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Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz

NUMBERICA said:
Players (in their prime) I like more than Ayton available in the 20's or later in the last 10 years:
Draymond Green
Khris Middleton
Rudy (****ing) Gobert in a terrible draft
Nikola Jokic
Pascal Siakam
Dejounte Murray
Malcolm Brogdon
The 24th pick of the 2017 draft packaged with a bum to get Donovan Mitchell
Jordan Poole
Lu Dort
Tyrese Maxey
Desmond Bane

There are actually more players than that that I like more than Ayton. The point is not some conclusive objective analysis blah blah blah. Just that there are real players there and 2023 is supposed to be a great draft. You think rebuilds suck, I enjoy them and I think it's inevitable. I don't think Ayton in anyway aids a rebuild and I would dislike his presence in such an endeavor because he will either be good and prevent the team from bottoming out or will suck and be an underwater contract and bringing his big whatever vibes to the locker room. I think it is virtually impossible to buy-low if the contract is large enough (it seems pretty locked he's gonna make more than $100 million on his next deal), the transactional price is high enough (I don't think it's as low as people are discussing), and/or the opportunity cost is high enough ($100 million in owed salaries for a team that should be operating at or below the cap is $100 million less in space you can use to take bad contracts and picks, which I would guess nets you in the realm of 5 firsts and 10 seconds).

TLDR; we see this situation very differently.
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Rebuilds do ****ing suck. We all have been through one of them already and we barely avoided another one.

We will legit suck for at minimum 4-5 years before we see the playoffs again if we dealt Mitchell for a rebuilding package. That **** sucks and it could be even longer if we everything doesn’t go to plan.
 
Elizah Huge said:
The most realistic trade that I think could happen today is this:

Jazz out: Bogdanovic, 2023 Minnesota 1st, 2023 Philadelphia 1st

Jazz in: Ayton

Suns out: Ayton, Bridges, Johnson, Crowder, 23/25/27/29 1sts, 24/26/28 pick swaps

Suns in: Kevin Durant

Nets out: Kevin Durant

Nets in: Bridges,Johnson, Crowder, Bogdanovic, 23/25/27/29 Phoenix 1sts, 2023 Minnesota 1st, 2023 Philadelphia 1st and 24/26/28 Phoenix pick swaps

Brooklyn gets 6 1sts for Durant plus Bridges/Johnson and expiring contracts.

We get Ayton for Bogey and 2 late firsts.

Phoenix gets Durant for their package and we help by pushing it over the top by adding 2 firsts to the deal.
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I'd be down for this. Mostly because it would hamstring the Suns for a long, long time. They would be selling their soul to the devil. I would hope DA plays a littler harder and tries to get Gay contract off the books, or include Udoka instead of a first.
 
Hearsky said:
I'd be down for this. Mostly because it would hamstring the Suns for a long, long time. They would be selling their soul to the devil. I would hope DA plays a littler harder and tries to get Gay contract off the books, or include Udoka instead of a first.
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Ideally we only send one first or send out Conley instead of Bogey or some combination of Clarkson/Beasley/Gay.
 
Elizah Huge said:
Minnesota’s 2023 1st and Philadelphia’s 2023 1st

Both very likely to be in the 20’s.
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This is the problem. We got a lot of picks but where they are coming from means they won't be really valuable until the last 1 or 2. Maybe not even then. We made the wolves significantly better. Late 20's for their picks. Philly will be good for years to come. There is more value in trading these picks rather than using them.
 
LogGrad98 said:
This is the problem. We got a lot of picks but where they are coming from means they won't be really valuable until the last 1 or 2. Maybe not even then. We made the wolves significantly better. Late 20's for their picks. Philly will be good for years to come. There is more value in trading these picks rather than using them.
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I think 2027 and 2029 are just so far away that anything can happen. Look at Brooklyn who traded all their picks for Harden. Not even two years later he’s not there and now Durant/Irving are both likely to get traded. Did anyone think they’d be in this situation?
 
