The Non-Jazz NBA Thread in the Jazz Section

[Saint Cy of JFC]

They didn't even draft 2 of those guys and none of them are viewed as core pieces so they don't really matter.

They are on the team playing major minutes, that's the point. Doesnt matter if they drafted them, they paid to get them and they are an opportunity cost for better players/fits.

 

[KqWIN]

Pistons fooled me with their early start. They looked like a deep team with many players who improved. Cade is still awful and so is Stewart. Ivey is improved but still plays mindless. He’s like the guard version of Bagley. Ausar is an incredible defensive talent but still very much a liability on offense.

Duren might be the only one of their young guys who is an obvious, true positive player imo.

 

[HermanG]

Pistons fooled me with their early start. They looked like a deep team with many players who improved. Cade is still awful and so is Stewart. Ivey is improved but still plays mindless. He’s like the guard version of Bagley. Ausar is an incredible defensive talent but still very much a liability on offense.

Duren might be the only one of their young guys who is an obvious, true positive player imo.

I agree and thats funny as hell since he is in the minority of NOT being a top 10 pick.

Not trying to say top 10 picks are worse than later ones ofc, but just that Detroit has not found fortune with theirs.

 

[sip]

I have so many questions...
1) Why do you love the collection if its missing the #1 thing every modern NBA team is looking for?
2) Who do you remove from that awesome collection to add those shooters?
3) How do you magically just add shooters?
4) How did they suck for 4 years winning less than 25 games in all of them and failed to add any shooters or 3 level scorers during that time (owning picks of others as well)?
5) Why do they depend on Bogey (34) who will probably end up looking like a demi-god in that roster?
6) Did they desperately need to add Ausar (non-shooter) for that collection to be great before they magically add the shooters?

(dont need to reply to those btw)
Point is, you love scouting reports and highlights. But here is a newsflash: Detroit fans dont love that team nor do they see light at the end of the tunnel. Go read their boards and game threads to get a sense of what its like rooting for that team.

1. They have 2 wings in Cade and Ivey that are high upside scorers as well as playmakers.
2. Ausar looks like an absolute beast of a defender that can guard 4 positions while also providing some offensive playmaking.
3. Jalen Duren just turned 20 and already is showing some dominance in the paint on both ends of the court.
4. I like Isaiah Stewart as a really solid utility big. Preferably off the bench.
5. Marcus Sasser has shown some flashes as a solid backup guard so far as a rookie.

Between those 6 guys they have a lot of roles covered. You ask who do you remove from the collection to add shooters and the answer is no one. With their own pick this year I like the fit of Risacher with those guys. In free agency they will have a ton of money to spend. Of the available free agents I think they throw a max offer at OG Anunoby but odds are they don't get him so a guy like Gary Trent Jr makes a lot of sense. He is a really solid volume 3pt shooter and fits the age range of their young core. They also have Bogey who they could keep but probably best used as a trade chip for a younger guy if possible.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I like the Pistons as well, but at some point you have to get some high quality adults in the room like Houston did (and not Bogey, someone who can actually be the best player on your team). You can't just build through the draft unless you are absolutely hitting it out of the park with stars, and the Pistons havent done that. They got a lot of nice players and some very good ones, but none who are going to lift your franchise out of poverty without good to great vets.

 

[sip]

Pistons fooled me with their early start. They looked like a deep team with many players who improved. Cade is still awful and so is Stewart. Ivey is improved but still plays mindless. He’s like the guard version of Bagley. Ausar is an incredible defensive talent but still very much a liability on offense.

Duren might be the only one of their young guys who is an obvious, true positive player imo.

Cade is not awful. He missed most of last year and you can tell that he is still figuring out exactly what he can and can't do out there. I think he is actually really close to turning a corner and making a huge leap.

 

[sip]

They are on the team playing major minutes, that's the point. Doesnt matter if they drafted them, they paid to get them and they are an opportunity cost for better players/fits.

No they aren't playing major minutes. Wiseman gets spot minutes and that's only Duran is out. Marvin Bagley is getting 19 minutes. They also gave up basically nothing for those guys just so they could get a free look at them. That is what any rebuilding team should be doing. Taking cheap chances on guys with upside.

 

[SoberasHotRod]

Cade is not awful. He missed most of last year and you can tell that he is still figuring out exactly what he can and can't do out there. I think he is actually really close to turning a corner and making a huge leap.

In my opinion he is the main reason they are as bad as they are. His role is too big for his talent right now. Hi might be better if his role were smaller and gradually increased over time.

 

[HermanG]

1. They have 2 wings in Cade and Ivey that are high upside scorers as well as playmakers.
2. Ausar looks like an absolute beast of a defender that can guard 4 positions while also providing some offensive playmaking.
3. Jalen Duren just turned 20 and already is showing some dominance in the paint on both ends of the court.
4. I like Isaiah Stewart as a really solid utility big. Preferably off the bench.
5. Marcus Sasser has shown some flashes as a solid backup guard so far as a rookie.

