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All-Time NBA Draft Round 1: Ellis269 vs. Rgiss

Which team would win in a 7-game series?

  • Total voters
    27
  • Poll closed .
Elizah Huge

Elizah Huge

Respect All, Fear None
Contributor
2024 Award Winner
Team Ellis269:

PG - Michael Jordan / Walt Frazier
SG - Giannis Antetokounmpo / George Gervin
SF - Dominique Wilkins / Bernard King
PF - Shawn Kemp / Kevin Love
C - Patrick Ewing / Artis Gilmore

Team Rgiss:

PG - Damian Lillard / Kyle Lowry
SG - Klay Thompson / Eddie Jones / Kyle Korver
SF - Andrei Kirilenko / Gordon Hayward
PF - Al Horford / Carmelo Anthony
C - Shaquille O’Neal

Ellis269’s Case:

Air Jordan, Greek Freak, The Human Highlight Film, Reignman and Ewing to start. Clyde Frazier, Iceman, Bernard King, Kevin Love and A-Train off the bench.

I’m starting with an elite group of athletic freaks of nature, and great role players off the bench.

While I don’t have a traditional point guard, Jordan and Giannis are both capable of running the offense. I’ve got elite scoring, defense, rebounding, post play and the ability to get out in transition and run. My bench adds elite scoring, shooting, size and another excellent perimeter defender.











Rgiss’ Case:

Not doing a long writeup, but want to get a basic style of play across if it's not self-explanatory enough.

Starting Lineup:
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I'm gonna put it simple. Shaquille O'Neal has a wide open floor, a team full of playmakers and shooters, and every player can switch just about anything. We play a 4-out offense and a switch-almost-everything defense. If anybody has any space, they're shooting the ball.

If I'm Ellis, I'm really worried about how the spacing on my team works out. Especially with a team with a slew of interior defenders, trotting out a starting lineup where your best shooter only was a 33% shooter because of a shortened three point line for a couple seasons and took 1.5 threes a game in his career isn't a good idea. His starting lineup's career 3P%: 0-33-32-28-0. His primary way to score is to go through Shaq, Horford, and Kirilenko.

Listen, Frazier is an all time defender, but when switched onto Shaq, does he have any hope? As soon as Dame and Shaq run a PnR, Walt gets burned.

If Klay gets any space, he's a knock down shooter. He's able to get his shot off against any defender, and Jordan is no different.

Kirilenko is less of a shooter, but shot 34% on 2.6 attempts per game in his all-star season. As we slide into the feel of a game, Kirilenko slides to the four and Melo comes in for a burst of scoring, or Hayward comes in as another shooter/defender. Kirilenko helps move the ball, and can be a lockdown defender on anybody he switches on. I may have him switch to guard Jordan if Jordan finds rhythm.

Horford is the perfect 4/5 for this team. He's a terrific defender, a great shooter, and can play a number of roles. When Shaq has to take a breather, Horford fills in at the five. When Horford needs a break, Kirilenko slides to the four.

I don't wanna hear this ******** that "Jordan always wins". If Jordan always won, he'd be 15-0 in the finals, not 6-0. He even proved he could lose in the middle of his prime when he went against Shaq himself. And that was when Jordan had a much more open paint with shooters in Pippen, Kukoc, Kerr, and Armstrong around him. (tangent-Jordan and the Bulls were 13-4 with him in the regular season and 12-2 to end the season. He was plenty himself by that point, the Bulls just didn't win so people made excuses. Shaq and Penny took out a pre-3-peat, healthy, Jordan led, Bulls team.)

I just want to end with a stat. Pretty simple, but hopefully it can show how problematic spacing will be for Ellis and how advantageous it will be for me.

G0gZYFa.png


Can Michael Jordan really win with absolutely no spacing? Can Shaquille O'Neal really lose with unlimited spacing?
 
That Dominique pick up was a steal.

I like what Rgiss is trying to do but MJ will destroy Dame and with Ellis's teams constant attack on the rim I think its probable Shaq is in foul trouble throughout this series.

I think it was a great move starting the GOAT at PG but the lack of overall shooting in the starting lineup is a concern.
 
elan_prodigy said:
That Dominique pick up was a steal.

I like what Rgiss is trying to do but MJ will destroy Dame and with Ellis's teams constant attack on the rim I think its probable Shaq is in foul trouble throughout this series.

I think it was a great move starting the GOAT at PG but the lack of overall shooting in the starting lineup is a concern.
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Ellis doesn’t have LeBron?
 
I don’t really like Kirilenko or Horford as starters in this. Ellis is just too damn athletic for Rgiss to try and guard.
 
I really like the team that @Rgiss has put together, except that he's missing a backup for Shaq. Shaq will be in foul trouble early (not to mention hack-a-Shaq'd), and even if not, he can't play 48 minutes. Which leaves a serious dropoff trying to move Horford or Carmelo over.

As far as @Ellis269 goes, I think playing MJ out of position is a mistake. He would have been better off starting Frazier, and moving Greek Freak to the bench for some serious punch. I like Kemp, but think he'd normally be one of the weaker picks in this kind of thing, but on this team, I can see him just beasting out for some reason.

In the end... I went with Ellis. Playing MJ out of position isn't as big a mistake as... well, honestly, drafting Korver.
 
Mike Miller, James Jones, Eddie House, Mario Chalmers, Ray Allen...
just a couple role-players on the Heat solely to shoot threes to open up the floor for Wade, Lebron, and Bosh. so, yeah.

And that's true of any good team with multiple superstars who attack the basket. Jordan had Kerr, Pippen, Harper, Kukoc all there to help open the floor.

Shaq and Penny had Dennis Scott, Brian Anderson, and Nick Anderson

Shaq and Kobe had Fisher, Rice, Horry and Fox

Ellis only has Love. And Love won't get many minutes if he wants to be able to stick with my team defensively.
 
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gandalfe said:
I really like the team that @Rgiss has put together, except that he's missing a backup for Shaq. Shaq will be in foul trouble early (not to mention hack-a-Shaq'd), and even if not, he can't play 48 minutes. Which leaves a serious dropoff trying to move Horford or Carmelo over.

As far as @Ellis269 goes, I think playing MJ out of position is a mistake. He would have been better off starting Frazier, and moving Greek Freak to the bench for some serious punch. I like Kemp, but think he'd normally be one of the weaker picks in this kind of thing, but on this team, I can see him just beasting out for some reason.

In the end... I went with Ellis. Playing MJ out of position isn't as big a mistake as... well, honestly, drafting Korver.
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smh Horford really was terrible at Center for the Celtics this year, eh? And every other year he's been in the league..
 
Grayson's Hands said:
Is he playing the whole game? Because you have him starting at PF.
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Rotations are simple, and similar to Jazz this year. Frontcourt: Shaq goes out at 6 minutes in, Horford plays till end of Q with AK at PF, Hayward subs in at SF. Shaq comes in to start 2nd, Horford goes out for 6 minutes, Melo subs in at PF. Horford and Shaq finish the half. Korver subs in if Hayward gets tired. Same rotation in the second half.

But you already voted, so who cares.
 
Rgiss said:
Rotations are simple, and similar to Jazz this year. Frontcourt: Shaq goes out at 6 minutes in, Horford plays till end of Q with AK at PF, Hayward subs in at SF. Shaq comes in to start 2nd, Horford goes out for 6 minutes, Melo subs in at PF. Horford and Shaq finish the half. Korver subs in if Hayward gets tired. Same rotation in the second half.

But you already voted, so who cares.
Click to expand...

Still doesn’t change my mind.
 
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