Are people poor because they are lazy?

[Dr. Jones]

Very good post, elbows.

I'll add one more thing to my earlier post. Some of the things I accomplished when I was young and dumb I would likely fail at today. I'd probably give up, seriously. I am now too likely to see the immense challenges.

I'll use the following true story to explain what I mean.

John Y. Brown was interviewed after he retired from his Governership of Kentucky. (as a pre-cursor, John and his buddies opened a KFC franchise, after one after the other had failed, and he ended up opening 100's and is accredited with putting the franchise officially on the map)
In that interview, he asked the following;

Interviewer: Mr. Brown, why do you think you and your buddies were able to have success with KFC when everyone else had failed?

Brown: Oh, that's a very easy answer. We didn't know we were supposed to fail. We didn't understand that failing was actually an option. We were in college, trying to make something of ourselves, and raised enough money to open the doors, but there was no other money. We worked our butts off and did everything necessary. We had a sincere belief that if this business failed, we die. We would literally have and be nothing as a result, not ever.

----

I remember the person I was in my early 20's. I was badass. Never took no for an answer (didn't even hear it). EVERYTHING was possible. While everyone else said you can't do it, I said, 'why not?' The thought that anything, at all, existed that could not be accomplished was laughable to me. Now that I'm older (40), I admit I see more challenges, I admit I'm not willing to do what I was once willing to do.

Not to overly stereotype, but I almost ALWAYS hire young people. I treat them like I used to think. Meaning, I tell them to get something done. They say, 'how' and I often say just figure it out. MANY times, they want so badly to succeed that they find a way I had never thought of .. a better way. I reward very well for those moments. Converely, when I hire someone with tons of experience, I get a whole lot of "that just can't be done" .. "that doesn't make any sense."

My brain is wired, when I see a major obstacle, to sit and think "I KNOW there is a way, we just have to figure it out." Young people seem to think that way much more than the 'experts.'

 

[Hantlers]

You gonna hire me old man?

 

[Dr. Jones]

You gonna hire me old man?

I'm only doing things in Utah at the moment .. but quite a bit of opportunity.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

I'm only doing things in Utah at the moment .. but quite a bit of opportunity.

What opportunities are there currently and going forward, what other opportunities could arise?

 

[franklin]

I remember the person I was in my early 20's. I was badass. Never took no for an answer (didn't even hear it). EVERYTHING was possible. While everyone else said you can't do it, I said, 'why not?' The thought that anything, at all, existed that could not be accomplished was laughable to me. Now that I'm older (40), I admit I see more challenges, I admit I'm not willing to do what I was once willing to do.

Your father should have cropped your ears and bobbed your... well, just cropped your ears.

Listen to PKM--Pit Bull Terrier mentality will take you far. Or Archie--"stay hungry".

 

[franklin]

You gonna hire me old man?

Better learn to roll sushi Hagglers.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

Thanks for the reply and you don't have to explain yourself to me or anyone else for that matter, but thanks again for the reply.

I just grow concerned about the middle class. In my experience, I've interacted with a lot of different people from lower-middle class to upper class families and here are my observations.

Growing up in West Valley City, most people are blue collar, they work hard, but their view of the world is myopic. It seems like no one really knew what was possible. About half my graduating class was either first or second generation Mexican or Polynesian and success to them (I include all races in this statement) was sports related or staying out of trouble. I never really thought much about college-- and graduate school, to me, was always something that would never happen because my parents couldn't afford it.

Fast forward to Utah State University, most kids were from the east side, Park City, or locals in the Cache Valley area. Most of them were white and mormon and had really solid families. The difference between the average person at Utah State University and the average person from Granger High is immense. Granger is mostly brown, there were a lot of fights (11 in my first week of school) not overly mormon and getting stuff stolen or getting intimidated by a tongan dude or drugs or whatever was not uncommon. At Utah State, most experiences revolve around the church and being overall a wholesome individual. It's annoying, really. Still, even though USU has people that are from solid families and are white and mormon, it's not really all that smug or rich. Kids generally come from parents that are white collar but nothing audacious.

