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We need to trade Hayward now

franklin said:
I'd rather push up Burks value and trade him.

He looked like the dumbest player in the NBA last night. Bad rotations, missed freethrows because he's always gassed, throws the ball to who the hell knows where, doesn't set good pics, stagnates the offense... Burks has all the physical tools but the brain of a squirrel.
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He's still young, but yeah I agree.

Just curious though, what do you think we can get for Hayward right now?
 
fishonjazz said:
Funny how corbin thought burks was smart enough to be able to learn a new position (point guard)..... which happens to be the position where you need to be cerebral the most.

If burks is so dumb then corbin should have had hayward be the one learning the point and just kept burks at the 2 guard last year when mo went down.
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Have Hayward as the only playmaker on the floor with Foye and Carroll would have been ugly. Burks was the obvious choice to backup Tinsley and Watson, a pretty low bar to set for a third string point guard.
 
spycam1 said:
He almost had a triple double tonight. Calm down. Sheesh.

I can just imagine how quickly some people will give up on Wiggins after we draft him.
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Those are good stats. tell me how he impacted the game in a meaningful way.
He is not someone that can impose his will or take over a game with his play.
He does not influence the game much. he is just kinda there.
Hayward is very good but that's as far as it goes.
 
franklin said:
Not enough.
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It's harder than you think. Who would give up assets knowing he's going to command 10-12 mil/year the next year? We'd have to take back someone like Rudy Gay and get a first rounder, but who wants to watch Rudy Gay on this team for the next 3 years?

Also another question. If you had to choose our future SG, Alec Burks at 5 mil/year for the next 4 years or Hayward at 11 mil?
 
franklin said:
He looked like the dumbest player in the NBA last night. Bad rotations, missed freethrows because he's always gassed, throws the ball to who the hell knows where, doesn't set good pics, stagnates the offense
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Just watched the first half on dvr.
Burks was 1 of 2 from the field (dat ball hog doe), zero turnovers/bad passes, and the guy he was guarding scored ZERO pts.

Free throw shooting was his only weakness (though a pretty big one)
 
franklin said:
Have Hayward as the only playmaker on the floor with Foye and Carroll would have been ugly. Burks was the obvious choice to backup Tinsley and Watson, a pretty low bar to set for a third string point guard.
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Foye could have been another choice but corbin thought burks could handle it.... and corbin was correct
 
Funy Ive been saying this since Jaz drafted him. I know its hard for some of you to admit but what I say usually turns out to be right. go back in look at my history on all subjects ive schooled jazz fans on. Think soe around here was saying Hayward is worth the same as Pul George.LMAO
 
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This is hilarious. So many people were begging for the young players to get minutes, and they get them and suck. Then they demand that those same young players be immediately traded because they play the way that Corbin KNEW they would if he gave them time.

As has been pointed out, Hayward was close to a triple double, and as is the case with LeBron sometimes, he was facilitating in the second half because the defense was focusing on him. Apparently he hasn't learned to get his and facilitate at the same time. Maybe if he gets some time on the floor to figure this out with actual defenses that are actually focusing on him rather than in practice or coming off the bench, than he'll learn. Maybe, just maybe.

Or we can trade him and trade every player who has a bad couple nights. (while nearly getting a triple double)
 
fishonjazz said:
Funny how corbin thought burks was smart enough to be able to learn a new position (point guard)..... which happens to be the position where you need to be cerebral the most.

If burks is so dumb then corbin should have had hayward be the one learning the point and just kept burks at the 2 guard last year when mo went down.
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Hayward cant run the pg so just stop it. He can fill in for stretches but he is a point forward if anything.
 
fishonjazz said:
Just watched the first half on dvr.
Burks was 1 of 2 from the field (dat ball hog doe), zero turnovers/bad passes, and the guy he was guarding scored ZERO pts.

Free throw shooting was his only weakness (though a pretty big one)
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I have never read anyone calling him a ball hog, what's that all about? Burks is far from a ball hog. In fact, I'd say he's too unselfish (hesitant) at times. Kanter too.

fishonjazz said:
Foye could have been another choice but corbin thought burks could handle it.... and corbin was correct
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Your trying to make more out of it than whats there. He only played 37 minutes at point according to 82games.com.

