Joseph Smith taught that the moon was inhabited by people that live to be 1000 years old?

[babe]

I wonder if other Sports-Based message boards talk this much about religion. Somebody check the Charlotte Bobcats board and see if there is some discussion about the history of the Baptist church.

When the "Jazz" moved to Utah, a lot of folks wondered how Utah could even think of keeping that "Jazz" name. Utah has a reputation. . . had a reputation. . . . as the ultimate hickville on the ultimate backroad cut off from all progress. . . . and fun. . . .

but it was a stroke of genius to keep that name. . . . just like me using "babe" when I'm the oldest member on this board. . . .

Because it's attitude that really counts, not what others expect. You go out and just be the best.

Same thing with Mormons.

 

[Beantown]

But it is prohibited by their religion just as booze and cigs are prohibited by yours.

No argument there, but its not on the same level as someone stopping an addictive daily habit.

 

[Nate505]

This is no more crazy than the Bible claiming that people lived to be 500-1000 years old back in the good old days of no medicine.

I remember being lectured by my half-sister's Jehovah's Witness grandmother about how man was doomed and how people lived to be 800 in the Bible. And she actually believed that stuff. Though I knew at that point to just politely smile and recognize that she wasn't to be taken seriously anymore.

 

[One Brow]

That's not having to stop a daily habit, nice try though.

True. And your kid's birthdays are just once a year, as are Christmas, Halloween, Easter, etc.

Besides, as has been mentioned on this forum, you don't have to give up caffeine or even coffee, as long as it's not made with hot water. Nice try, though.

 

[One Brow]

I found no evidence to suggest that the initial missionaries were converted on the force of Joseph's charisma as you claimed. Beans statements about the conversions revolving around the Book of Mormon seem to hold much more water from the conversion stories I read.

Wow, so you're saying the people newly converted to the religion talked about how good the religion was, and didn't say they were following some guy? I'm shocked, just shocked.

Honestly, I don't really care what you people tell yourselves about how unique your religion was. Why do you care so much about my opinion? If you don't, why try to hard to convince me?

 

[babe]

Wow, so you're saying the people newly converted to the religion talked about how good the religion was, and didn't say they were following some guy? I'm shocked, just shocked.

Honestly, I don't really care what you people tell yourselves about how unique your religion was. Why do you care so much about my opinion? If you don't, why try to hard to convince me?

Pearl is not LDS. Don't know if she wants me saying that, don't even know if she has decided to be LDS since oh mayber a couple of years ago when she said she wasn't. Don't care.

When I was an LDS missionary, we had a big picture of Joseph Fielding Smith in our little briefcases. We'd pull it out, point to it, and in broken pidgin English try to say "Prophet" so people could understand. I even used various filipino dialects, "Ang Propeta ng Diyos, Nayon." What it amounted to was something akin to idolatry, so far as the people we were talking to could surmise. Almost invariably, there was a little corner "Novena" in the living room or a bedroom in the house, where prayers were said to the Virgin Mary, or some other revered intercessor. The LDS believed those Novenas were idolatrous, and it would just have been those peoples' idea of things to pray to a picture of a Prophet. In the books of Moses, The Law, God said His people should reverence Him only, because He was a jealous God, and forbade having anything in our worship but Him. No government, no man, no organization. . . . . and, inferentially, no Virgin Mary or Saint or Apostle.

In my study of early Mormon conversions, there are many people who were truly charmed by Joseph Smith Jr., who knew upon meeting him, that he was a true prophet. Whether that is idolatry of any kind actually depends upon the fact, and whether it is--- in a persons' mind and heart---, a fact that precedes, or derives from, their actual focus on God. If the mind and heart take the person or information as secondary to their faith in God, I think it's no different from the way the Israelites understood Moses.

Well, let's just say the way the best of the Israelites understood Moses. I'm sure many people then had the same little stumbling stones of misplaced reverence for leaders as many of us do today.

 

[The Black Swordsman]

Wow, so you're saying the people newly converted to the religion talked about how good the religion was, and didn't say they were following some guy? I'm shocked, just shocked.

Honestly, I don't really care what you people tell yourselves about how unique your religion was. Why do you care so much about my opinion? If you don't, why try to hard to convince me?

