“Trump has energized [white supremacists] politically”

[BYE]

I know we have the catch-all category, but this is too disturbing to me.

White supremacist David Duke and other raging racists taking hold of the opportunity Donald Trump has afforded.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...stream-david-duke-declares-victory/ar-BBwNn7p

"The fact that Donald Trump's doing so well, it proves that I'm winning. I am winning."

"Before Trump, our identity ideas, national ideas, they had no place to go,"

"Trump had me at 'build a wall,'" Anglin said. "Virtually every alt-right Nazi I know is volunteering for the Trump campaign."

"I've been called deplorable for 35 years," said William Johnson, a Los Angeles attorney who was a Trump delegate in California until his role as head of the white nationalist American Freedom Party was publicized.

"We had no idea he would be engaging in this kind of footsie with them," said Heidi Beirich, who tracks hate groups for the Southern Poverty Law Center and now monitors Trump's statements as part of its campaign watch. "These are some of the worst ideas in the history of our society. I don't know how you undo this."

Even if Trump loses, they could remain fired up as an opposition force fighting for influence inside the deeply divided Republican Party, as the tea party has, or mobilizing against Democrats.

Inside the older tract home, his living room and dining room are crammed with desks and bookshelves spilling over with his life's work. An ink jet printer spits out thousands of campaign fliers Duke will be mailing to voters, seeking $50 contributions for a blue hat with the logo, "I'm for Duke & Trump!"

 

[Red]

Yeah, for Trump to be appealing to people's worst instincts and baser emotions, particularly on the subject of race, at a time of rising racial tensions, is one reason I feel the man is doing irreparable harm to the body politic and to American society. Win or lose, he has given his OK for groups of Americans to hate other groups of Americans. Actually encouraging this divisiveness is incredibly irresponsible. It's actually criminal in my estimation.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...ump-and-the-twilight-of-white-america/482655/

"This moment in American history was inevitable, and it was never going to be a tranquil transition. In 2004, the influential political scientist Samuel Huntington published Who Are We?, his manifesto on the tumultuous future of the American identity. The growth of black and Hispanic minorities, he predicted, would provoke a backlash among whites:

'The various forces challenging the core American culture and creed could generate a move by native white Americans to revive the discarded and discredited racial and ethnic concepts of American identity and to create an America that would exclude, expel, or suppress people of other racial, ethnic, and cultural groups. Historical and contemporary experience suggest that this is a highly probable reaction from a once dominant ethnic-racial group that feels threatened by the rise of other groups. It could produce a racially intolerant country with high levels of intergroup conflict.'


Trump’s platform is a remarkable manifestation of this 12-year-old prophecy. But Even Huntington could not have foreseen that this demographic moment would coincide with an economic crisis (which would be improbably overseen by America’s first black president). History has drawn these conflicts into a crucible, and the economic anxieties and racial anxieties of today are nearly inextricable."

 

[Jonah]

Yeah, for Trump to be appealing to people's worst instincts and baser emotions, particularly on the subject of race, at a time of rising racial tensions, is one reason I feel the man is doing irreparable harm to the body politic and to American society. Win or lose, he has given his OK for groups of Americans to hate other groups of Americans. Actually encouraging this divisiveness is incredibly irresponsible. It's actually criminal in my estimation.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...ump-and-the-twilight-of-white-america/482655/

"This moment in American history was inevitable, and it was never going to be a tranquil transition. In 2004, the influential political scientist Samuel Huntington published Who Are We?, his manifesto on the tumultuous future of the American identity. The growth of black and Hispanic minorities, he predicted, would provoke a backlash among whites:

'The various forces challenging the core American culture and creed could generate a move by native white Americans to revive the discarded and discredited racial and ethnic concepts of American identity and to create an America that would exclude, expel, or suppress people of other racial, ethnic, and cultural groups. Historical and contemporary experience suggest that this is a highly probable reaction from a once dominant ethnic-racial group that feels threatened by the rise of other groups. It could produce a racially intolerant country with high levels of intergroup conflict.'


Trump’s platform is a remarkable manifestation of this 12-year-old prophecy. But Even Huntington could not have foreseen that this demographic moment would coincide with an economic crisis (which would be improbably overseen by America’s first black president). History has drawn these conflicts into a crucible, and the economic anxieties and racial anxieties of today are nearly inextricable."

I agree the Trump campaign has been irresponsible and has actively encouraged divisiveness, but it’s not irreparable, and Trump is only superficially responsible. As the article you linked and quoted from points out, we’ve reached a moment in history that was inevitable, Trump just hastened the necessary confrontation. Our racial divide was set to explode, with or without Trump. It would be helpful to have a president like FDR or Lincoln to help us navigate the troubled times ahead, but we’re saddled with Clinton or Trump. I’m not hopeful. I foresee years of struggle, possibly a decade or more of civil unrest, before the transition is accepted and a new American identity and culture is able to peaceably move forward.

