Gun control a comparison US vs Russia

[♪alt13]

Depends on the case. If it is severe enough than yeah I can consider them the same.

Irregardless of my examples, do you think our criminal classification system is adequate to distinguish between all the possible crimes.
Colorado for instance has 6 levels of felonies.

 

[Stoked]

Irregardless of my examples, do you think our criminal classification system is adequate to distinguish between all the possible crimes.
Colorado for instance has 6 levels of felonies.

No. Another reason I do not like mandatory sentencing. I do believe that Judges should be reviewed by a council and if found to render heinous judgements they can be disbarred. (such as that Montana (?) judge that gave a teacher 30 days for hooking up with a 14 year old student)

 

[LogGrad98]

No. Another reason I do not like mandatory sentencing. I do believe that Judges should be reviewed by a council and if found to render heinous judgements they can be disbarred. (such as that Montana (?) judge that gave a teacher 30 days for hooking up with a 14 year old student)

I thought the age of consent in montana is 12. Either way that is insane. A week of probation would have been plenty. Unless it was a guy teacher and a girl student in which case it should have been life in prison and mandatory blunt trauma castration at a minimum.

 

[LogGrad98]

If we overhauled the entire criminal justice system overnight then yes it would be costly. I suggest(to start) we simply create this class of crimes. The only cost would be to tradition. We all recognize that there are more than six degrees of crime and that there are definitely more than three degrees that deserve prison time. We would give judges, juries, prosecutors, and most importantly legislators more options.
I first thought that this would be a good idea when the Utah state legislature enhanced animal cruelty to a class 3 felony. From one perspective animal cruelty is definitely worse than having an ounce of marijuana(class A misdemeanor) but from another it is definitely not as bad as aggravated assault(level 3 felony).

Depends on the case. If it is severe enough than yeah I can consider them the same.

This is the other big challenge, getting people to agree on the legislation and which crimes are worse than others.

 

[Stoked]

This is the other big challenge, getting people to agree on the legislation and which crimes are worse than others.

Not only that but each case of the same crime can be different. For example. Assault. Did he hit the guy once or beat him extensively and leave him with brain damage?

Edit: Which is where a judge review process would come in. Keep judges somewhat honest in their decisions.

 

[♪alt13]

Not only that but each case of the same crime can be different. For example. Assault. Did he hit the guy once or beat him extensively and leave him with brain damage?

Edit: Which is where a judge review process would come in. Keep judges somewhat honest in their decisions.

This is why I am against minimum mandatory sentences. We have judges for a reason we should not be circumventing a judges discretion.

 

[Nate505]

This is why I am against minimum mandatory sentences. We have judges for a reason we should not be circumventing a judges discretion.

Mandatory minimums are the dumbest thing ever, and a major part of the reason I detest law and order conservatives.

Many injustices have been done at the hand of these sentences, mostly due to the idiotic drug war. One case that sticks out in my mind was some lady whose boyfriend (who went to college in another state) asked her if she could get him some acid. She mailed the acid to him. Later the boyfriend was caught, but he was able to rat out some other dealers to reduce his sentence down to three years. The lady was not so lucky, so she was sentenced to 10 years in federal prison for mailing some acid to her boyfriend (she actually "only" served 8 years of it as Clinton pardoned her on his last day in office...guess he was too cowardly to do it years before, but it's better than nothing I guess). I cannot comprehend how society was bettered by making her serve 8 years in prison.

Meanwhile, some guy who bilked people out of millions of dollars running a phony charity (one of the many names of the phony charities he "ran" was the Association for Disabled Firefighters) got 5 years in Federal prison for his crime. Yup, according to the government mailing a willing person LSD is twice the crime bilking people out of money in the guise of helping disabled firefighters is. What a joke (well it would be a joke if the results weren't so tragic).

 

[LogGrad98]

This is why I am against minimum mandatory sentences. We have judges for a reason we should not be circumventing a judges discretion.

Mandatory minimums are the dumbest thing ever, and a major part of the reason I detest law and order conservatives.

Many injustices have been done at the hand of these sentences, mostly due to the idiotic drug war. One case that sticks out in my mind was some lady whose boyfriend (who went to college in another state) asked her if she could get him some acid. She mailed the acid to him. Later the boyfriend was caught, but he was able to rat out some other dealers to reduce his sentence down to three years. The lady was not so lucky, so she was sentenced to 10 years in federal prison for mailing some acid to her boyfriend (she actually "only" served 8 years of it as Clinton pardoned her on his last day in office...guess he was too cowardly to do it years before, but it's better than nothing I guess). I cannot comprehend how society was bettered by making her serve 8 years in prison.

