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The Non-Jazz NBA Thread in the Jazz Section

Handlogten's Heros said:
You sound like the type of person that makes up alternative scenarios that have no bearing on a particular subject when you are in over your head.

Yes billionaires have never considered multiple revenue projections/scenarios. FOH.
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I never said they haven't considered it. I said they have never had a serious cost benefits analysis conducted. No one owner could do that as it would take access to every teams financials which NBA team are never going to be fully transparent about.
 
infection said:
I believe the percentage of games players miss would remain the same. I don’t believe we’re subtracting the 10 games everyone is going to sit.
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There's no way it would be the same. A serious reduction of games would reduce injuries which would increase games played by some degree.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
You sound like the people who say head coaches can never be wrong because they are head coaches of a NBA team.
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That actually sounds like the argument that you typically make.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I never said they haven't considered it. I said they have never had a serious cost benefits analysis conducted. No one owner could do that as it would take access to every teams financials which NBA team are never going to be fully transparent about.
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Yeah I mean these teams never open up the books and share financials… oh wait they do it every ****ing year when a third party goes through it with a fine tooth comb. Just because you don’t get access to the info doesn’t mean it’s not there. Maybe you should sit this one out while the adults talk.
 
KqWIN said:
Reducing the games does increase the importance. You cannot create these hypothetical anecdotes to argue that it makes no difference. The chances that Steph is playing in a game because it is important to him to win is greater in a 72 game season. The chances that Kawhi or Zion is playing in a game because the are healthy is greater in a 72 game season than an 82 game season. The incentive to play because it's important to win is always greater in 72 than in 82 and the chances of sitting due to inadequate health are always lower. I don't believe it is a complete solution, but I find it hard to believe that reducing amount of games does not make the games more important. I also think the Fast and the Furious movie is a dreadful comparison because while people line up for movie stars, explosions, and actions they do not line up for worse basketball compared to better basketball. If you can have some skepticism that better basketball may not produce better viewership, I have some skepticism that 82 games is the best way to generate revenue for the NBA long term.

This discussion is still fairly new and such a large change would take time. Adam Silver has stated he is open to the idea. CJ McCollum (speaking for the players) have said the players have discussed but no conclusion yet. It's not as if it is being voted on regularly and can be implemented in an instant. I'm pessimistic about it happening, but I don't take the fact that it hasn't been passed as an indication that it is a bad idea. I bet you can't find a single NBA fan who can't name something they wouldn't change about the league, but that doesn't mean all of the changes are bad idea. The financial implications of this move (both in short and long term) are not concrete. But the quality of the NBA product is something they should always be conscious of and increasing the quality of their product is the best way to keep revenue healthy.
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Here is how far that discussion goes… lots of discussion then the talk of a pay cut comes up…


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=35&v=fBW2i7Jbefw&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F&source_ve_path=MzY4NDIsMjM4NTE&feature=emb_title
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Yeah I mean these teams never open up the books and share financials… oh wait they do it every ****ing year when a third party goes through it with a fine tooth comb. Just because you don’t get access to the info doesn’t mean it’s not there. Maybe you should sit this one out while the adults talk.
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Oh, how naive
 
For @infection

Imagine your spouse comes to you with a plan to improve sexual satisfaction… at the top of the list is a 15% reduction of frequency. The rest of the list has some interesting things and ideas… how are most of us going to respond? Going to start with why the reduction… well it will increase the meaning and quality of the other sex we do have. Is it? Or would the other things be what change the actual satisfaction. I don’t know about y’all but I’m pushing for the bullet points after the first one… and we will circle back to that one later okay.

I mean arbitrarily reducing the number of encounters by 15% is not going to change the fact you have a headache or are tired certain nights. So what am I signing up for?
 
These are legitimately some of the worst analogies I have ever seen hahahaha. Sometimes you gotta consider that quality > quantity. If you’re at the point where you are physically incapable of doing something at the same quantity or that you are uninterested in doing it at that quantity….yeah it might be time to consider that the quantity may be too high. I love pasta, probably wouldn’t enjoy it if I had it every meal every day. There’s a happy medium for everything.

If NBA ratings were in a better spot and players didn’t have to sit/want to sit we wouldn’t be having this conversation would we.
 
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KqWIN said:
These are legitimately some of the worst analogies I have ever seen hahahaha. Sometimes you gotta consider that quality > quantity. If you’re at the point where you are physically incapable of doing something at the same quantity or that you are uninterested in doing it at that quantity….yeah it might be time to consider that the quantity may be too high. I love pasta, probably wouldn’t enjoy it if I had it every meal every day. There’s a happy medium for everything.

If NBA ratings were in a better spot and players didn’t have to sit/want to sit we wouldn’t be having this conversation would we.
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That's kind of HH and Infections thing. They love terrible analogies
 
KqWIN said:
These are legitimately some of the worst analogies I have ever seen hahahaha. Sometimes you gotta consider that quality > quantity. If you’re at the point where you are physically incapable of doing something at the same quantity or that you are uninterested in doing it at that quantity….yeah it might be time to consider that the quantity may be too high. I love pasta, probably wouldn’t enjoy it if I had it every meal every day. There’s a happy medium for everything.