 

[Gameface]

years of struggle? civil unrest?

dude, things are pretty chill. If a BLM protest counts as civil unrest I don't know what to say. Things are calm. I wake up every day, go to work, my paychecks go into my bank account and I buy all the food and clothing and luxuries I need. Some of us have more luxuries than others. Some people have to face the horror of buying less expensive food or getting government assistance to buy food. Pretty calm. Pretty stable. Easy to live your life the way you want to live it within the realm of reason.

 

[Jonah]

years of struggle? civil unrest?

dude, things are pretty chill. If a BLM protest counts as civil unrest I don't know what to say. Things are calm. I wake up every day, go to work, my paychecks go into my bank account and I buy all the food and clothing and luxuries I need. Some of us have more luxuries than others. Some people have to face the horror of buying less expensive food or getting government assistance to buy food. Pretty calm. Pretty stable. Easy to live your life the way you want to live it within the realm of reason.

I was referring to the Atlantic article Red posted and quoted from. It’s about the future struggle. The transition from a white majority to a white minority. No dominate group ever gives up power without some kind of struggle. A president like Lincoln would be able to ease the transition. Trump, if elected with the help and enthusiastic support of white nationalists, will make the transition much, much worse.

 

[Siro]

I was referring to the Atlantic article Red posted and quoted from. It’s about the future struggle. The transition from a white majority to a white minority. No dominate group ever gives up power without some kind of struggle. A president like Lincoln would be able to ease the transition. Trump, if elected with the help and enthusiastic support of white nationalists, will make the transition much, much worse.

Samuel Huntington is always an interesting thinker. And he's right. We're already seeing the backlash from a segment of society that once had all the power, and now that they no longer do, feel marginalized. Those people make up a good portion of Trump's support. I am reminded of what a Romney strategist once said, and I paraphrase, but he said something like "Republicans have tried for a long time to convince themselves that fiscal conservatism was their main appeal. But that's wrong. For a while now, white nationalism has been the core of what conservatives are about".

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

How many trump threads do we need?

Sent from my A0001 using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[Gameface]

How many trump threads do we need?

Sent from my A0001 using JazzFanz mobile app

I wish Jason would build a great (fire)wall and keep these kinds of threads out of here!

 

[BYE]

How many trump threads do we need?

Sent from my A0001 using JazzFanz mobile app

Not every talking point on Trump needs to go in Never Trump, just like not every Jazz talking point needs to go into some Utah Jazz catchall thread. I start new threads when I think they're particularly important or interesting enough to merit their own thread. Now, Trump's political empowerment of white supremacists isn't as important as Family Feud or pet peeves, but not all of the topics in this forum can be as important as these two topics are.

 

[Hotdog]

I wish Jason would build a great (fire)wall and keep these kinds of threads out of here!

I would just dig a tunnel under that wall and smuggle in my ideas.

 

[RJF]

Samuel Huntington is always an interesting thinker. And he's right. We're already seeing the backlash from a segment of society that once had all the power, and now that they no longer do, feel marginalized. Those people make up a good portion of Trump's support. I am reminded of what a Romney strategist once said, and I paraphrase, but he said something like "Republicans have tried for a long time to convince themselves that fiscal conservatism was their main appeal. But that's wrong. For a while now, white nationalism has been the core of what conservatives are about".

I'm as sick of generalizations as Gameface is of Trump threads. I'm not a trump supporter but ffs, enough with the generalization ********.

 

[str8line]

I'm as sick of generalizations as Gameface is of Trump threads. I'm not a trump supporter but ffs, enough with the generalization ********.

Anyone who supports Trump is a ****ing nitwit. How's that for something that might seem like a generalization but isn't?

 

[Siro]

I'm as sick of generalizations as Gameface is of Trump threads. I'm not a trump supporter but ffs, enough with the generalization ********.

It's less of a generalization and more of a simple fact. White nationalists tend to support Trump. Like obviously. I never said all of Trump support comes from that camp. But some of it does.

 

[bjwsan]

It's less of a generalization and more of a simple fact. White nationalists tend to support Trump. Like obviously. I never said all of Trump support comes from that camp. But some of it does.

For the sake of argument, which I'm sure this will start, let's just concede 'some of it does'... 1/2%? 1%? Don't know, don't care about the fringe on either side.

The movement of this election has little to do with racism or even recently defined social injustice. Me thinks it has more in common with the French Revolution - just hopefully less violent.

The American monarchy and aristocracy is the self-serving political class, on both sides - though HC is the epitome. Instead of the guillotine, we have the ballot box, and if that pendulum doesn't swing enough this time, count on it being even crazier in 4 years...

