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The Non-Jazz NBA Thread in the Jazz Section

KqWIN said:
I agree with you. If Neil Olshey was doing a good job, there would have been no investigation. I'm sure there are tons of higher ups in the NBA that are not angels themselves but do a good job so its not an issue.

I've never been a big "blow it up" kind of guy. I think if Dame wants to stay, you build around him until he wants to leave. They need the right people in their org and letting your GM hire a coach on his way out is not a great start.
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Especially because they fired a very good coach... and the early returns on Billups ain't great. I wonder what they end up doing but I would blow it up. I'd be really worried about Dame's current level of play, age, and that contract. If they do a Ben Simmons deal they may not suck so bad that they get high picks though. They have RoCo and Nurkic expiring this year and both of those guys appear to be slowing a bit. Not sure I'd want to be on the hook for their next deals.

They have enough parts to sell off that they could get a big jumpstart on the re-build. I think their biggest error was not trading CJ, something good, for something that was good and a better fit. They got a good run to the western conference finals and that might be as far as a Dame led team can take you without another piece on his level. Make it a three team trade on the Ben Simmons deal and collect a **** ton of picks. Collect a few picks from Philly and Maxey... sell everything else that isn't Anfernee Simons and Nasir Little.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Especially because they fired a very good coach... and the early returns on Billups ain't great. I wonder what they end up doing but I would blow it up. I'd be really worried about Dame's current level of play, age, and that contract. If they do a Ben Simmons deal they may not suck so bad that they get high picks though. They have RoCo and Nurkic expiring this year and both of those guys appear to be slowing a bit. Not sure I'd want to be on the hook for their next deals.

They have enough parts to sell off that they could get a big jumpstart on the re-build. I think their biggest error was not trading CJ, something good, for something that was good and a better fit. They got a good run to the western conference finals and that might be as far as a Dame led team can take you without another piece on his level. Make it a three team trade on the Ben Simmons deal and collect a **** ton of picks. Collect a few picks from Philly and Maxey... sell everything else that isn't Anfernee Simons and Nasir Little.
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They are definitely in a tough spot. Generally, I believe that good GM's don't necessarily need to tank or blow it up to get better. Teams that become contenders off the fruits of their tanking aren't as common as people think, and being "mediocre" isn't quite the death sentence that people make it out to be. I think you can get out of any spot by making a good sequence of moves. If Masai was running this team, for example, I would say they necessarily needed to tank. They just need to let him work. It's easy to forget that they made a WCF which is a level the Jazz haven't reached since DWill/Boozer days. So even if they are on the tail end, they had a decent run.

I'd agree that they should have traded CJ. For me it's less about the fit and more that CJ has just been overrated as a player. He's really good, but he is exactly the type of player that gets overrated by consensus. Most of his value is scoring, he's not hyper efficient, isn't a huge playmaker, doesn't defend, fun to watch, loved by his peers ect. At some point they probably should have sold high on him. Even if they didn't trade him, I think they just didn't get enough from their wings. Aminu and Harkless were ok, but really capped their team's ceiling. That and their bench being a revolving door of underwhelming bench players.
 
KqWIN said:
They are definitely in a tough spot. Generally, I believe that good GM's don't necessarily need to tank or blow it up to get better. Teams that become contenders off the fruits of their tanking aren't as common as people think, and being "mediocre" isn't quite the death sentence that people make it out to be. I think you can get out of any spot by making a good sequence of moves. If Masai was running this team, for example, I would say they necessarily needed to tank. They just need to let him work. It's easy to forget that they made a WCF which is a level the Jazz haven't reached since DWill/Boozer days. So even if they are on the tail end, they had a decent run.

I'd agree that they should have traded CJ. For me it's less about the fit and more that CJ has just been overrated as a player. He's really good, but he is exactly the type of player that gets overrated by consensus. Most of his value is scoring, he's not hyper efficient, isn't a huge playmaker, doesn't defend, fun to watch, loved by his peers ect. At some point they probably should have sold high on him. Even if they didn't trade him, I think they just didn't get enough from their wings. Aminu and Harkless were ok, but really capped their team's ceiling. That and their bench being a revolving door of underwhelming bench players.
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I somewhat agree… I just think with Dame his shelf life is too short to reconfigure a title contender. With the play in I think less teams are inclined to tank because they still have a shot. Less competition to get to the bottom… and odds are flat if you can land bottom 3.

The middle is still a death sentence imo. You may land Giannis… you may land Donovan and Rudy… but you are more likely to become the San Antonio Spurs. Even Massai tanked last year. They sat Lowry a bunch of games to lose games. Spurs dynasty was set off by tanking, OKC built a winner, Cleveland,etc. To win at the highest levels in the nba you need top tier talent and that is found at the top of the draft especially if you are not a glamour market or big market free agent destination.

Now can teams tank and then eff up still? Hells yes. Can you end up drafting Zion and still sucking? Yup! I would have loved to see what Philly became if they had one more break go their way or if they just let Hinkie finish his job.

You don’t want to be Sacramento, NY, Minny (they have had lotto luck that is now driving their rise). Even Sacramento had some obvious chances to get top tier talent and effed it up.

All of the team building strategies are low probability scenarios… I think tanking is the best low probability strategy for small markets. Hell even the Lakers tanked a few years to build their current team. At some point you have to bring in some vets and established talent to blend with the young guys and start winning. It isn’t a cure all solution and we will see if OKC nails phase 2… they likely can’t outright tank one more year.
 
Portland could do the stealth one year tank. Dame has surgery or rehabs all year and they hope to get some lotto luck and nail some fringe moves. I think trying to make a winning pivot is a losing scenario and teams wait a little too long sometimes… I think it’s a perfect
Time for the nuclear option for them.
 
Gameface said:
One game?

I guess it pays to be an MVP...

That was worse than any NBA punch I've ever seen thrown.

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Rudy Tomjanovich would disagree with you. 13 second mark.



That punch damn near killed him.
 
Love Payton II’s game. If you combine all of the missing ingredients from this current Jazz roster and shape them into one player, you get Payton II. That athleticism, perimeter defense, hustle and rebounding. Just exactly what the Jazz need right now
 
jom2003 said:
Love Payton II’s game. If you combine all of the missing ingredients from this current Jazz roster and shape them into one player, you get Payton II. That athleticism, perimeter defense, hustle and rebounding. Just exactly what the Jazz need right now
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He spent several years kicking around the G-league. He's 29 y.o. btw. Maybe there's hope that one of the Jazz's G-leaguers will eventually hit.
 
What kind of hairdo did I just see on that Mavericks player? Looked like a huge fish lure sticking out of his head.
 
Luka looks super fat. Wonder if he ever commits to being in amazing shape. Might just be his face but he looks like he getting after it at the bbq joints.
 
Tatum is an incredible basketball player, love watching him; especially lighting up the Lakers.
 
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