Roster Building From Here - FA and Summer of 2023

[NUMBERICA]

This brings me no joy... but... @KqWIN is right... we need to trade for Immanuel Quickley.

His on/off diff over his career is bonkers. He's been ranked like 35th, 3rd, and 21st. His numbers as a starter are bonkers. He likely can be extended this offseason for about 4/80M before his raw stats go crazy as a full-time starter. Knicks likely won't want to keep him as a backup forever and we can offer another pick they can use for their eventual star trade.

I would hope to get him for just one of our premium picks... but I'd also consider taking Fournier's 1 year left as well too. Hopefully would not require more than that... but if there is a little more we should consider it. IQ is the answer at pg.

Well I also think there is value in punting on the capspace this offseason if the preferred candidates can't be had, so if taking on Fournier means sending less assets then great. Perfect, really.

 

[KqWIN]

This brings me no joy... but... @KqWIN is right... we need to trade for Immanuel Quickley.

His on/off diff over his career is bonkers. He's been ranked like 35th, 3rd, and 21st. His numbers as a starter are bonkers. He likely can be extended this offseason for about 4/80M before his raw stats go crazy as a full-time starter. Knicks likely won't want to keep him as a backup forever and we can offer another pick they can use for their eventual star trade.

I would hope to get him for just one of our premium picks... but I'd also consider taking Fournier's 1 year left as well too. Hopefully would not require more than that... but if there is a little more we should consider it. IQ is the answer at pg.

He's having a crappy playoff series, so maybe that lessens his momentum, but I still think he gets way more than 4/$80. If that's all the Knicks are offering I'm definitely tampering and telling his agent the Jazz would give him more. We're going to need Quickley to want out, but he has good reason to if he ever wants to be a starter.

Fournier + Quickley for Sexton is a good salary match. Sexton is liked by NYK and theoretically is a good cost controlled replacement for IQ. I don't know how many picks on top of that it would take, but I think we're getting an all star if we get it done.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think IQ is just kind of an ok passer though, right?

He is efficient and defends well, but I'm not sure if he helps with our need for passing/play making.

As a starter he averaged 5 assists and 1 turnover... its a 38 minute average number of minutes played so slightly goosed up... but I would expect 5-6 assists, but low turnover and good efficiency over medium/high volume. Solid defense as well. I wouldn't be surprised if he takes a step forward playing under Hardy in a more featured role. We'd still have some needs for passing on the wing though.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

He's having a crappy playoff series, so maybe that lessens his momentum, but I still think he gets way more than 4/$80. If that's all the Knicks are offering I'm definitely tampering and telling his agent the Jazz would give him more. We're going to need Quickley to want out, but he has good reason to if he ever wants to be a starter.

Fournier + Quickley for Sexton is a good salary match. Sexton is liked by NYK and theoretically is a good cost controlled replacement for IQ. I don't know how many picks on top of that it would take, but I think we're getting an all star if we get it done.

Anywhere in the 80-100M range is fair... Since he is backing up Brunson I think its pretty easy to make the case he should get less... also hasn't established himself as a full-time starter yet. In general extensions a year early will favor the team... so I would think the scale would slide more towards the 80M number.

I think part of the motivation for them would be to clear the salary decks a bit but I wouldn't be opposed to putting Sexton in there. They could have cap space in 2024.. which was part of my thought process.

 

[KqWIN]

Is passing a huge need for us? We were great offensively whenever we tried and it did not matter who was playing PG for the Jazz. They all did well despite their difference. We need some more offensive firepower off the dribble, but every team does. The defense got better when Kessler took over, but perimeter/team defense is still the biggest issue with the team.

I'd also say that Quickley is a pretty good PnR passer. He spends a lot of time off the ball, so while his assist numbers are not anything to write home about I think they undersell his ability as a lead ball handler.

 

[KqWIN]

Anywhere in the 80-100M range is fair... Since he is backing up Brunson I think its pretty easy to make the case he should get less... also hasn't established himself as a full-time starter yet. In general extensions a year early will favor the team... so I would think the scale would slide more towards the 80M number.

