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TMZ reports that Kobe Bryant passed away.

Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
Either you believe in what the country was founded on or you don’t. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I’m just not willing to just believe someone’s word unless I know. I know Johnny Depp would have appreciated that. These are principles America was founded. Life isn’t perfect. God is if guilty he pays in the end. I’m not saying he’s innocent in the sight of God, but as far as the people goes, he’s innocent until otherwise
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So, only people who were convicted have done bad things. Got it.
 
"Over the next year and a half, his lawyers attacked the accuser’s credibility by pointing out she’d had sex with another man in the week before the alleged assault, that she’d attempted suicide in the past, and that she had been initially excited to meet Kobe. Her identity was also leaked."

This along with a 2.5M lawsuit settlement is more than enough for someone to not want to testify. To use that as evidence that he didn’t do it is extremely ignorant. There isn’t enough words to describe how ignorant that is.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
And everything on the Kobe situation reads more to that we can’t trust that woman.
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If you want to take a hard stance on not judging anyone since we don't have all of the information that's fine, just feels like you are happy to judge the woman as a liar without all the information. Honestly, if you just take back the quote above I don't have as big of a problem with what you are saying.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
This is court of public opinion. I’m no Kobe fan boy. But innocent until proven guilty. If I were wrongly accused I’d play hard ball too. If I had been assaulted in any way and pressed charges no amount of backlash would stop me. I’m not saying she was lying. I don’t know, neither do you. Unless you are Bryant or the girl everything else is opinion based. We live in America which means innocent until proven guilty. So that’s how we must treat this. Kobe was never found guilty. Like it or not that’s how I must treat this.

I’m sorry if you’re a woman who’s been raped and courageous enough to press charges. I don’t see how you back out.

There are plenty of women who have taken advantage of today’s age of protest and new awareness. Too much for my comfort. So if a woman acts a certain way I’m sorry but I’m not going to trust a woman or man for that matter till I have the facts. You can call me a scum or sexist all you want I could care less.

Basically you can have your opinion but at the end of the day Kobe was never convicted.
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And OJ was not guilty. But…
 
Knew a guy insisted OJ was innocent.
I said do you think it's at least possible he did it.
He said no.
I said not even possible.. maybe?
No.

I remember this thread in my lurking days and hate to bump it but wanted to state the obvious.

People put on those goggles. It's over.
 
bigmike said:
And we felt the need to bump this thread and beat a dead horse because…?
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Because I got cussed out by multiple posters who said that I can't talk about Kobe being a rapist right after his death. I was told we could all nicely, civilly have that conversation some other time. I was just wondering if it's still too soon. Having been 4 years and all.
 
Look, no one likes to see their heroes fall. It's traumatic, in a very Freudian sense. I get it.

I've lost my two all-time sports heroes over the last few years. Both to the dreaded conspiracy theories idiocy.

Of course, I could've as well just dropped the "sports" from the above statements. When you're a kid, sporting heroes are heroes, period. You grow up, but you hope that you can grow old with your heroes, in a sense. You wanna believe they're not just great athletes, but also great human beings. It sucks when you discover they're not just flawed humans like everyone else, but actually complete idiots or even just horrible human beings. It feels like an important part of your own identity is under question or even under attack.

As a society, though, we have strive to do better. Of course there's laws and of course I'm not suggesting we apply any of them retroactively, but there's more to ethics than laws. People should be held to a much, much higher ethical standard than "guilty/innocent." Again, it can be hard sometimes. I'm probably not going to throw my Stockton jersey out, but I haven't worn it recently. It sucks because my other Jazz jersey is a Mitchell one. I don't wanna wear either. What's a Jazz fan to do?

We just can't conflate athletic accomplishments with being a good citizen. That's fine. Kobe's still an all-time great, just like OJ is at football. It shouldn't have bearing on how we judge them as human beings.

It shouldn't matter if you've done this:

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or this:




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brooklynese said:
Knew a guy insisted OJ was innocent.
I said do you think it's at least possible he did it.
He said no.
I said not even possible.. maybe?
No.

I remember this thread in my lurking days and hate to bump it but wanted to state the obvious.

People put on those goggles. It's over.
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I don’t think people understand what I’m saying. I think it’s possible he did it. I’m just not sure one way or the other or jumping to conclusions in the eye of the law he’s not guilty of a crime. I’m not dealing in any absolutes. If he did it he’s currently paying for it in the next life
 
We idolize our sports stars too much. Many of our best players on the court are just terrible people off of it. The two statues in front of the Delta Center being yet another example of this. Awesome players but pretty trash human beings.

I had a feeling something like this would come up. I think a combination of his wife and some of his children still being alive, how he finished his career, him being a key player on the redeem team, and how he died helped white wash his image. I’d definitely be fine not building a statue in his honor. It’s been 20 years now but I’m pretty certain he raped her. Kobe was not a good person but he was one of the best professional athletes I’ll ever see.
 
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Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
@Ron Mexico all you can do is give me an eye roll emoji. That’s what I thought. The me too movement has done more harm then good for women. There’s as many women lying to take advantage of it if not more than actual victims that come out and aren’t believed because of all the discredits fuzzies coming out of the woodwork that we are back to not trusting women. And everything on the Kobe situation reads more to that we can’t trust that woman, if she is telling the truth I feel for her. But who files charges then won’t testify? And don’t give me emotional scars because she did report him. At that point there’s no reason to back out unless your looking to get rich off an athlete making millions
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I wasn’t gonna comment on any of this, but its just too silly.

So, your main point is that we don’t know for a fact that Kobe raped a girl because we weren’t there and don’t have all of the facts, but somehow you’re qualified to state that “There’s as many women lying to take advantage of it if not more than actual victims…”?

For this to be factual, you’d not only have to not know what went on between Kobe and his accuser, but have been personally present for every single sexual assault claim since that pesky “me too” movement started and have intimate knowledge of each and every case in order to know how many women are lying and how many are being truthful.

I have a sincere hope that someday it dawns on you just how incredibly stupid you sound right now and learn not to talk out of both sides of your mouth- especially when it comes to victims, but I’m not very hopeful any of that will actually happen.

Take the “L” and move on. You’re embarrassing yourself.
 
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