Playing him at point over Foye was a no brainer, don't see why you think it means anything.
 
fishonjazz said:
Just watched the first half on dvr.
Burks was 1 of 2 from the field (dat ball hog doe), zero turnovers/bad passes, and the guy he was guarding scored ZERO pts.

Free throw shooting was his only weakness (though a pretty big one)
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Just watched the second half.

Burks man scored ZERO pts again.
He was 5 of 7 from the field. (his outside shot was on. 4 of his 6 made field goals for the game were outside jumpshots)
2 of 2 from the line.
1 bad pass to favors
2 turnovers (one carry, and one play on a fast break the ball was poked away from behind)
Subway sub of the game again.... morgan jewelers play of the game again.

Oh and btw franklin... you said he was missing free through because he was "gassed".
He was 1 of 5 from the line in the first half when he played about 10 minutes.
He was 2 of 2 in the second half when he played about 17 minutes
 
franklin said:
I have never read anyone calling him a ball hog, what's that all about?
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Lol
I have seen many people call him a chucker/ball hog (maybe not you)
 
I prefer visual signs of fatigue over a minute stat that doesn't tell us anything. Rewind that dvr and watch how heavy he's breathing and heavy his arms look. Maybe he was hustling a lot and playing harder than anyone else on the court.
 
fishonjazz said:
Lol
I have seen many people call him a chucker/ball hog (maybe not you)
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From franklin (nice find by Zulu in the free alec burks thread)
At this point, Foye>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Burks at running an NBA offense. Burks is not even in the point guard conversation outside dreamy eyed homers on jazzfanz.

Quick, someone find a highlight of Burks showing anything besides Burks shooting. See you next season.


Sorry franklin for coming at you so much today, but your burks hate (when he is arguably the best player on the team so far this year) got under my skin.
I liked you in person when I met you at poker night and im sure you are better than I give you credit for.
And to your credit, so far this year you have said a few nice things about burks, so maybe you will come all the way around and join the burks church congregation one day. :)
 
fishonjazz said:
From franklin (nice find by Zulu in the free alec burks thread)
At this point, Foye>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.Burks at running an NBA offense. Burks is not even in the point guard conversation outside dreamy eyed homers on jazzfanz.
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You took that out of context.

That was before Corbin took 3 days teaching burks the PnR, at which point I credited them for their improvements. You only credited burks and blamed Corbin for not playing him sooner acting like he had the skills all along but Corbin was too dumb too dumb yo.

fishonjazz said:
Quick, someone find a highlight of Burks showing anything besides Burks shooting. See you next season.
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Also out of context. This was posted before Burks did anything well on the offensive end, but posters were calling him Dwayne Wade. It was a true statement then but would not be now.


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I didn't think you were coming at me, no offense was taken.
 
This song comes for Hayward haters;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hkt8E2Ul-Xw

Seriously there is no way to please some people. The guy just missed the triple-double with two assists. He made some dumb mistakes, but in overal it was a good performance. He is putting up some good numbers and not hurting the tank at the same time. What else can you ask for? geez...
 
GVC said:
A few points:

1. I really noticed the bulk Hayward added up top. Gives me hope that he can become more of a difference maker defensively and perhaps finish stronger through contact. He did a poor job fighting through screens early last night, and hasn't yet shown halfcourt finishing ability, but it's definitely worth waiting more than 2 games to decide he isn't going to improve in these two areas.

2. The last 3 notwithstanding, his pull-up J is ugly. The new NBA.com stats haven't updated through last night's game, but he only hit the one and probably shot 5+. He was 0-7 on pull-up jumpers in game 1. He passes well off the bounce, but he's going to have to figure out some way to score off the bounce (finding a floater, finishing better through contact, whatever) or he'll only really be suited for an off-ball role in the halfcourt.

3. Still a beast in transition.

4. Clearly pressing a little. He'll settle down as the season progresses and once Burke comes back and takes a little pressure off him.
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The added bulk could be hurting his jumper some. Having a naturally slow release though, I don't ever see him excelling there. He'll always need his time to set, gather himself, and launch. Burke was fairly good at this in college, so we'll want the ball in his hands eventually in late clock situations, and can stick to using Hayward for what he is good at.
 
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