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The Honesty of Transgender Identity

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Slander Law and Legal Definition
Slander is the oral communication of false statements that are harmful to a person's reputation. If the statements are proven to be true, it is a complete defense to a charge of slander. Oral opinions that don't contain statements of fact don't constitute slander. Slander is an act of communication that causes someone to be shamed, ridiculed, held in contempt, lowered in the estimation of the community, or to lose employment status or earnings or otherwise suffer a damaged reputation. Slander is a subcategory of defamation.

The basic elements of a claim of slander include;

  1. a defamatory statement;
  2. published to third parties; and
  3. which the speaker or publisher knew or should have known was false.
Slander is primarily covered under state law, but is subject to First Amendment guarantees of free speech. The scope of constitutional protection extends to statements of opinion on matters of public concern that do not contain or imply a provable factual assertion. If the slander unjustly accused you of a crime or reflected on your profession, the court or jury can assess the damages. For other types of slander you generally must prove some actual damage to be able to recover.

Slander of title is a common law tort involving a disparaging remark regarding ownership of property. It affects the owner's ability to transfer the property, resulting in a monetary loss.
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Slander requires that you actually suffered harm based on something someone said about that knew was false or should have known was false. If the statement is true, then it cannot be slander.

That's why when Alex Jones says the parents of kids killed in the Sandy Hook shooting are crisis actors he could possibly be committing slander. It has to be proven that he should know or does know that's not true. If he has any evidence at all that suggests that it is true he could never be successfully sued for slander. But if he was presented with evidence that demonstrates without question that what he's saying is false and he continues to say it, then it becomes much easier to sue him for slander.
 
You could use it that way, but I'm using it to describe an actual civil offense that Alex Jones has committed. I believe that if layers for those parents presented Alex Jones with proof that they were actually parents of children of kids killed in Sandy Hook, and then the lawyers presented these hosting sites with the evidence and proof that Alex Jones was presented with the same evidence, then that would essentially force their hand to ban him.
 
There is a difference between free speech/freedom of the press and a multinational media company handing a nut job snake oil salesman a ticket to legitimacy. If anything google,Fb, etc should be ashamed by their naivete. They should be ashamed of their arrogance. They should have consulted with old media behemoths long before now to try to understand editorial control so that they could adapt best practices to their model.

IMV they, in their ignorance, thought that it had little to no value in the new media landscape. They have fed a series of plagues by refusing to wash their hands. Now that they can clearly see the consequences of their actions not only should they be washing their hands but getting a vaccination or 2. The days of believing that they are a just a platform or that they have little ethical responsibility for the content they distribute are over.

Put your big boy pants on youtube, you're a global institution now. Act like it
 
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Events like the Alex Jones slandering have major impact on individuals and their family network. They should not be tolerated since A.)They do harm to the family and B) over the long haul set a precedence on what behavior is tolerated and which isn't.

The latter concern is the major reason why I take issue with people (INCLUDING a major news network in NYTIMES) excusing Sarah Jeong's behavior. While the event doesn't have any major noticeable effects in the present, over time when society continues to be lenient of that type of behavior it moves the line the farther and farther. People see that type of behavior excused or even condoned including by her employer (who plays a big role on a lot of individuals views of societal issues in this country) and it gets comfortable. Not okay. It's a bigger deal than some people realize.

I also dislike hypocrites.
 
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The pendulum has swung so far the opposite way that now people are forced to ignore facts and common sense. I really don’t care what gender people “identify” as, but I don’t think we can ignore biology. Isn’t it useful for other people to be able to identify you? If you need to identify a body, or you need to locate an individual, isn’t it useful to be able to identify what you’re looking for?
I think the video on the front page says a lot. The fact that college students don’t have the guts to say, you are not a tall Chinese women is scary to me.
I heard about an individual in the hospital who was complaining about abdominal pain. The nurses were dumbfounded because this man had symptoms of being pregnant. Of course nobody can question this person, because they feared offending them. The person identified as a man, and was “always a man”. Even when he was impregnated... hmmm.. I don’t think we should be ignoring scientific facts. I think the line needs to be drawn and the line has already been crossed. I can’t force people to crawl in my presence because I identify as tall.