Between those 6 guys they have a lot of roles covered. You ask who do you remove from the collection to add shooters and the answer is no one. With their own pick this year I like the fit of Risacher with those guys. In free agency they will have a ton of money to spend. Of the available free agents I think they throw a max offer at OG Anunoby but odds are they don't get him so a guy like Gary Trent Jr makes a lot of sense. He is a really solid volume 3pt shooter and fits the age range of their young core. They also have Bogey who they could keep but probably best used as a trade chip for a younger guy if possible.

So.... add Risacher and Gary Trent Jr to turn around a team who has seen their win pct decline 5 straight years and who are on pace for a 10 win season?

Am I getting this correct?

 

[HermanG]

Cade is not awful. He missed most of last year and you can tell that he is still figuring out exactly what he can and can't do out there. I think he is actually really close to turning a corner and making a huge leap.

Cade is awful. Present tense.

You are talking conditional future tense.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

No they aren't playing major minutes. Wiseman gets spot minutes and that's only Duran is out. Marvin Bagley is getting 19 minutes. They also gave up basically nothing for those guys just so they could get a free look at them. That is what any rebuilding team should be doing. Taking cheap chances on guys with upside.

19 is major minutes. Wiseman is palyign 11 this year, but played 26 last year.

They are wasting minutes on these busts/severe disappointments who do nothing to make your team better and dont have much potential to do so.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Cade is awful. Present tense.

You are talking conditional future tense.

He's awful as a #1 option.

 

[HermanG]

He's awful as a #1 option.

Yeah thats fair. He could be great as a support guy and a 2nd/3rd option. I can buy that.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Yeah thats fair. He could be great as a support guy and a 2nd/3rd option. I can buy that.

It's just like Jalen Green. At the end of the day you have to ask yourself as a franchise are you really doing your player favors by trying to force them to grow into a role they cant really handle? Especially when you draft and trade for pieces that dont help him at all.

 

[HermanG]

This tweet made me lol


View: https://x.com/SamQuinnCBS/status/1729380874850857310?s=20

 

[sip]

So.... add Risacher and Gary Trent Jr to turn around a team who has seen their win pct decline 5 straight years and who are on pace for a 10 win season?

Am I getting this correct?

I look forward to revisiting this conversation next year or maybe even later this year as we see their young guys develop. We are talking about a team that last night started 2 guys that are 20yrs old, 1 guy that is 21 and 2 guys that are 22. I'm not claiming they are going to make some massive jump next year but I do expect them to be firmly on the upswing with the chance to be really really good in a few years.

 

[sip]

19 is major minutes. Wiseman is palyign 11 this year, but played 26 last year.

They are wasting minutes on these busts/severe disappointments who do nothing to make your team better and dont have much potential to do so.

Good lord the hyperbole is strong in you. They aren't wasting minutes on these guys at the expense of other guys. Wiseman is basically an end of bench big that only gets spot minutes because of injuries. Bagley is a 24yr old role player big that is a decent player. There is nothing wrong with giving him 19 minutes a game.

 

[sip]

Cade is awful. Present tense.

You are talking conditional future tense.

No he is not awful. He is showing a ton of potential but also like most young guys is making plenty of mistakes as well. The kid has only played 94 career games and you act like he should be some kind of finished product.

 

[KqWIN]

No he is not awful. He is showing a ton of potential but also like most young guys is making plenty of mistakes as well. The kid has only played 94 career games and you act like he should be some kind of finished product.

We're acting like he's playing like **** because he has played like ****. He's a big reason they lost 15 in a row.....Can't even make an observation about young players without someone taking it the extra step for no reason. We're talking about the Pistons right here and now.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

We're acting like he's playing like **** because he has played like ****. He's a big reason they lost 15 in a row.....Can't even make an observation about young players without someone taking it the extra step for no reason. We're talking about the Pistons right here and now.

He's bad but man while I like some of the parts they have put together they don't seem to fit at all. When the best shooter in your starting lineup is the center pretending to be a PF you are in trouble. Team is 30th in 3 pa and 25th in percentage. If there is one thing that will neuter a guy like Cade its going to be to have atrocious shooting around him.

I also don't think Monty is some amazing coach and the starting lineups and players he's been given will make that potentially much worse. Giving an old school guy a bunch of "bruisers" seems like enabling a bit. Every addition they make should be with Ausar, Cade, Duren in mind and they should acquire guys that can shoot, shooters, and mix in some shooting. Playing AB more may help, getting Bogey back (if he's ready to be old Bogey) will be helpful... but they really need to consider trading in some of their big for vets that can shoot or just moving 1 of their core guys.