Let's just assume Trey Burke has figured this NBA thing out...

[Thee Jazz Fan]

Perhaps this is the answer. I don't see anything in Exum that makes me think he can be an effective NBA SG at this point, but if Snyder can play him a few minutes here and there and get him to 20-25, that should be enough for him to show what he's capable of.

There is no way in hell I see Exum getting 20-25 mins a game. He is too young and raw to throw him to the wolves. That would ruin him. He needs to improve his ball handling and his shot and body, and learn to play with men before he takes on that big a role




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[Stoked]

There is no way in hell I see Exum getting 20-25 mins a game. He is too young and raw to throw him to the wolves. That would ruin him. He needs to improve his ball handling and his shot and body, and learn to play with men before he takes on that big a role


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I don't think so. I see 20 mpg as a likely scenario for him tbh. About 12 mpg as the backup PG and then 8 mpg in a various linups with him on the floor with Burke.

 

[da ThRONe]

Wow!! You guys are fickle bunch. One good preseason game and all of the sudden Burke is a star? A few days ago Burke was a guy tabbed as someone who was a blabbering idiot looking like a fool with his pants on the ground, too now being a top pg. ****ing hilarious!! As of now to me, he's still a small un athletic scoring pg that is slow with no hops. With that said I hope he proves me wrong, but a lot of you need to slow your roll.


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Sadly I agree with your point that people are overreacting to Burke's good "pre"-season game. This coming from someone that believes Trey is as good as last night and will be a top PG in his prime.

Where you lose me is calling him an un-athletic, scoring PG, and suggesting his height will prevent him from succeeding. He is a smart athlete again with many of the same strengths and weaknesses to Chris Paul. He has great vision and damn good passing skills. You don't break assist records if you are a selfish player. Let's give him a year in a real offensives system before we make any concrete statements about the player he will be and that goes both ways.

 

[BabyPeterzz]

Gotta love what Trey has shown so far. He looks better than he did in SL, granted he has better players around him. How quickly this board forgot how well he played coming back from injury last season. Before he hit the wall, he had this team playing .500 ball. I think he'll hit a wall again this year, but he'll have longer stretches of solid play. Exum taking Trey's job looks pretty far off at this point.

Exum is obv a project and will take a few seasons before we see what he's really capable of. And this is fine. The whole team still has growing to do and Exum's progression should fit right in. Hopefully we'll know who he is come Trey's extension.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

Sadly I agree with your point that people are overreacting to Burke's good "pre"-season game. This coming from someone that believes Trey is as good as last night and will be a top PG in his prime.

Where you lose me is calling him an un-athletic, scoring PG, and suggesting his height will prevent him from succeeding. He is a smart athlete again with many of the same strengths and weaknesses to Chris Paul. He has great vision and damn good passing skills. You don't break assist records if you are a selfish player. Let's give him a year in a real offensives system before we make any concrete statements about the player he will be and that goes both ways.

So, taking 15 shots a game at the pg position as a pg tells you he will be a great distributor of the ball. I'm not saying he won't succeed because he's small. I'm saying he will come up short because of his style of play, and fact is, compared to most pg's he's not as athletic quick or explosive, and not an elite leaper, you need some of these things to be a scoring pg otherwise he'll need 20 shots for 20 points. Oh... By the way. He's an inconsistent shooter at best, and that's what he likes to do! Your talk of him being a great floor general and elite passer, and I know he was a rookie and all, but I didn't see enough of this from him last year.


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[Goodluckchuck]

I honestly thought Burke did pretty good after his injury last year. And then when he hit the "rookie wall" he didn't play as well. So although he is playing like a boss right now. I will hold judgement on him figuring out the NBA until we see his play later in the year.

 

[Stoked]

Wow!! You guys are fickle bunch. One good preseason game and all of the sudden Burke is a star? A few days ago Burke was a guy tabbed as someone who was a blabbering idiot looking like a fool with his pants on the ground, too now being a top pg. ****ing hilarious!! As of now to me, he's still a small un athletic scoring pg that is slow with no hops. With that said I hope he proves me wrong, but a lot of you need to slow your roll.


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Fair enough but you need to stop being his biggest hater.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

Fair enough but you need to stop being his biggest hater.

