Fiscal responsibility: suppose the govt "doesn't spend money it doesn't have."

[jimmy eat jazz]

What we are doing is without precedent. We've never run up a peacetime debt like this before. Just because some folks have cried wolf in the past doesn't mean that wolves aren't coming.

And just because they cry wolf today doesn't mean that the wolves are coming either.

See my reply below. I'm all for sensible, incremental solutions. It's waaay too early for a scorched earth austerity policy. Get the economy growing again, enact sensible revenue enhancements, make cuts where it makes sense, and doomsday doesn't have to occur.

 

[franklin]

Govn't should be run like a business, but not like a business.

Ok.

Can I play too?

High debt load is the problem so we should do nothing when GDP falls so the debt burden will grow & become a bigger problem so we should do nothing because debt is the problem. In fact, we should cut as many government jobs so GDP will shrink faster and the private sector will be hurt even deeper as consumer spending plummets so the debt load will go ever higher and we should do nothing because debt is the problem and everything will magically bottom out somewhere because Glenn Beck told me so. & Glenn also told me that instability & uncertainty are causing businesses to not expand & so we should cut government 5% across the board so business revenue will become more erratic but it will all magically fix itself because we bought gold like Glenn Beck told us to because he's a good spirited Christian and knows gold is the best investment ever & the Bible says not to worship golden images & Glenn says it isn't gold worship so it's okay. In fact, Glenn Beck is a good Mormon boy & the Book of Mormon warns against hording gold and burying it the ground to keep it safe but that's okay because Glenn Beck approves a good safe manufacturer so we don't have to hide it in the ground so that's okay. & government is inept at everything & we need to follow the constitution which says that banking is born from government so we need to deregulate the banks even more because everything connected to government is not efficient so it should be watched vigilantly so we should deregulate the banks because they don't need to be watched at all. Oh, wait...

 

[Dr. Jones]

I have read every post in this thread and have a slightly off-topic question from the current stream.

Why is it that both democrats and republicans (I am really not married to either, just my own set of ideals that are fairly in the middle) have held office, both make certain promises, both have comtrolled the senate and house, yet this board is completelt one-sided when it comes to republicans having an exclusive license to;

- Certain idealogical changes
- Rhetoric
- Flip flopping
- Pandering
- Catering to certain corporation/agencies
- etc.

Being serious with this .. are the above items absent from a democrat/liberal? Do they not have the same issues .. only on a different platform?
I'm sincerely curious as to what those here believe about this, because at my age and life experience, I HATE all parties. I liken the mess this country is in to that of "The Prisoner's Dilemma" as it relates to partisanship. Pisses me off, actually.

 

[Scat]

Can I play too?

High debt load is the problem so we should do nothing when GDP falls so the debt burden will grow & become a bigger problem so we should do nothing because debt is the problem. In fact, we should cut as many government jobs so GDP will shrink faster and the private sector will be hurt even deeper as consumer spending plummets so the debt load will go ever higher and we should do nothing because debt is the problem and everything will magically bottom out somewhere because Glenn Beck told me so. & Glenn also told me that instability & uncertainty are causing businesses to not expand & so we should cut government 5% across the board so business revenue will become more erratic but it will all magically fix itself because we bought gold like Glenn Beck told us to because he's a good spirited Christian and knows gold is the best investment ever & the Bible says not to worship golden images & Glenn says it isn't gold worship so it's okay. In fact, Glenn Beck is a good Mormon boy & the Book of Mormon warns against hording gold and burying it the ground to keep it safe but that's okay because Glenn Beck approves a good safe manufacturer so we don't have to hide it in the ground so that's okay. & government is inept at everything & we need to follow the constitution which says that banking is born from government so we need to deregulate the banks even more because everything connected to government is not efficient so it should be watched vigilantly so we should deregulate the banks because they don't need to be watched at all. Oh, wait...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ss2hULhXf04&feature=related

 

[BabyPeterzz]

Can I play too?

High debt load is the problem so we should do nothing when GDP falls so the debt burden will grow & become a bigger problem so we should do nothing because debt is the problem. In fact, we should cut as many government jobs so GDP will shrink faster and the private sector will be hurt even deeper as consumer spending plummets so the debt load will go ever higher and we should do nothing because debt is the problem and everything will magically bottom out somewhere because Glenn Beck told me so. & Glenn also told me that instability & uncertainty are causing businesses to not expand & so we should cut government 5% across the board so business revenue will become more erratic but it will all magically fix itself because we bought gold like Glenn Beck told us to because he's a good spirited Christian and knows gold is the best investment ever & the Bible says not to worship golden images & Glenn says it isn't gold worship so it's okay. In fact, Glenn Beck is a good Mormon boy & the Book of Mormon warns against hording gold and burying it the ground to keep it safe but that's okay because Glenn Beck approves a good safe manufacturer so we don't have to hide it in the ground so that's okay. & government is inept at everything & we need to follow the constitution which says that banking is born from government so we need to deregulate the banks even more because everything connected to government is not efficient so it should be watched vigilantly so we should deregulate the banks because they don't need to be watched at all. Oh, wait...

