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Voter Suppression and Why The Republicans Love It So Much?

Red said:
...when things are self evident to someone, it actually is harder to break down the reasons. ... that actually makes it more difficult to explain how I know to someone who does not have the needed experience. Similar with demagogues and authoritarians I guess. I know them when I see them, and it is most difficult to reverse engineer second nature understanding.
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Understood. If at a later date you want to dig in to where to draw lines in these terms I’m more than up for it and as always I won’t judge you even if taking a stance antithetical to what I believe. I will attack an idea from time to time but I believe those should be fair game.

I will leave it at this: It is the video from the historian I respect who used authoritarian in the same way you did in breaking down his list of authoritarian Presidents. I wouldn't blame you for being skeptical but as far as I can tell this historian's personal politics are moderate left. Although he does not list the administration in power when he made this back in 2018, he does plaster a reference to the article I link at the bottom which should give a good indication of his thoughts on that administration.


robertreich.org

7 Signs of Tyranny

As tyrants take control of democracies, they typically do 7 things: 1. They exaggerate their mandate to govern – claiming, for example, that they won an election by a “landslide” even after losing...
robertreich.org robertreich.org
 
Crazy how you hypocrites no longer talk about this now that you're bullying and literally forcing people to have vaccine IDs. Voting ID was racist but your vaccinate passports aren't? I thought black people were too stupid to get IDs? That what this thread is about. Black people being too stupid. Now you same people are calling black people stupid for not getting a vaccine ID.

Explain that... Explain your plantation racist ideology to me please.
 
One Brow said:
They do have a racist impact.


No ne but you thought it was about intelligence.

However, you get the vaccine card when you get vaccinated, so it's not a separate trip.
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But... Democrats are saying that black people can't get to the ID place but yet they can get to the vaccination place?

Explain that.
 
JazzyFresh said:
But... Democrats are saying that black people can't get to the ID place but yet they can get to the vaccination place?

Explain that.
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To my knowledge, "Democrats" as a group are not saying this. Some individuals might be saying this. You have an example?
 
One Brow said:
To my knowledge, "Democrats" as a group are not saying this. Some individuals might be saying this. You have an example?
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Then explain why wanting an id to vote is racist.

Was id'ing for Obamacare racist? You needed verification of identity for that.
 
JazzyFresh said:
Then explain why wanting an id to vote is racist.
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It's aimed at the part of the population that are least likely to have IDs, which are largely people of color.

JazzyFresh said:
Was id'ing for Obamacare racist? You needed verification of identity for that.
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The large group of the people who have the most trouble getting IDs qualify for Medicaid, and so don't use Obamacare.
 
One Brow said:
It's aimed at the part of the population that are least likely to have IDs, which are largely people of color.


The large group of the people who have the most trouble getting IDs qualify for Medicaid, and so don't use Obamacare.
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So why can't black people get IDs even though most of them have them? Every other race is capable but not African Americans? Seems racist
 
JazzyFresh said:
So why can't black people get IDs even though most of them have them? Every other race is capable but not African Americans? Seems racist
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You quoted me, but did not respond to nor reflect what I actually said. I'm not responsible for arguing with your fantasy.
 
One Brow said:
You quoted me, but did not respond to nor reflect what I actually said. I'm not responsible for arguing with your fantasy.
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Can't answer it can you? You can't answer why African Americans are incapable of getting IDs yet somehow they are capable of getting a vaccine.

I find the idea that they are incapable racist
 
One Brow said:
You quoted me, but did not respond to nor reflect what I actually said. I'm not responsible for arguing with your fantasy.
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Hans von Spakovsky, a senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation, notes, "Virtually every person of voting age already has such IDs, and those who do not can easily get them. Every state with an ID requirement issues a free ID to anyone who doesn't already have one. Despite the empty howls of 'repression,' states that have implemented ID requirements have seen turnout go up, not down."

Democrats are just using black people so they can cheat.
 
JazzyFresh said:
Can't answer it can you? You can't answer why African Americans are incapable of getting IDs yet somehow they are capable of getting a vaccine.

I find the idea that they are incapable racist
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I agree I won't defend a position I don't support and a point I don't make.