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mongoose01 said:
The pendulum has swung so far the opposite way that now people are forced to ignore facts and common sense. I really don’t care what gender people “identify” as, but I don’t think we can ignore biology. Isn’t it useful for other people to be able to identify you? If you need to identify a body, or you need to locate an individual, isn’t it useful to be able to identify what you’re looking for?
I think the video on the front page says a lot. The fact that college students don’t have the guts to say, you are not a tall Chinese women is scary to me.
I heard about an individual in the hospital who was complaining about abdominal pain. The nurses were dumbfounded because this man had symptoms of being pregnant. Of course nobody can question this person, because they feared offending them. The person identified as a man, and was “always a man”. Even when he was impregnated... hmmm.. I don’t think we should be ignoring scientific facts. I think the line needs to be drawn and the line has already been crossed. I can’t force people to crawl in my presence because I identify as tall.


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The pendulum has swung so far the opposite way from what?

I'll try to take this back to the OP a little in my response...

If someone identifies as a gender that is opposite their biology, do you feel they are being honest or not? Is identifying as transgender an act of deception?
 
The bathroom issue. First, as much as possible the only reason I use a public restroom is to pee. If I've got to take a dump I will, but I certainly don't want to use a public restroom to take a dump. So for me I don't get why there would ever be a problem with a person using a restroom to pee or poop according to the one they feel more comfortable using. I don't hang out in public restrooms. I don't socialize in public restrooms, in fact I avoid eye contact or any type of interaction if I can. I'm in there to pee and get out. (I wash my hands)

I think a trans female has much more to fear if she is forced to use the men's room than anyone using the women's room has to fear from her. In fact, that's why urinary tract infections are a problem for trans people, they avoid using public restrooms at all, out of fear.
 
mongoose01 said:
I heard about an individual in the hospital who was complaining about abdominal pain. The nurses were dumbfounded because this man had symptoms of being pregnant. Of course nobody can question this person, because they feared offending them. The person identified as a man, and was “always a man”. Even when he was impregnated... hmmm..
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Citation needed.
 
Archie Moses said:
I finally read the article. I thought, why the eff not, let's see how Zombie feels.

The article pretty much like someone defending Trump. It brushed what she said off as a joke and anyone with a brain could tell it was satire. It called the people who are upset by them racist alt-right trolls. Literally argues **** like, well, there are way worse people out there so we should focus of them. It also argues using the pharse white people doesn't actually refer to white people at all - just their power. Then the auther blames twitter.

I can only help but think you don't actively think this, do you? Have you read her twitter feed itself or are you just saying what you think you should say? I mean, I'll even call out Shapiro at stuff I can't get behind, but you seem to be all on board with the choo choo train.
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Yeah so I could see myself saying most of what she said within my group of friends; I've done my fair share of bitching about 'the whites' (lately for their support of our amazing president). If you think that's as bad as calling black people are n****** or whatever I guess we'll never see eye to eye.

I will say that she showed poor judgment in airing her grievances like that on a public forum, but I don't think she expected they'd be dug up years later by alt righters acting in bad faith and then brought back to the light of day sans context.
 
It has swung far from the homophobia, transphobia, etc- transgender is now hip and in style. I certainly think some people are into it now for the popularity and notoriety.
Do I think people who identify as opposite their biology are being deceptive. Yes, some of them, sure, no doubt about it. I didn’t read all the posts in this thread, but the man identifying as female to save money on car insurance was certainly being deceptive. Fallon Fox was deceiving other fighters so she could beat the **** out of them.


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Zombie said:
Yeah so I could see myself saying most of what she said within my group of friends; I've done my fair share of bitching about 'the whites' (lately for their support of our amazing president). If you think that's as bad as calling black people are n****** or whatever I guess we'll never see eye to eye.