 

[Hotdog]

It's less of a generalization and more of a simple fact. White nationalists tend to support Trump. Like obviously. I never said all of Trump support comes from that camp. But some of it does.

And Im sure racial hate groups of other kinds are attracted the left.

Is it just ok to hate white people now? Is that where we are as a society?

 

[Siro]

And Im sure racial hate groups of other kinds are attracted the left.

Is it just ok to hate white people now? Is that where we are as a society?

For YEARS I've bitched that the left is at its core anti-Western, and that as such ideals continue to spread among the elites of the intelligentsia, an eventual backlash was inescapable. Unfortunately, we're seeing the backlash now with the assaults on "political correctness" and other leftist ideals becoming mainstream, and the capitalization on such sentiment by the alt-right and others with white nationalist sentiments.

 

[Siro]

For the sake of argument, which I'm sure this will start, let's just concede 'some of it does'... 1/2%? 1%? Don't know, don't care about the fringe on either side.

The movement of this election has little to do with racism or even recently defined social injustice. Me thinks it has more in common with the French Revolution - just hopefully less violent.

The American monarchy and aristocracy is the self-serving political class, on both sides - though HC is the epitome. Instead of the guillotine, we have the ballot box, and if that pendulum doesn't swing enough this time, count on it being even crazier in 4 years...

Ah, nice rhetoric. But no, I don't agree at all. There are no parallels between the two situations. The French did not consider obesity a major societal problem.

As for the stats, I'm at work now, but I'll get back with you. But it's far larger than 1% or 2%.

 

[str8line]

For the sake of argument, which I'm sure this will start, let's just concede 'some of it does'... 1/2%? 1%? Don't know, don't care about the fringe on either side.

The movement of this election has little to do with racism or even recently defined social injustice. Me thinks it has more in common with the French Revolution - just hopefully less violent.

The American monarchy and aristocracy is the self-serving political class, on both sides - though HC is the epitome. Instead of the guillotine, we have the ballot box, and if that pendulum doesn't swing enough this time, count on it being even crazier in 4 years...

Trump serving as the overthrower of "The American monarchy and aristocracy" is too rich. I'll give you that Hillary is part of the self-serving political class, as are most of Congress. But Trump redefines self-serving. That Trump supporters think he would be better than Hillary corruption-wise merely accentuates their shocking stupidity.

 

[BYE]

Trump serving as the overthrower of "The American monarchy and aristocracy" is too rich. I'll give you that Hillary is part of the self-serving political class, as are most of Congress. But Trump redefines self-serving. That Trump supporters think he would be better than Hillary corruption-wise merely accentuates their shocking stupidity.

I like what you did there!

 

[BYE]

For the sake of argument, which I'm sure this will start, let's just concede 'some of it does'... 1/2%? 1%? Don't know, don't care about the fringe on either side.

Not even close to fringe. From 2008 to 2014, white nationalist organizations increased from 149 to over 1,000 in 2014. It began with the election of an African American and has snowballed ever since. Trump's calling card is immigration and his ability to marginalize minorities and women. Trump's supporters are absolutely bomb-first-ask-questions-later. 41% of Trump's supporters are for the bombing of Agrabah, the fictitious city of Aladdin. The list goes on and on.

The movement of this election has little to do with racism or even recently defined social injustice. Me thinks it has more in common with the French Revolution - just hopefully less violent.

If you want to see some eye-opening footage, find rally footage from Palin's speeches in places in the Midwest like Ohio. I was blown away out the open racism. The economy is doing pretty well for the middle class actually, and you can find plenty of information about this. The movement has everything to do with perception, not reality. Racism is at its core.

The American monarchy and aristocracy is the self-serving political class, on both sides - though HC is the epitome. Instead of the guillotine, we have the ballot box, and if that pendulum doesn't swing enough this time, count on it being even crazier in 4 years...

I understand that we have the power to elect these officials, and we are to blame when it comes to the people who are in office. We keep voting them in. What you are leaving unsaid (as pointed out by str8line) is just who the blade of the guillotine is. It's Trump. I have no idea what would lead you to believe that Trump has any intention of serving anyone other than himself and perhaps his family. The way he has pandered is historical, and his supporters are so gullible that it is tragic. Trump has proposed nothing even remotely concrete that would aid the middle and lower classes. The man's castle is made of solid gold, and he doesn't even know that jeans exist. Hardly a spokesperson for the less fortunate of the world. He is much more like the monarchy of the French Revolution than anyone who has run for the presidency in the last thirty years. Also, don't forget who rose from the French Revolution, Napoleon. The Alt-right doesn't sound that far off with Trump.