At the end of the day most people don't really care what other people believe. They just want to know what you believe in so they have validation for what they themselves believe. This is true for theists as well as atheists. I don't care what others believe in.

 

[PearlWatson]

Wow, so you're saying the people newly converted to the religion talked about how good the religion was, and didn't say they were following some guy? I'm shocked, just shocked.

Honestly, I don't really care what you people tell yourselves about how unique your religion was. Why do you care so much about my opinion? If you don't, why try to hard to convince me?

I wondered about the charisma theory proposed in this thread by a few people, including you, so I looked into it to see if it had any credence. I didn't find any, especially considering the large amount of converts who never met Joseph until after committing to leave their homes and crossing an ocean to start anew. I even read one account of people meeting him and finding him not serious enough to be a prophet so they left.

I also think that the idea/belief that they were following a prophet that talked on behalf of God was more a factor than any "charisma" of the man acting in that capacity, although the 2 things are entangled.

 

[babe]

I wondered about the charisma theory proposed in this thread by a few people, including you, so I looked into it to see if it had any credence. I didn't find any, especially considering the large amount of converts who never met Joseph until after committing to leave their homes and crossing an ocean to start anew. I even read one account of people meeting him and finding him not serious enough to be a prophet so they left.

I also think that the idea/belief that they were following a prophet that talked on behalf of God was more a factor than any "charisma" of the man acting in that capacity, although the 2 things are entangled.

The film being shown at the LDS visitors' center, in the old Hotel Utah part of the operation, about Joseph Smith portrays some people having a positive reaction on meeting "The Prophet", and the message is clearly that people who knew him were influenced by the personal reality. . . . or charisma, as the case may be. . . .

One man characterized keeps his doubts clear up to the time he met the "Prophet", I believe. . . . though I may be mistaken. . . . it's in the part about the family coming up the Mississippi river on the steamboat to Nauvoo just at the time of his martyrdom.

my grandmother told me of her acqauintance with an older generation family member who was at Nauvoo when Joseph Smith was killed by the mob, and who was there when Brigham Young was accepted as the new Prophet. She said Joseph Smith had a chipped tooth, and had a distinctive whistle when he spoke, and that when Brigham Young arose to speak after the martydom of Joseph Smith, he miraculously took on the appearance and the whistle in his speech. . . . . and it was taken as a Divine manifestation to the Church affirming Brigham Young.

 

[colton]

I have little doubt that Joseph Smith was quite charismatic. I also have little doubt that most early LDS converts converted before actually ever meeting Joseph Smith. Most would not have met him until physically moving themselves/their family to Kirtland/Nauvoo to be with the main body of the saints.

 

[One Brow]

I have little doubt that Joseph Smith was quite charismatic. I also have little doubt that most early LDS converts converted before actually ever meeting Joseph Smith. Most would not have met him until physically moving themselves/their family to Kirtland/Nauvoo to be with the main body of the saints.

With the exception of the specific geographic location, those statement would apply equally well to Russell. The enthusiasm generated in a meeting with a charismatic founder becomes contagious, and spread beyond the personal sphere of the founder.

 

[Hartsock]

So are we for or against Aliens?

 

[Stoked]

So are we for or against Aliens?

For the hot green or blue skinned ones but against the fat ugly ones.

 

[Hartsock]

For the hot green or blue skinned ones but against the fat ugly ones.

So yay on the femalien type aliens and nay on the Men in Black ones?

 

[Stoked]

So yay on the femalien type aliens and nay on the Men in Black ones?

Yup.

 

[HipHopAnonymous]

So yay on the femalien type aliens and nay on the Men in Black ones?

Natasha Henstrige in Species would work. Except when she tries to kill/eat/lay eggs inside of you. More the naked hot and clueless parts.

 

[freakazoid]

 

[moevillini]

nice bump!



Oh wait, that's not a bump, that's just the guy's arm making a grab for it!
I need to observe more carefully before I comment...

 

[MVP]

So how many mormons lost their faith in "prophet" Smith after this?

 

[Qman]

So how many mormons lost their faith in "prophet" Smith after this?

Maybe 1. There seems to be serious doubts to the exact words spoken and to whom Smith was speaking. Basically not much to see here.