JazzyFresh said:
Hans von Spakovsky, a senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation, notes, "Virtually every person of voting age already has such IDs, and those who do not can easily get them. Every state with an ID requirement issues a free ID to anyone who doesn't already have one. Despite the empty howls of 'repression,' states that have implemented ID requirements have seen turnout go up, not down."
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Good for Spakovsky, but I don't see how this changes the intent of the voter ID laws.

JazzyFresh said:
Democrats are just using black people so they can cheat.
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They are cheating by trying to make it easier for black people to vote?
 
Red said:
@The Thriller

papers.ssrn.com

Identifying and Minimizing the Risk of Election Subversion and Stolen Elections in the Contemporary United States

The United States faces a serious risk that the 2024 presidential election, and other future U.S. elections, will not be conducted fairly, and that the candidat
papers.ssrn.com
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Thanks. Excellent find. Very interesting. What do you make of his suggestions?

The solutions to these problems are both legal and political. Legal changes should include: (1) paper ballot, chain-of-custody, and transparency requirements, including risk-limiting audits of election results; (2) rules limiting the discretion of those who certify the votes, including Congress through reform of the Electoral Count Act; (3) rules limiting the over-politicization of election administration, especially by state legislatures; (4) increased criminal penalties imposed on those who tamper with federal elections or commit violence or intimidation of voters, elected officials, or elected candidates; and (5) rules countering disinformation about elections, particularly disinformation about when, where, and how people vote. In addition, it will be necessary to organize for political action to reenforce rule-of-law norms in elections. This means advocating for laws that deter election subversion and against laws making stolen elections easier; politically opposing would-be election administrators who embrace false claims about stolen elections; and preparing for mass, peaceful protests in the event of attempts to subvert fair election outcomes.
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I think 2 & 4 are extremely reasonable. Currently, all you need is one House member and one Senate member to refuse to certify and now you can cause a disruption. Why not raise that threshold to a majority or to 2/3rds majority?
I think there needs to be stronger penalties for those peddling nonsense. Sidney Powell is a perfect example. Like how is this woman still free? And why is she still given a platform?


I think what's going to be difficult are rules 3 & 5. Right now, it's a litmus test to be a Republican to pass voter suppression laws and laws that provide party apparatchiks power to overturn elections. Red states are passing these laws almost weekly. The disinformation comes now from domestic sources and media platforms. They're then amplified by Russian intelligence sources/troll farms. I don't know how you fix this. Facebook makes money by letting setting its algorithm to promote conspiracy; they get the most reaction.
 
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The Thriller said:
Thanks. Excellent find. Very interesting. What do you make of his suggestions?


I think 2 & 4 are extremely reasonable. Currently, all you need is one House member and one Senate member to refuse to certify and now you can cause a disruption. Why not raise that threshold to a majority or to 2/3rds majority?
I think there needs to be stronger penalties for those peddling nonsense. Sidney Powell is a perfect example. Like how is this woman still free? And why is she still given a platform?


I think what's going to be difficult are rules 3 & 5. Right now, it's a litmus test to be a Republican to pass voter suppression laws and laws that provide party apparatchiks power to overturn elections. Red states are passing these laws almost weekly. The disinformation comes now from domestic sources and media platforms. They're then amplified by Russian intelligence sources/troll farms. I don't know how you fix this. Facebook makes money by letting setting its algorithm to promote conspiracy; they get the most reaction.
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Overall, I like his suggestions, but I’m not optimistic that we can avoid further damage caused by the existence of competing narratives, one based in reality, and one based on the Big Lie. Especially since it seems unlikely the Democrats can/will pass their election reform bill(s) before the 2022 mid terms. So it’s hard to see how the 2024 election will be anything less than a nightmare, should it be close. And if Trump runs again, forget it, it will be a chaotic post election period. Here’s another old familiar face who needs to testify before the Jan. 6th commission:

www.independent.co.uk

Bannon admits he helped plan 6 January Trump rally to ‘kill the Biden presidency’

Former White House strategist ‘privately told President Trump to have a reckoning on January 6th,’ Robert Costa says
www.independent.co.uk www.independent.co.uk
 
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