If NBA ratings were in a better spot and players didn’t have to sit/want to sit we wouldn’t be having this conversation would we.
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They are not... quality is important... less quantity does not automatically fix quality. If there are other things you can do to fix quality you do those first before reducing quantity.

Then you throw in an analogy about pasta that is not relevant at all. That is a variety issue not a quality issue. Hilarious to see someone simultaneously throw shade on an analogy and come up with a far worse one.
 
I think it's worth it for the league to consider that the modern game has changed when thinking about this stuff. There are more possessions and guys are doing way more than in the past. The human body is only able to handle so many miles, so if players are logging more miles per game, then they are not going to be able to play as many games. On top of that they are competing against the most athletic players there have ever been, so there is just much more wear and tear that has to be considered.

The league is also the deepest its ever been as well. Maybe another way to handle this is minute restrictions on regular season games. Everyone would hate that, but it would allow for more even competition, while preserving health, and since counting stats continue to be important for some reason would give everyone a more level playing field for awards.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
They are not... quality is important... less quantity does not automatically fix quality. If there are other things you can do to fix quality you do those first before reducing quantity.

Then you throw in an analogy about pasta that is not relevant at all. That is a variety issue not a quality issue. Hilarious to see someone simultaneously throw shade on an analogy and come up with a far worse one.
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When there is too much quantity, going for more quality seems like a good idea. The NBA clearly has a quantity issue when players are sitting out. The pasta issue is relevant because the NBA has too much of one thing. It’s about the enjoyment of pasta, basketball, whatever. If you have too much of it, you will enjoy it less. If there was no issue with too much, there would be no discussion to be had at all.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
I think it's worth it for the league to consider that the modern game has changed when thinking about this stuff. There are more possessions and guys are doing way more than in the past. The human body is only able to handle so many miles, so if players are logging more miles per game, then they are not going to be able to play as many games. On top of that they are competing against the most athletic players there have ever been, so there is just much more wear and tear that has to be considered.

The league is also the deepest its ever been as well. Maybe another way to handle this is minute restrictions on regular season games. Everyone would hate that, but it would allow for more even competition, while preserving health, and since counting stats continue to be important for some reason would give everyone a more level playing field for awards.
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I honestly think 40 minute games > 48 minute games due to the time box, but I think the players (well LeBron at least) have already came out against that and prefer less games instead.
 
KqWIN said:
When there is too much quantity, going for more quality seems like a good idea. The NBA clearly has a quantity issue when players are sitting out. The pasta issue is relevant because the NBA has too much of one thing. It’s about the enjoyment of pasta, basketball, whatever. If you have too much of it, you will enjoy it less. If there was no issue with too much, there would be no discussion to be had at all.
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Its a truly horrible analogy. So the answer for the pasta restaurant is to make less pasta or be open less because sometimes you feel like eating fish and chips (soccer). Even if we increase the quality of the food by a lot you will still want to go elsewhere at times.

IF they have a quantity problem merely reducing quantity does not fix a quality problem. Its hard to argue they have a huge problem when the revenue pie is growing in huge increments.

Look with sports and entertainment there will be the competition side of things and the business side of things. Many times the interests of both will align... sometimes they will not and the league will need to make decisions. Less games likely improves competition but I don't think its the first item on the list of things that I'd change to improve things on that side... business-wise its one of the last things I'd consider. At very most I would remove 3-4 games to ensure that ESPN, ABC, and TNT games aren't scheduled on back to backs, which removes the key problem the league has with load management. The most recent changes are to pander to their media partners with a side of pandering to the gambling markets. Its not about the quality or increasing the meaning of the regular season.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
I think it's worth it for the league to consider that the modern game has changed when thinking about this stuff. There are more possessions and guys are doing way more than in the past. The human body is only able to handle so many miles, so if players are logging more miles per game, then they are not going to be able to play as many games. On top of that they are competing against the most athletic players there have ever been, so there is just much more wear and tear that has to be considered.

The league is also the deepest its ever been as well. Maybe another way to handle this is minute restrictions on regular season games. Everyone would hate that, but it would allow for more even competition, while preserving health, and since counting stats continue to be important for some reason would give everyone a more level playing field for awards.
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And I think there is merit here. While all sides might understand the long term improvement in player health with come with restrictions or reduced games... if it comes with a pay cut it will meet a bunch of opposition on both sides. What is good for the competition quality will not always match perfectly with what works for business.

I just think its naive to think that all parties will do what is in the best interest of the sport and that it will have not detectable impact on the business. Certainly there is balance and you can kill the golden goose but with the current revenue and value growth its hard to argue that there is a huge issue there. Not that you think this way.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
And I think there is merit here. While all sides might understand the long term improvement in player health with come with restrictions or reduced games... if it comes with a pay cut it will meet a bunch of opposition on both sides. What is good for the competition quality will not always match perfectly with what works for business.

I just think its naive to think that all parties will do what is in the best interest of the sport and that it will have not detectable impact on the business. Certainly there is balance and you can kill the golden goose but with the current revenue and value growth its hard to argue that there is a huge issue there. Not that you think this way.
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Yeah, I don't actually think guys sitting out of games is a huge issue. I do think an increase in injuries is a huge issue.
 
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