I think part of the motivation for them would be to clear the salary decks a bit but I wouldn't be opposed to putting Sexton in there. They could have cap space in 2024.. which was part of my thought process.

That is a lot to pay a backup and especially one without a path to starting, but I think there will be plenty of teams who want him as a starter and would be willing to pay him more. Maybe I have blinders on because I love him, but any team without a solid solution at PG should be looking to break the bank for him. I really do think he has a great incentive to move on because he can't really increase his value an further on the Knicks. My hope is that they try negotiate, it fails, and then the trade request comes in.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Is passing a huge need for us? We were great offensively whenever we tried and it did not matter who was playing PG for the Jazz. They all did well despite their difference. We need some more offensive firepower off the dribble, but every team does. The defense got better when Kessler took over, but perimeter/team defense is still the biggest issue with the team.

I'd also say that Quickley is a pretty good PnR passer. He spends a lot of time off the ball, so while his assist numbers are not anything to write home about I think they undersell his ability as a lead ball handler.

I think so... moving on from Mike and KO (at some point). I think we need some good ball movers. JC is not a great passer but he creates well and opens up some passing.

 

[fishonjazz]

This brings me no joy... but... @KqWIN is right... we need to trade for Immanuel Quickley.

His on/off diff over his career is bonkers. He's been ranked like 35th, 3rd, and 21st. His numbers as a starter are bonkers. He likely can be extended this offseason for about 4/80M before his raw stats go crazy as a full-time starter. Knicks likely won't want to keep him as a backup forever and we can offer another pick they can use for their eventual star trade.

I would hope to get him for just one of our premium picks... but I'd also consider taking Fournier's 1 year left as well too. Hopefully would not require more than that... but if there is a little more we should consider it. IQ is the answer at pg.

Agreed. Throw in another first. (the lakers one) We have a million of them.

 

[KqWIN]

I think so... moving on from Mike and KO (at some point). I think we need some good ball movers. JC is not a great passer but he creates well and opens up some passing.

Eh, I don't think moving on from Mike really changes things. I think you can always improve here and this team is no exception, but not something that would make me pass on Quickley and certainly not a bigger concern than the defense. I would not fixate on getting a passing PG, more important to get good players.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

That is a lot to pay a backup and especially one without a path to starting, but I think there will be plenty of teams who want him as a starter and would be willing to pay him more. Maybe I have blinders on because I love him, but any team without a solid solution at PG should be looking to break the bank for him. I really do think he has a great incentive to move on because he can't really increase his value an further on the Knicks. My hope is that they try negotiate, it fails, and then the trade request comes in.

I think they are very asset focused so if they think a Cavs or Wolves or Lakers pick has more value in a star trade than IQ on a $90m/4 year deal... and it opens up some avenues for them to have cap space then I think the negotiation is less important. There might be some teams that give more but I think the quality of our draft assets would leave us at a big advantage.

 

[fishonjazz]

Is passing a huge need for us? We were great offensively whenever we tried and it did not matter who was playing PG for the Jazz. They all did well despite their difference. We need some more offensive firepower off the dribble, but every team does. The defense got better when Kessler took over, but perimeter/team defense is still the biggest issue with the team.

I'd also say that Quickley is a pretty good PnR passer. He spends a lot of time off the ball, so while his assist numbers are not anything to write home about I think they undersell his ability as a lead ball handler.

Ya im not too worried about our offense. I think we were like a top 3 offense for the season.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Eh, I don't think moving on from Mike really changes things. I think you can always improve here and this team is no exception, but not something that would make me pass on Quickley and certainly not a bigger concern than the defense. I would not fixate on getting a passing PG, more important to get good players.

