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With the 47th Pick, Kevin Murphy

billyshelby said:
The whole thinking of "what Mo could mean to us" has to stop. That's not relevant to the deal. The only thing relevant is about equalizing value. The Clippers get Odom for Mo -- win. Dallas saves 3 million getting rid of Odom for free -- win. But they can't "win" if we don't use our TPE for Mo.

Our TPE is worth something. And it's not the sticker price on overpaid Mo. In this case, it's the price of facilitating the deal for our rivals. In other cases, it's absorbing somebody else's unwanted for another asset.

So if we don't get something, it's not worth it to give up our TPE for Mo.
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Anyone arguing otherwise just got pwned
 
You do realize that if you use the TPE on anyone, you are helping that team out by saving them money? I consider giving a team Lamar Odom to be helping us.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
Getting Odom is a win? You can't be serious? Sounds like a desperate attempt to add a player.

Dallas saves 3 million? Is that really enough for us to not do a deal? Because someone saves 3 million?

We add a good player for free, it's worth it.
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Getting Odom FOR Williams is a win

Dallas saving 3 million is a win, particularly in light of their obvious desperation to shed salary.

This isn't about getting a good player "for free." It would be if getting Mo Williams was the same value as LA getting Odom or Dallas shedding 3 million off their bloated cap. But Williams is poison on the trade market thanks to his salary. The Clips are stuck with him. And Dallas should be stuck with having to just waive Odom and take the 3 mil cap hit.

So why are we pretending that we should be happy to just get Mo?
 
billyshelby said:
Getting Odom FOR Williams is a win

Dallas saving 3 million is a win, particularly in light of their obvious desperation to shed salary.

This isn't about getting a good player "for free." It would be if getting Mo Williams was the same value as LA getting Odom or Dallas shedding 3 million off their bloated cap. But Williams is poison on the trade market thanks to his salary. The Clips are stuck with him. And Dallas should be stuck with having to just waive Odom and take the 3 mil cap hit.

So why are we pretending that we should be happy to just get Mo?
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Yes. Getting Mo is good.
 
Saltair's Finest said:
I trust u know what ur talking about Best so can we still bakc out Of the trade and Do TPE for someone else? Whats the cap?
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This could be a long answer. But the short answer is: 1) Yes, we can still back out; 2) Yes, we can use the TPE for many things; 3) Acquiring Mo Williams with our TPE without getting something back is what Isiah Thomas would do.

The Cap is something you're going to have to figure out.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
Yes. Getting Mo is good.
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I'll try one more time. Getting Mo is "good" is not the point. Getting fair value for acquiring Mo with our TPE is the only question. The other 2 teams NEED us to acquire Mo in order to make their "good" deals work. If we walk away, the Clips are stuck with Mo and Dallas has to waive Odom. Ergo, they will not get their good deals, and they will cry.

But they don't have to. All they have to do is pay not to cry, just like life. And all KOC has to do is make them pay not to cry. This is Negotiation 101. Do you really not get this?
 
billyshelby said:
I'll try one more time. Getting Mo is "good" is not the point. Getting fair value for acquiring Mo with our TPE is the only question. The other 2 teams NEED us to acquire Mo in order to make their "good" deals work. If we walk away, the Clips are stuck with Mo and Dallas has to waive Odom. Ergo, they will not get their good deals, and they will cry.

But they don't have to. All they have to do is pay not to cry, just like life. And all KOC has to do is make them pay not to cry. This is Negotiation 101. Do you really not get this?
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I guess I don't get it because the trade sounds good to me. It sounded good to the Jazz too when they agreed to it.
 
Wes Mantooth said:
A complete waste of a pick. We have Hayward at the 2. And Burks. And this guy looks like a chucker who's a 2 and 2 only. We don't need him taking shots away from Favors and Co. ****ing shoot me. I just wasted the last four hours of my life.

Cy--You act as if any shooter is going to save us. Newsflash. This guy will never start for us nor be on the floor in any important situation so it doesn't matter. Just shoot me now.
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Calm down, it means the end of CJ and thats all that matters.
 
billyshelby said:
I'll try one more time. Getting Mo is "good" is not the point. Getting fair value for acquiring Mo with our TPE is the only question. The other 2 teams NEED us to acquire Mo in order to make their "good" deals work. If we walk away, the Clips are stuck with Mo and Dallas has to waive Odom. Ergo, they will not get their good deals, and they will cry.

But they don't have to. All they have to do is pay not to cry, just like life. And all KOC has to do is make them pay not to cry. This is Negotiation 101. Do you really not get this?
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I think what Cy is saying is that he thinks that getting Mo Williams is worth it in exchange for the Okur TPE.

But what you're saying is that Mo Williams alone is not 'enough' - you're wanting something more for compensation.

It then comes down to how much you value Mo Williams. And as of this moment, I'm thinking KOC values Williams quite highly actually. Although this seems to be changing a wee bit now:

Brian T. Smith ‏@tribjazz
Mo Williams update: Still could happen. Nothing set, though, and Jazz backing off somewhat. Interested, but delayed situation isn't helping.
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Cyrone Torbin said:
I guess I don't get it because the trade sounds good to me. It sounded good to the Jazz too when they agreed to it.
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Right, but at the moment we don't know the full terms. Since it can't be consummated until tomorrow, we wouldn't have heard if Dallas was drafting for us tonight. Or additionally, we wouldn't know yet what future draft picks might be part of the deal.

We have to get back at least a meaningless 2nd as per the CBA. But we should be getting something much better than that considering our valuable role. As a final point, the headline on ESPN RIGHT NOW is "Jazz may help Clips get Odom" Not "Jazz score Williams in Clippers deal for Odom with Mavs."
 
dalamon said:
Just noticed that Darius Miller was picked 46th.



****.
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Actually I think KOC may have picked Kevin over Miller anyway (something to do with him being a really good shooter). Earlier picks could be had for cash but they didn't go for it and instead waited for Kevin to fall on their lap.
 
Getting Mo Williams for our soon-to-expire TPE is adding player value to our team without hurting our cap situation at the end of the year. That's already a win for us. We can then trade either Williams or Harris for another asset and hence improve the team. There's value in that.
 
billyshelby said:
Right, but at the moment we don't know the full terms. Since it can't be consummated until tomorrow, we wouldn't have heard if Dallas was drafting for us tonight. Or additionally, we wouldn't know yet what future draft picks might be part of the deal.

We have to get back at least a meaningless 2nd as per the CBA. But we should be getting something much better than that considering our valuable role. As a final point, the headline on ESPN RIGHT NOW is "Jazz may help Clips get Odom" Not "Jazz score Williams in Clippers deal for Odom with Mavs."
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If we can get picks, then great, consider me to be a happy little school girl.

As for the ESPN headline, of course it's going to be LA centric. The Clippers could be getting Jarron Collins and it would still read "Jazz May Help Clips Get Collins".
 
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Also this Mo Williams talk is redic, we aren't getting nearly enough. Glad to hear Brian Smith talking about it starting to fall apart.
 
Catchall said:
Getting Mo Williams for our soon-to-expire TPE is adding player value to our team without hurting our cap situation at the end of the year. That's already a win for us. We can then trade either Williams or Harris for another asset and hence improve the team. There's value in that.
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Our "soon to expire" TPE doesn't expire until December.
 
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