moevillini]

Dear One Brow - I hope you think of me as a friend (of sorts at least) but sometimes you really do make a caricature of yourself. The two posts above are the latest examples.


Moe


I guess it's productive work!

 

[♪alt13]

I grew up in Iowa and St. Louis. I became a fan watching the Jazz on TV in the 1990s.

Considering all the people on here who talk about using their guns to kill intruders in the various threads, I find it amusing that you think other parts of the country show more fear. Most people in most places are afraid.

This is what I am talking about.(different perspective) I am not afraid of my neighbors or they're guns. I am not afraid of someone breaking into my house, but if someone did(and they did not leave after being warned) I would shoot them in the face with my gun.

PS I have had someone break into my home at night. I did not have to shoot them because they turned tail and ran.

 

[♪alt13]

I say Merry Christmas as that is what I am celebrating. If someone told me Happy Kwanza or Happy Ramaddan (spelling?) I would be just fine with that. It is a sign from that person that they wish good things for me. I would not be offended at all.

I say bah humbug, cause I'm an ornery jerk.

 

[One Brow]

Dear One Brow - I hope you think of me as a friend (of sorts at least) but sometimes you really do make a caricature of yourself. The two posts above are the latest examples.

Your probably right, and I probably just can't see it. Thank you for pointing it out to me.

How can you have a serious conversation with someone whose claiming that people are trying to to them from saying "Christmas" or "terrorist"? I should try ot keep in mind that I;m easy to troll.

 

[One Brow]

This is what I am talking about.(different perspective) I am not afraid of my neighbors or they're guns. I am not afraid of someone breaking into my house, but if someone did(and they did not leave after being warned) I would shoot them in the face with my gun.

PS I have had someone break into my home at night. I did not have to shoot them because they turned tail and ran.

I rarely lock the door at night, but if I'm not the last person upstairs, someone else probably will.

I was mugged when I was 20, and still have a small scar on my head from the crowbar. I never felt the need for a gun, before or after.

 

[Stoked]

Your probably right, and I probably just can't see it. Thank you for pointing it out to me.

How can you have a serious conversation with someone whose claiming that people are trying to to them from saying "Christmas" or "terrorist"? I should try ot keep in mind that I;m easy to troll.

If you want to deny that there is a very strong, public push to make those words inappropriate then be my guest. I guess you have the privilege of doing so.

Yes I have actually had people try to correct and/or reprimand me for saying Merry Christmas.

 

[Stoked]

I rarely lock the door at night, but if I'm not the last person upstairs, someone else probably will.

I was mugged when I was 20, and still have a small scar on my head from the crowbar. I never felt the need for a gun, before or after.

For me it is about being prepared on a reasonable level. I pray to God that I am never in the situation where I would need to protect my family in a violent encounter, let alone use a firearm. But I want to be prepared in case I do. Fear is no part of it. Having a reasonable amount of preparedness and prevention goes a long way in preventing any potential violent or even uncomfortable situation. One of the lessons I have learned in life.

 

[One Brow]

If you want to deny that there is a very strong, public push to make those words inappropriate then be my guest. I guess you have the privilege of doing so.

Can you show me a few articles? Links? I've missed them.

Hint: noting that some retail chains are using "Happy Holidays' doesn't count, because that doesn't limit what you can say.

Yes I have actually had people try to correct and/or reprimand me for saying Merry Christmas.

They don't think you should say it to anyone? Or they pointed out that they don't celebrate Christmas? If the latter, isn't it a matter of simple politeness to wish them well regarding whatever holiday they do celebrate, if any?

 

[One Brow]

For me it is about being prepared on a reasonable level. I pray to God that I am never in the situation where I would need to protect my family in a violent encounter, let alone use a firearm. But I want to be prepared in case I do. Fear is no part of it. Having a reasonable amount of preparedness and prevention goes a long way in preventing any potential violent or even uncomfortable situation. One of the lessons I have learned in life.

Why would you prepare for some negative event you don't fear? Why invest any time or money unless you're trying to avoid negative consequences?

 

[Stoked]

Can you show me a few articles? Links? I've missed them.

They don't think you should say it to anyone? Or they pointed out that they don't celebrate Christmas? If the latter, isn't it a matter of simple politeness to wish them well regarding whatever holiday they do celebrate, if any?

hahahaha. Jesus...

It is also simple politeness for me to wish them a merry christmas, easter, thanksgiving, 4th of july...

 

[One Brow]

hahahaha. Jesus...

No, One Brow, although we are often confused.

It is also simple politeness for me to wish them a merry christmas, easter, thanksgiving, 4th of july...

So, you insisting on wishing them a joyous celebration of a holiday they have informed you they don't celebrate is your idea of politeness?

Edit: really, please offer one article where people are trying to get private citizens to stop using "Christmas". Just one.

 

[One Brow]

I guess, as usual, we can agree to disagree. You can keep worrying about always being a privileged white racist with no means or hope of ever changing, and I will continue playing basketball and having barbecues with my black friends and talking about issues that matter to them (and me) and do my best with my permanently flawed racial judgement to be a little less racist each day.

Me previous response was probably a little more flippant than it should have been. How often at these barbecues have you asked you friends what some of the small, frequent frustrations they face from being black are, if they have noticed anything from you, and what you might be able to do to make things better? What were some of the things they've said, and what did you do about them?

 

[One Brow]

I'm done watching you try and pass some deep seated guilt you have onto everyone else.

While I was dismissive of this, I didn't really explain why. So, I'll do that now, just to be clear.

I regularly get job offers for about 33% more (or even higher) than I currently make. A big part of this is because I have a white name, a white voice on the phone (lived in a small Iowa city until I was 9), and degrees from two mostly white universities. So, I'm basically working for 75% (or less) of my worth, in a sense donating the other 25% by performing this job (working for a non-profit company that owns several local health care clinics and a hospital, all of whom have a primary mission of serving the very poor).

So, while I have no problem acknowledging that, like any other human, I'm a product of a racist culture and have internalized its racist narrative, any "white guilt" I might have experienced would have been sated. Any notion of "white guilt" you are reading in my words is coming from you.

 

[One Brow]

https://gawker.com/teaching-while-black-and-blue-1473659925

 

[♪alt13]

While I was dismissive of this, I didn't really explain why. So, I'll do that now, just to be clear.

I regularly get job offers for about 33% more (or even higher) than I currently make. A big part of this is because I have a white name, a white voice on the phone (lived in a small Iowa city until I was 9), and degrees from two mostly white universities. So, I'm basically working for 75% (or less) of my worth, in a sense donating the other 25% by performing this job (working for a non-profit company that owns several local health care clinics and a hospital, all of whom have a primary mission of serving the very poor).

So, while I have no problem acknowledging that, like any other human, I'm a product of a racist culture and have internalized its racist narrative, any "white guilt" I might have experienced would have been sated. Any notion of "white guilt" you are reading in my words is coming from you.

So, are you white or not?

 

[One Brow]

So, are you white or not?

What effect would either answer have on your interpretation of my posts?

 

[Stoked]

What effect would either answer have on your interpretation of my posts?

Well since you have said that a white person cannot understand or speak for a non white on racism...if you are not white it means you cannot speak for or understand a white person on racism.

I am pretty certain I know this answer.