Oh... I didn't mean it as a knock on IQ. I think he would help out... I still think it would be a need for us to consider with the other starters and bench guys as we fill out the roster. I think IQ's passing would be a benefit to acquiring him. Like if we have IQ, Ochai, Lauri, and Walker... I may not want DFS as the SF. I would look to add some passing at SG/SF to supplement for what we lack.

 

[SoberasHotRod]

As a starter he averaged 5 assists and 1 turnover... its a 38 minute average number of minutes played so slightly goosed up... but I would expect 5-6 assists, but low turnover and good efficiency over medium/high volume. Solid defense as well. I wouldn't be surprised if he takes a step forward playing under Hardy in a more featured role. We'd still have some needs for passing on the wing though.

I would be ok with IQ, but mostly because none of the other free agent guards are that interesting.

In my heart I really believe Cason is going to be our long term answer, although in my head I know it would be pretty dumb to rely on a rookie

 

[SoberasHotRod]

Eh, I don't think moving on from Mike really changes things. I think you can always improve here and this team is no exception, but not something that would make me pass on Quickley and certainly not a bigger concern than the defense. I would not fixate on getting a passing PG, more important to get good players.

We went from a top 5 offense pre trade deadline to a bottom 5 offense post trade deadline. I understand this wasn't all because of moving Mike, but a lot of it was, in my opinion.

Currently our best passers, are THT and KO. I don't think I really see either of them in our future.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

We went from a top 5 offense pre trade deadline to a bottom 5 offense post trade deadline. I understand this wasn't all because of moving Mike, but a lot of it was, in my opinion.

Currently our best passers, are THT and KO. I don't think I really see either of them in our future.

Dunn is better than THT but the point still stands.

 

[Jingled]

Is passing a huge need for us? We were great offensively whenever we tried and it did not matter who was playing PG for the Jazz. They all did well despite their difference. We need some more offensive firepower off the dribble, but every team does. The defense got better when Kessler took over, but perimeter/team defense is still the biggest issue with the team.

I'd also say that Quickley is a pretty good PnR passer. He spends a lot of time off the ball, so while his assist numbers are not anything to write home about I think they undersell his ability as a lead ball handler.

I think it's important if we're going to utilize Lauri as much as possible and play to his strengths. His efficiency dipped the last couple months of the season after Mike was gone. He's not an isolation guy, so I think it's important to have a really good point guard to set him up.

 

[KqWIN]

We went from a top 5 offense pre trade deadline to a bottom 5 offense post trade deadline. I understand this wasn't all because of moving Mike, but a lot of it was, in my opinion.

Currently our best passers, are THT and KO. I don't think I really see either of them in our future.

Agree to disagree. The offense dropped off for obvious reasons besides Mike, and when Mike was still on the team the starters performed the same when Sexton played PG.

 

[KqWIN]

I think it's important if we're going to utilize Lauri as much as possible and play to his strengths. His efficiency dipped the last couple months of the season after Mike was gone. He's not an isolation guy, so I think it's important to have a really good point guard to set him up.

I think what's more important than having a "pass first PG" is a guy who can break down the defense. The quality of passer doesn't mean much if the ball handler isn't able to break down the defense and bring them into rotation. Even if one PG is a better passer than the other, it does not mean it will lead to less isolation for Lauri.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Oh... I didn't mean it as a knock on IQ. I think he would help out... I still think it would be a need for us to consider with the other starters and bench guys as we fill out the roster. I think IQ's passing would be a benefit to acquiring him. Like if we have IQ, Ochai, Lauri, and Walker... I may not want DFS as the SF. I would look to add some passing at SG/SF to supplement for what we lack.

Honestly, given how we don’t have great playmakers to build with at the moment, that makes Ochai even more meh to me in the context of the build. Just not a lot of dimensionality to his game. That is just dandy if you’re set with star-power, but we ain’t that.

*ducks*

 

[NUMBERICA]

I think so... moving on from Mike and KO (at some point). I think we need some good ball movers. JC is not a great passer but he creates well and opens up some passing.

I think KO’s value in helping to run the offense is overlooked.