I will say that she showed poor judgment in airing her grievances like that on a public forum, but I don't think she expected they'd be dug up years later by alt righters acting in bad faith and then brought back to the light of day sans context.
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So the context matters, but she took **** pretty far. I don't see saying that it's not an issue at all nothing to see here about it. That, to me, is bias 100%. You don't dislike her, you don't really dislike what she said, so you give it a pass. There are many people being called out at the moment for stupid **** they said many years ago. I mean, I'd be down for calling a truce and having a statute of limitations of stupid **** that was said. If a person still feels that way they have more opportunities to express that now than they ever have, so finding a recent example shouldn't be hard. If there isn't a recent example then let's get the **** over it. People change.

But that doesn't mean we look back at ****ed up comments and say they aren't ****ed up comments. Her comments were inappropriate. If you can't even go that far then you're not participating in this whole thing in an honest way, you're just angeling for an advantage for your side.
 
mongoose01 said:
It has swung far from the homophobia, transphobia, etc- transgender is now hip and in style. I certainly think some people are into it now for the popularity and notoriety.
Do I think people who identify as opposite their biology are being deceptive. Yes, some of them, sure, no doubt about it. I didn’t read all the posts in this thread, but the man identifying as female to save money on car insurance was certainly being deceptive. Fallon Fox was deceiving other fighters so she could beat the **** out of them.


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In general, do you think identifying as trans is an act of deception.

The person who wanted to save money on their car insurance doesn't actually identify as a trans person. To be clear. That's not a typical case.
 
Bulletproof said:
So the context matters, but she took **** pretty far. I don't see saying that it's not an issue at all nothing to see here about it. That, to me, is bias 100%. You don't dislike her, you don't really dislike what she said, so you give it a pass. There are many people being called out at the moment for stupid **** they said many years ago. I mean, I'd be down for calling a truce and having a statute of limitations of stupid **** that was said. If a person still feels that way they have more opportunities to express that now than they ever have, so finding a recent example shouldn't be hard. If there isn't a recent example then let's get the **** over it. People change.

But that doesn't mean we look back at ****ed up comments and say they aren't ****ed up comments. Her comments were inappropriate. If you can't even go that far then you're not participating in this whole thing in an honest way, you're just angeling for an advantage for your side.
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Nah man. Like I said, I've said things just as bad or worse about white people (full disclosure, I am white). So it would be pretty silly for me to hold her to a higher standard than I do myself. Is it 'helping the discourse'? No probably not, but if it hurts white peoples feelings to hear about how sucky they are, maybe they should try sucking less. I dunno.
 
Zombie said:
Nah man. Like I said, I've said things just as bad or worse about white people (full disclosure, I am white). So it would be pretty silly for me to hold her to a higher standard than I do myself. Is it 'helping the discourse'? No probably not, but if it hurts white peoples feelings to hear about how sucky they are, maybe they should try sucking less. I dunno.
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Had a guy who was new at my work a little while back. He wanted to engage me in a discussion about how crazy women are. My response to him was that I've met a lot of different women.

I've also met a lot of different white people...
 
Bulletproof said:
Had a guy who was new at my work a little while back. He wanted to engage me in a discussion about how crazy women are. My response to him was that I've met a lot of different women.

I've also met a lot of different white people...
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Of course you have! As have I. I'm white and I think I'm pretty great. When I make jokes or complain about white people, I'm really complaining about the power structure that just so happens to place white people at the top, not like, a specific white person.
 
Zombie said:
If you think that's as bad as calling black people are n****** or whatever I guess we'll never see eye to eye.
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The fact that you made up some absurd, ******** comparison that equates what no one has said proves we'll never see eye to eye.
I'm not a Trump supporter, but for the love that's everything holy, stop making racist, stereotypical, generalizations with your friends. Making fun of people for the color of their skin is wrong. Stop being sheepish and trendy. You're dividing the simpletons just like Trump.
 
Archie Moses said:
The fact that you made up some absurd, ******** comparison that equates what no one has said proves we'll never see eye to eye.
I'm not a Trump supporter, but for the love that's everything holy, stop making racist, stereotypical, generalizations with your friends. Making fun of people for the color of their skin is wrong. Stop being sheepish and trendy. You're dividing the simpletons just like Trump.
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LOL OK bud. For the sake of white people's feelings I'll do better. Also, you accuse Jeong's tweets of being racist, I went with the most obvious example of actual racism I could think of. Interesting that you seem to realize that they really aren't the same.
 
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