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The Non-Jazz NBA Thread in the Jazz Section

Jaanipoeg said:
Good for him.

One of the things that would be the hardest is if we churn through young guys and watch them break out when elsewhere, like Chicago with Lauri/WCJ/etc. I'd be happy for them got sure, but It would be bad for a franchise that is already a harder sell for young players
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That's why sometimes I wish we kept Quin as the coach. Say whatever about his rotation/game plan/in game adjustment, etc. But he's 10/10 when it comes to player development. After turning Rudy/Haywood/DM from nobodies into allstars, he's working the same magic with Jalen Johnson and now Dyson Daniels. He's perfect for a rebuilding team like us.

I will even go as far as saying he actually never let players break out elsewhere during his tenure. If you can't even make it under Quin, you not gonna make it in the NBA, period. Ochai would definitely have made it here if Quin was still the coach.
 
jom2003 said:
That's why sometimes I wish we kept Quin as the coach. Say whatever about his rotation/game plan/in game adjustment, etc. But he's 10/10 when it comes to player development. After turning Rudy/Haywood/DM from nobodies into allstars, he's working the same magic with Jalen Johnson and now Dyson Daniels. He's perfect for a rebuilding team like us.

I will even go as far as saying he actually never let players break out elsewhere during his tenure. If you can't even make it under Quin, you not gonna make it in the NBA, period. Ochai would definitely have made it here if Quin was still the coach.
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Do you really think Ochai is doing something different? He's just making his shots now. It's not like Utah/Hardy were asking him to do things he couldn't do. He just couldnt hit shots in Utah. I dont think his shot quality is all that much better in Toronto. He's just hitting them now.

Dyson Daniels is seemingly the same player he was in NOLA. He just getting more minutes now. His offensive numbers are actually worse this year than last year.

I think a Jalen Johnson breakout was inevitable no matter who his coach was.

Trae Young is having by far his worst season.

Kobe Bufkin still hasnt shown anything.

I think Quin is a fine development coach, but I wouldnt say it was anything otherworldly and Hardy has shown to be just as good in that space IMO.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Do you really think Ochai is doing something different? He's just making his shots now. It's not like Utah/Hardy were asking him to do things he couldn't do. He just couldnt hit shots in Utah. I dont think his shot quality is all that much better in Toronto. He's just hitting them now.

Dyson Daniels is seemingly the same player he was in NOLA. He just getting more minutes now. His offensive numbers are actually worse this year than last year.

I think a Jalen Johnson breakout was inevitable no matter who his coach was.

Trae Young is having by far his worst season.

Kobe Bufkin still hasnt shown anything.

I think Quin is a fine development coach, but I wouldnt say it was anything otherworldly and Hardy has shown to be just as good in that space IMO.
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Well, teaching guys to shoot is a part of player development, don't you think? We are also sitting at the bottom of the table when it comes to all kinds of stats related to shot quality. We as a team just aren't good at setting guys up or finding good looks for our players. If an off-ball 3D prospect like Ochai can't consistently find open looks and has to shoot highly contested jumpers, what do you think it would do to his confidence and shooting %? Raptors isn't exactly great in that area either but they are definitely better in that aspect.

Identifying players strengths&weaknesses, giving them the minutes they need and let them do what they do best are all huge factors for player development. Daniels showed flashes in NOLA but was never given the minutes or a consistent role needed for him to break out. His coaching staff let him down. Simple as that. That's why NOLA fans are regretting the trade big time.

And again, if Jalen was that great of a prospect and inevitable to break out, why would he drop all the way to 20th in the draft then spend the first two seasons of his career running on empty calories? Just so he can wait for Quin to arrive to credit him for his breakout? How nice of him.

Trae is having his worst numbers in scoring but he's also having his best season running the floor(career high in apg at 12) so I definitely wouldn't call it his "worst season". He's just playing a different game now.

And until Bufkin can show something else under a different coach I rest my case. Players had chances for years to let Quin “eat his crow” but they’ve done nothing but to prove that Quin was right. DedEx, Burke, Bolomboy, Oni, Doke, Tony Bradley, Jared Butler, Elijah Hughes, Juwan Morgan, Brantley, NWG. I think we got enough sample size at this point to say it's more just luck for Mr. Quin Snyder.
 
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jom2003 said:
Well, teaching guys to shoot is a part of player development, don't you think? We are also sitting at the bottom of the table when it comes to all kinds of stats related to shot quality. We as a team just aren't good at setting guys up or finding good looks for our players. If an off-ball 3D prospect like Ochai can't consistently find open looks and has to shoot highly contested jumpers, what do you think it would do to his confidence and shooting %? Raptors isn't exactly great in that area either but they are definitely better in that aspect.

Identifying players strengths&weaknesses, giving them the minutes they need and let them do what they do best are all huge factors for player development. Daniels showed flashes in NOLA but was never given the minutes or a consistent role needed for him to break out. His coaching staff let him down. Simple as that. That's why NOLA fans are regretting the trade big time.

Trae is having his worst numbers in scoring but he's also having his best season running the floor(career high in apg at 12) so I definitely wouldn't call it his "worst season". He's just playing a different game now.