* halfchub *

 

[franklin]

I lived in Russia in 1997. It cost 2600 rubles to buy a bottle of Coke. Imagine that your promised pension payed out at 5000 rubles a month. It was a good deal in the 70's and 80's. Not such a good deal when your currency collapsed. I watched 80 year old pensioners selling onions on the street because their safety net had collapsed. Russia was a superpower. To think that that same thing cannot and will not happen here is rediculous.

Russia collapsed when Yeltsin tried to follow the Reagan-Thatcher playbook without knowing the first damn thing about monetary policy, and it backfired miserably. The result was hyper-inflationary policy to combat extreme money/credit scarcity, which just so happens to be the exact same **** the conservative republicans are pushing wholesale.

I'm on SWOTI overload. Someone stick a nail through a board and smack me in the head.

 

[Scat]

I have read every post in this thread and have a slightly off-topic question from the current stream.

Why is it that both democrats and republicans (I am really not married to either, just my own set of ideals that are fairly in the middle) have held office, both make certain promises, both have comtrolled the senate and house, yet this board is completelt one-sided when it comes to republicans having an exclusive license to;

- Certain idealogical changes
- Rhetoric
- Flip flopping
- Pandering
- Catering to certain corporation/agencies
- etc.

Being serious with this .. are the above items absent from a democrat/liberal? Do they not have the same issues .. only on a different platform?
I'm sincerely curious as to what those here believe about this, because at my age and life experience, I HATE all parties. I liken the mess this country is in to that of "The Prisoner's Dilemma" as it relates to partisanship. Pisses me off, actually.

Because the DNC is the party of Jesus Christ, duh! They are perfect!!

 

[northeast]

I'd say that this board leans Republican in numbers on economic issues.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I'd say that this board leans Republican in numbers on economic issues.

Perhaps it does, but my question was why I see so many more (all?) hyperbolic statements towards the "overly-idealogical" republicans. Doesn't bother me because I'm my own man and support whomever I most closely align beliefs with .. just curious why the board seems to have so much more vitriol toward the right.

Edit: I ask because I expected a Utah board to be more pro-right than left ..

 

[northeast]

Not sure I agree with any of your premises.

Maybe it just seems this way to you, because the anti Republicans are on a hot streak and making better quality posts lately, and you really do identify more with Romney than with Obama.

The flip flopping is a minor afterthought of an issue which you are just know making a defining distinction over.

I am no fan of Obama, but personally my disappointment with him is that he has been a centrist economically, wasting most of his term trying to appease Republicans, ruining a once in a generation opportunity to try some new progressive ideas, and now these possibilities have been discredited without ever being given a chance.
I don't support the economic core beliefs of either party, but the Dems appear to me to be less bad.

As an example , he should have ditched the Bush tax structures from the start and worked for some of my ideas when he had support, instead of letting this issue linger into 2 more election seasons.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Not sure I agree with any of your premises.

Maybe it just seems this way to you, because the anti Republicans are on a hot streak and making better quality posts lately, and you really do identify more with Romney than with Obama.

The flip flopping is a minor afterthought of an issue which you are just know making a defining distinction over.

I am no fan of Obama, but personally my disappointment with him is that he has been a centrist economically, wasting most of his term trying to appease Republicans, ruining a once in a generation opportunity to try some new progressive ideas, and now these possibilities have been discredited without ever being given a chance.
I don't support the economic core beliefs of either party, but the Dems appear to me to be less bad.

As an example , he should have ditched the Bush tax structures from the start and worked for some of my ideas when he had support, instead of letting this issue linger into 2 more election seasons.

That may be true. I just see a lot more generalizing the attacks .. but perhaps it's my imagination.
Whether the dems are on a roll in this thread, I don't know, maybe .. I haven't spent anytime with the partisan-type discussion, but rather policy only.

I have enjoyed most of NAOS' posts (whether I agree or not), I have enjoyed Franklin's posts, Jimmy's ..

I have thought your's and Thriller's have been mostly (though maybe not entirely) empty jabs that lack substance or even an openness to the topic at hand.

 

[northeast]

I thought that the on topic substance has been dominated by thriller, salty, and myself.
It's not our fault none of you could answer Naos's question. We were all biting our tongues, waiting for you to just come up with something, anything.

The problems might really be that Romney's main qualification is a lifetime of experience weaseling the government out of taxes, and his policies are just reruns of the things that have put the country in the hole time and time again in the past, including a focus on helping the ultra-rich, at exactly a time in history when the rich have already benefited enormously from an economic catastrophe that some of them caused in the first place.