I thought that was Orangello, seriously I'm not hating on him at all, I'm just speaking the truth as I see it. The only way I see him becoming a really good player in this league is if he completely changes his style of play, and becomes a distributing point guard rather then a point guard who looks to score.


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[Thee Jazz Fan]

Like I said above. I hope he proves me wrong.


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[AlaskanAssassin]

I felt like Trey looked a little quicker, which might be the best thing we could see out of him.

 

[Willie]

It's just two pre-season games in - small sample size, probably mostly meaningless sample size, so let's keep all this perspective - but it's fun to speculate.

Having said all that, while I've been down on Burke and am still very skeptical - as well as he's played, he is still small, lacks quickness, hasn't ever shot the ball consistently over any long stretches - the fact is, he was a big time player in college, the number 9 overall draft pick, some thought he was the best player in the draft last year, it wouldn't be all that far fetched for him to become a very good PG in the NBA.

So again, let's assume for a minute he is the PG of the future the Jazz thought they drafted last year...

Did the Jazz just draft a back up PG in their supposed tank year with the 5th overall pick? I think we all mostly agree and it's very clear Exum is a PG in every sense and if he's going to be a good player in the league, it will be at PG. Maybe best case, in a couple years, Burke gets hurt for an extended period, Exum shows what he can do as the starting PG, both have good trade value and they turn a great trade using one of them as bait.

Have you paid any attention the guard-play in Quin's system? There's absolutely no issue here. No potential for a logjam. Sorry you're missing the point of the system.

 

[Willie]

I'm under the impression that it might be difficult to become a great player when you're only playing 10-15 minutes a game in a back up role. I'm probably the naive one. Maybe you can become great in just 10-15 minutes as a back up.

I remember reading something on jazzfanz about a NEG TRAIN. Right?

 

[da ThRONe]

So, taking 15 shots a game at the pg position as a pg tells you he will be a great distributor of the ball. I'm not saying he won't succeed because he's small. I'm saying he will come up short because of his style of play, and fact is, compared to most pg's he's not as athletic quick or explosive, and not an elite leaper, you need some of these things to be a scoring pg otherwise he'll need 20 shots for 20 points. Oh... By the way. He's an inconsistent shooter at best, and that's what he likes to do! Your talk of him being a great floor general and elite passer, and I know he was a rookie and all, but I didn't see enough of this from him last year.


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You are making all these definitive statements about Burke after a rookie season dealing with an injury on his index finger on his shooting hand. Calling him an inconsistent shooter at best just shows your want to dismiss Burke for personal reasons.

I don't know how you can classify Burke as a scoring PG when he averaged 12.8 shots his rookie season within such a poorly structured offense. Most of which were 3pt shots late in the shot clock because the offense failed to get a better look. Not to mention he lead the team in assist per game.

Athletically Burke is about average for a starting PG again so is Chris Paul. I agree Burke success will come down to his mid range jumper and his ability to get teammates involved. But instead of saying a bunch of things based on his rookie season under Corbin we reserve judgement into the season is in full swing under Synder.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

You are making all these definitive statements about Burke after a rookie season dealing with an injury on his index finger on his shooting hand. Calling him an inconsistent shooter at best just shows your want to dismiss Burke for personal reasons.

I don't know how you can classify Burke as a scoring PG when he averaged 12.8 shots his rookie season within such a poorly structured offense. Most of which were 3pt shots late in the shot clock because the offense failed to get a better look. Not to mention he lead the team in assist per game.

Athletically Burke is about average for a starting PG again so is Chris Paul. I agree Burke success will come down to his mid range jumper and his ability to get teammates involved. But instead of saying a bunch of things based on his rookie season under Corbin we reserve judgement into the season is in full swing under Synder.

I don't have time for agendas! Forgive me if wrong, but aren't you the one who joined jazzfanz solely because Burke is on the team? You if anyone is the one with the agenda. I have a history of admitting when wrong, and I'm always rooting for Burke and all players to succeed and improve. I've always complimented players when deserving and vice versa.

I understand the injury, but it was fully healed, and wasn't a problem after a certain time. He was inconsistent all year. He had plenty of time to overcome the hand issue.


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[Stifle Tower]

Without an injury to give him an opportunity, how does Exum become a great player, playing 10-15 minutes a game backing up Burke?