And until Bufkin can show something else under a different coach I rest my case. Players had chances for years to let Quin “eat his crow” but they’ve done nothing but to prove that Quin was right. DedEx, Burke, Bolomboy, Oni, Doke, Tony Bradley, Jared Butler, Elijah Hughes, Juwan Morgan, Brantley, NWG. I think we got enough sample size at this point to say it's more just luck for Mr. Quin Snyder.
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Bro Ochai was wide open and missing shots last year. He was set up fantastically.

And again, Dyson is actually playing worse this year than last year (as far as efficiency goes), he's just getting more minutes.

ANd yes, it's Trae's worst season. You are doing some crazy mental gymnastics.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Do you really think Ochai is doing something different? He's just making his shots now. It's not like Utah/Hardy were asking him to do things he couldn't do. He just couldnt hit shots in Utah. I dont think his shot quality is all that much better in Toronto. He's just hitting them now.
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This is not exactly true. Ochai is not a totally different player but he improved in several areas: his finishing at the rim improved markedly and his assists per 36 moved up while the turnovers ticked down. And he is still trending up on that in the last several games (in the last 5 games he had 11 assists and 2 turnovers) so he still seems to be steadily improving.
 
jazznik said:
This is not exactly true. Ochai is not a totally different player but he improved in several areas: his finishing at the rim improved markedly and his assists per 36 moved up while the turnovers ticked down. And he is still trending up on that in the last several games (in the last 5 games he had 11 assists and 2 turnovers) so he still seems to be steadily improving.
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.7 more assist per 36 minutes.... .1 less turnovers....
 
THT is a way bigger indictment on Hardy/Jazz than Ochai IMO. He was playing well then got benched from his injury.

Now will these THT numbers hold up, certainly not. But we should have developed him more than we did as he was showing improvement offensively.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
THT is a way bigger indictment on Hardy/Jazz than Ochai IMO. He was playing well then got benched from his injury.

Now will these THT numbers hold up, certainly not. But we should have developed him more than we did as he was showing improvement offensively.
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They gave him the starting gig and he **** the bed last year. Its not any kind of indictment. He has been hot the last 4 games... maybe he's turned a corner. We gave him plenty of opportunity to do something like this. Lets see if it holds up.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
They gave him the starting gig and he **** the bed last year. Its not any kind of indictment. He has been hot the last 4 games... maybe he's turned a corner. We gave him plenty of opportunity to do something like this. Lets see if it holds up.
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It also wouldn’t be the strangest thing if both/either THT and/or Ochai are succeeding because of an urgency they found after being rejected by the Jazz. Neither were showing great signs of getting a next real payday and it probably to some degree was a wake-up call.
 
NUMBERICA said:
It also wouldn’t be the strangest thing if both/either THT and/or Ochai are succeeding because of an urgency they found after being rejected by the Jazz. Neither were showing great signs of getting a next real payday and it probably to some degree was a wake-up call.
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Yeah, I think to a large degree that's probably whats going on with THT, but he should have had similar urgency last year. I havent watched him closely with the Bulls, but he seems to be doing less crazy ****.

I still maintain when he was not doing crazy ****, he was a very good player.
 
NUMBERICA said:
It also wouldn’t be the strangest thing if both/either THT and/or Ochai are succeeding because of an urgency they found after being rejected by the Jazz. Neither were showing great signs of getting a next real payday and it probably to some degree was a wake-up call.
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For sure. I just don't think that's on the Jazz. Its them having to hit rock bottom and realizing that maybe you don't want to take that heat check three for no reason. Or maybe the drop off pass doesn't have to be a no look through the legs pass.

Ochai I think was in his head last year a bit. I knew he'd be better than he was but didn't expect what we have seen this year. THT likely still is a minimum guy next summer so we can have our chance then. Unless he continues on this heater (I'm skeptical).
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Yeah, I think to a large degree that's probably whats going on with THT, but he should have had similar urgency last year. I havent watched him closely with the Bulls, but he seems to be doing less crazy ****.

I still maintain when he was not doing crazy ****, he was a very good player.
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It wasn't all crazy **** but it was just launching a 3 with 16 seconds on the clock or just turning down the simple play for an acrobatic contested finish.

I don't think the "hunger games" to start the year last year was super smart. I like the idea of it but it seemed like all those guys played below their level. Added pressure and just in their heads. IDK... just think that THT did his job here... helped us tank... now he is doing his job helping a tank competitor win. Give him a statue!
 
THT is averaging 11 minutes per game this season. A career low. Maybe the key to him being such an amazing player is to play him as little as possible lol.
 
Will these numbers (8 points, 2 rebounds, 2 assists) hold up? Idk but im on the edge of my seat thats for sure.

I am rooting for the bulls to win a lot to stay away from us at the bottom of the standings..... So keep up the amazing play THT!
 
The good news is THT is on a one year vet min deal so the Jazz can sign him in the offseason! Bulls don't even have his bird rights.

Honestly can't see either side having a ton of interest in a reunion after how last season ended. THT seems like a cool dude so hope he succeeds wherever he ends up.

Between NAW, THT, and Agbaji I thought NAW had the highest ceiling. Not going to lose sleep over roleplayers, or even pay them on a 2nd/3rd contract, until the Jazz actually find a young franchise guy to build around.
 
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