NUMBERICA said:
Players (in their prime) I like more than Ayton available in the 20's or later in the last 10 years:
Draymond Green
Khris Middleton
Rudy (****ing) Gobert in a terrible draft
Nikola Jokic
Pascal Siakam
Dejounte Murray
Malcolm Brogdon
The 24th pick of the 2017 draft packaged with a bum to get Donovan Mitchell
Jordan Poole
Lu Dort
Tyrese Maxey
Desmond Bane

There are actually more players than that that I like more than Ayton. The point is not some conclusive objective analysis blah blah blah. Just that there are real players there and 2023 is supposed to be a great draft. You think rebuilds suck, I enjoy them and I think it's inevitable. I don't think Ayton in anyway aids a rebuild and I would dislike his presence in such an endeavor because he will either be good and prevent the team from bottoming out or will suck and be an underwater contract and bringing his big whatever vibes to the locker room. I think it is virtually impossible to buy-low if the contract is large enough (it seems pretty locked he's gonna make more than $100 million on his next deal), the transactional price is high enough (I don't think it's as low as people are discussing), and/or the opportunity cost is high enough ($100 million in owed salaries for a team that should be operating at or below the cap is $100 million less in space you can use to take bad contracts and picks, which I would guess nets you in the realm of 5 firsts and 10 seconds).

TLDR; we see this situation very differently.
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Looks like about 1'ish per year.
From your list I like Ayton better than brogdon, maxey, Bane, Dort, Murray, and middleton. Maybe better than draymond (I hate draymond and he is in the PERFECT situation for him) and maybe better than poole (everyone looks better when they play for the warriors)
I like jokic alot better than ayton and I like gobert and siakam better than ayton. However I like first 4 years ayton better than first 4 years Gobert. I would not be surprised at all for Ayton career to look better than gobert career by the time he is 30. He is only 23. The fact that this discussion is being had for a 23 year old kinda shows that he might be special. Rudy seemed to really his his stride at about 26 years old. Bigs often take time to develop and at 23 Ayton is already putting up good numbers for a really good team. When he is 26 he might be special. Or not but IF all it takes is bogey and a first to get him then im down.

I would be interested in a statistical comparison for everyone on your list vs Ayton when they were 23 years of age. Also each of their teams win/loss records when they were 23. Maybe if I have time later I will post it.
 
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framer said:
I don't wish to use Bojan as a throw in. He is an easy first round pick at the deadline at the very least. Clarkson too, possibly more.
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Bojan's contract is reportedly locked in to a trade deal already. Bucks made a call on Bojan and were told he's already committed to a trade. Maybe it's Ayton. Maybe it's John Collins. Maybe something else.
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
Bojan's contract is reportedly locked in to a trade deal already. Bucks made a call on Bojan and were told he's already committed to a trade. Maybe it's Ayton. Maybe it's John Collins. Maybe something else.
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Interesting. I would really miss Bogey. He has been one of my favorite players the last couple years. Having said that, he isn't a true cornerstone and is 33.
 
I keep getting suck into the twitter chasing and supposed accurate reporting from all of these insiders (Which is why I'm on here posting on the 4th). How come no one knew that the Timberwolves were aggressively pursuing Gobert until after the fact? How come Woj had to break this, and no other insiders had any information? I saw one piece of reporting that Twolves had interest and were in conversations. We spent all this time talking about Hawks, Bulls and Raptors deals. Insiders writing articles, blog posts, podcasts and etc. talking about these teams. I even spent an hour searching Hawks, Bulls and Raptors fan forums for any information on THE pending deal that was coming. In the end, not one of these insiders knew anything. The Gobert trade shocked everyone and apparently Ainge and Zanik kept the Gobert negotiation under wraps.
 
Sam Presti is at the pool at the Grand America right now. Is he teaching us how to tank? If someone needs a pic, can do. Happy 4th yall.

Then again, the summer league features OKC so he is probably just here for that.
 
Elizah Huge said:
I’m pretty sure only pick they could trade is their 2029 pick if they got rid of the protections on the 2025/2027 1sts they sent out.
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I did it without looking it up. I might do it for swaps on 28 and an unprotected 29 pick. Prior to moving Rudy I would have said no to To it’s because it makes it really hard to duck the tax… I think he could pick up some of his value again in a pick and roll heavy team and then you repackage him for another pick.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
The thing I’m looking at now is a potential Tobias Harris deal now that we have all these spare parts. The Philly pick situation is a little murky… but I think they can give up some picks with other conditions satisfied type of language. Bev, Bogey, etc for Tobias and picks is the type of buy low get some stuff type of package I’d look for.
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Morey loves former Rockets players.

Bojan, Beverly, and Gay for Tobias?

The only thing is I don’t see Danny taking on a big contract for 2023+beyond
 
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