Let's HOPE the Jazz are blessed with the problem of having TOO MANY good players. We've seen Quin get creative, even using Hayward at PF in a small line-up. Jazz need a core-8 to succeed. And face it, there are always injuries here and there. Most teams only 1-2 players who play all 82 games. And there is always roster movement. Guys you count on staying decide to sign deals elsewhere as UFA's. Or teams decide their RFA's are just going to be too expensive and a trade is made.

Right now, Exum and Hood are quite far away from being impact players. Dante is likely a couple of years away.

If this were a traditional offense, I'd say play Exum 15-18 mins behind Trey and Rodney the same behind Hayward. That's plenty. But we've heard Quin is going to initiate the attack from both sides. So there is room to play Burke and Exum together. Just because the Jazz have rarely played two PG's together doesn't mean it won't work.

Between the 1-2-3 positions there are 144 mins available per game. Let's assume Burke, Burk and Hayward are the starters and average around 30 mins each. They may go more, or with the uptempo play and better bench, maybe their mins are held down a bit. In any case, that leaves around 50-54 mins for backups. Slot in Hood and Exum and you could have a great 5-man rotation. Or add someone else like Murry, Felix, etc. and you can go with 6 players, with the backups getting 15-25 mins.

There is so much that could happen over the course of the next 2-3 years. Jazz once faced a situation with a starting PG just a few years removed from an all-star appearance. He was a very good starter. Hot Rod called him "the fastest of them all." But he was traded to make room for some guy named Stockton, who took a couple of years to develop before exploding as the starter.

And we haven't even factored in injuries. Look at Phoenix losing Bledsoe for quite some time...or Chicago with Rose, Boston with Rondo, etc. The minutes situation will work itself out, especially with a faster pace.

 

[GVC]

With Exum's size, both can actually play together. Lots of situations call for as many ball handlers as you can muster, and in those situations we won't be giving anything up except an outside threat from the shooting guard position, which is mitigated somewhat by the added creativity and play making abilities.

Even as it stands now, I see them playing a couple minutes together in most games.

Two things will determine their ability to play together:

1. Their ability to defend NBA backcourts. Dante looks to have the length and lateral quickness to defend bigger NBA guards, especially once he fills out a little, so I don't think this is much of a concern.

2. Their ability to play off-ball in halfcourt sets. I think Trey projects as a decent spot-up shooter. Dante may be able to work the baseline a la Ronnie Brewer, especially if the Jazz are playing a big who can stretch the floor (Kanter?).

The extra ball handling gives the Jazz the option of initiating the offense with the player with the most favorable matchup in the halfcourt, and probably also helps in transition. I don't think playing the two together is a problem at all, even right now.

 

[Darkwing Duck]

I've always predicted Burke to be on sort of a Derek Fisher NBA path with better stats. Burke's rookie year rates slightly unfavorably to Fisher's best year, so a better Derek Fisher seems like a good projection.

 

[da ThRONe]

I don't have time for agendas! Forgive me if wrong, but aren't you the one who joined jazzfanz solely because Burke is on the team? You if anyone is the one with the agenda. I have a history of admitting when wrong, and I'm always rooting for Burke and all players to succeed and improve. I've always complimented players when deserving and vice versa.

I understand the injury, but it was fully healed, and wasn't a problem after a certain time. He was inconsistent all year. He had plenty of time to overcome the hand issue.


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My reason and your reason for frequenting this site has no barrings on my point. You have labeled Burke after his rookie year. I'm not saying Burke is or isn't anything just yet. So I don't see how I could be pushing an agenda when I'm taking the wait and see approach as I always do even when I have a strong opinion about a player.

Saying a injury is healed therefore he should have shot the ball well ignores so many more factors at play that we may not even think of. That's why I say instead of making such concrete statements like "Burke's an inconsistent shooter" you just wait until this season now that he'll have a full season before making such claims.

 

[GVC]

I've always predicted Burke to be on sort of a Derek Fisher NBA path with better stats. Burke's rookie year rates slightly unfavorably to Fisher's best year, so a better Derek Fisher seems like a good projection.

Fisher was also regarded as a pretty damn good defender in his prime. Not sure Trey has the frame/strength to become the defender Fish was.

 

[fishonjazz]

Not sure Trey has the frame/strength to become the defender Fish was.

Thanks bro