At Texas A&M and especially in my graduate department it's on a whole other level. Virtually every student in my department is either the offspring of a wealthy lawyer or doctor or business person. I taught a kid in one of my courses who's father is one of a few billionaires in Dallas. This is where the difference became very clear to me. The kids that are raised in areas like Plano or Clear Lake, gated communities that are essentially archipelagos of the wealthy, know exactly how to navigate through life. From the minute they are pulled from the womb, parents are conditioning their children to be active, to think critically, and to challenge the status quo. For better or worse, they're never satisfied. When they arrive at college their ACT test scores are 30 plus and their grades are >3.8. But here's the kicker, they're not really all that smart. Trust me, I grade their work.

The difference is just their attitude and their personality traits. You can tell who comes from wealthy families, and the contrast is stunning, really.

My point is not to disparage the wealthy, and in reality, I think I may have just corroborated how great they are, but I do want to point out that someone from a lower-class background has an unbelievably steep hill to climb if they ever want to reach the same levels as those who come from money. The system really is stacked against them, and not for reasons inherent to the system, rather, these kids are just not trained at equivalent levels that rich kids are.

At Granger, we were told all the same things that everyone else was, "you work hard, you'll make it". I had a physics teacher that made a fortune in the oil and gas business who would always tell us what opportunities there were for us out there and that there is a whole big world out there. But as I look back on it, I understood what he was saying and I understood the logic, but I didn't feel it. It seemed like that was something was just different than what was expected from me and that there were a lot of people out there that are a whole hell of a lot smarter than me. I don't think a lot of wealthy kids feel this way. They expect great things, they demand it. It's a part of the culture they are from and an advantage that most people from lower to middle class don't really have.

Fast forward 7 years and I'm finishing my master's degree working on geochemical properties of marine sediments at a tier 1 research institution. I meet daily with people from Stanford, MIT, Harvard, etc. I'm a genuinely hardworking guy, but it would be lie to say that I received no help at all. I was lucky to have loving parents who took care of me and genuinely had my best interests at heart. I received a full scholarship from Utah State, but my parents paid for my housing. I'm out at A&M and have a stipend and scholarships, but my dad still sends me 50 bucks here and there in the mail. I have no debt. When I compare that to what some of my buddies had at Granger, it's an abundance of riches.

So that's partly what I mean when I talk about background and I'm assuming just about everyone on this board that posts about receiving nothing in their life is not telling the whole truth, I hate to say it, but even moreso if you're from an upper-class family.

This might be the best post I've ever read on the board.

 

[PearlWatson]

It is more about moral failings because it is single women with children who make up the majority of the poor.

50% of single mothers are below poverty.
90% of welfare recipients are single mothers.
85% of the homeless are single mothers.

We could wipe out chronic poverty if women simply got married before having children and stayed married after having children.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

Education is key.

 

[Dr. Jones]

What opportunities are there currently and going forward, what other opportunities could arise?

We have a very small group of guys and gals (too few, but I want them to earn more and it be a more family atmosphere). Those that make the most do sales. We have, by far, the nicest resort-style development in southern Utah .. or maybe the desert southwest. Average homes are well over a million and we killed it even in the downturn .. because we never compromised anything in the process. Those guys have a pretty easy job and they average around $250k annually .. working about 25 hours per week. We also have needs for architects, interior designers, art gallery managers, etc.

https://golfentrada.com

 

[Hantlers]

We have a very small group of guys and gals (too few, but I want them to earn more and it be a more family atmosphere). Those that make the most do sales. We have, by far, the nicest resort-style development in southern Utah .. or maybe the desert southwest. Average homes are well over a million and we killed it even in the downturn .. because we never compromised anything in the process. Those guys have a pretty easy job and they average around $250k annually .. working about 25 hours per week. We also have needs for architects, interior designers, art gallery managers, etc.

https://golfentrada.com

Don't worry, I wont ask for a job. I don't want anybody to be my boss.

It is more about moral failings because it is single women with children who make up the majority of the poor.

50% of single mothers are below poverty.
90% of welfare recipients are single mothers.
85% of the homeless are single mothers.

We could wipe out chronic poverty if women simply got married before having children and stayed married after having children.

Or you could like, blame the guy too. It isn't just the woman's fault, sex is usually a 2 person thing unless you're just getting kinky.

 

[PearlWatson]

Or you could like, blame the guy too. It isn't just the woman's fault, sex is usually a 2 person thing unless you're just getting kinky.

You could but I put the responsibility on the woman because she is usually the one who decides when sex will happen. She has the power so therefore bears the responsibility to choose a mate wisely and demand the respect of marriage so she doesn't doom her children to a life of poverty.