Meanwhile, some guy who bilked people out of millions of dollars running a phony charity (one of the many names of the phony charities he "ran" was the Association for Disabled Firefighters) got 5 years in Federal prison for his crime. Yup, according to the government mailing a willing person LSD is twice the crime bilking people out of money in the guise of helping disabled firefighters is. What a joke (well it would be a joke if the results weren't so tragic).

Imo one of the reasons these exist to begin with is that the judges did a crappy job meting out "justice" as perceived by the voting public. So minimum mandatories were passed to ensure that SOME justice was handed down even if the judge would have given them a slap on the wrist. Not that I agree with it the way it is implemented now, but I have a close to home example.

Just over 3 years ago my bro-in-law was killed on his motorcycle by a 20-year-old kid who had THC and booze in his bloodstream and was texting while driving over the speed limit. He hit my brother-in-law, who was sitting on his bike at a stop light, at right around 75 mph, fast enough that he killed my BIL instantly, and so hard that his helmet was crushed and the force of his helmet hitting the minivan dented and BENT the A-pillar (windshield pillar) of the van. It also almost killed his GF who was in the passenger seat. In fitting irony, the driver walked away, because the one thing he did right was have his seat belt fastened. They tried him with everything they could, vehicular murder, which I had never heard of before that incident. It carried a mandatory minimum, iirr, of 5 years, with possibility of life. The judge gave him the MM because "he was young and has his whole life ahead of him". So the scumbag that took my BIL from this earth, a family man with a kid, wife of over 20 years, and was a decorated war veteran from BOTH gulf wars, was out of jail this summer, time off for good behavior or some other ****. The judge wanted to give him probation, but was forced to give him the mandatory minimum. Was justice served? Imo, **** no.

As has been brought up before, different versions of the same crime. It is a tough nut to crack that is for sure.

 

[♪alt13]

Imo one of the reasons these exist to begin with is that the judges did a crappy job meting out "justice" as perceived by the voting public. So minimum mandatories were passed to ensure that SOME justice was handed down even if the judge would have given them a slap on the wrist. Not that I agree with it the way it is implemented now, but I have a close to home example.

Just over 3 years ago my bro-in-law was killed on his motorcycle by a 20-year-old kid who had THC and booze in his bloodstream and was texting while driving over the speed limit. He hit my brother-in-law, who was sitting on his bike at a stop light, at right around 75 mph, fast enough that he killed my BIL instantly, and so hard that his helmet was crushed and the force of his helmet hitting the minivan dented and BENT the A-pillar (windshield pillar) of the van. It also almost killed his GF who was in the passenger seat. In fitting irony, the driver walked away, because the one thing he did right was have his seat belt fastened. They tried him with everything they could, vehicular murder, which I had never heard of before that incident. It carried a mandatory minimum, iirr, of 5 years, with possibility of life. The judge gave him the MM because "he was young and has his whole life ahead of him". So the scumbag that took my BIL from this earth, a family man with a kid, wife of over 20 years, and was a decorated war veteran from BOTH gulf wars, was out of jail this summer, time off for good behavior or some other ****. The judge wanted to give him probation, but was forced to give him the mandatory minimum. Was justice served? Imo, **** no.

As has been brought up before, different versions of the same crime. It is a tough nut to crack that is for sure.

Yeah but if I had a sack full of weed in my house and my hunting rifle the mandatory minimum is 55 years if federally charged.

We have a way to deal with lax judges and it's called the ballot box. WE confirm judges every election and if we are not satisfied we need to vote them out.

 

[LogGrad98]

Yeah but if I had a sack full of weed in my house and my hunting rifle the mandatory minimum is 55 years if federally charged.

We have a way to deal with lax judges and it's called the ballot box. WE confirm judges every election and if we are not satisfied we need to vote them out.

Well like I said I don't agree with them the way they are implemented currently but some form of them is a good thing imo, whether it is judicial oversight or a graduated scale for minimum sentences I support some form of this to ensure that people like that guy get some form of punishment that fits the crime.

Also we need some form of grading scale for judges. It is very hard for the average vote to know which judges are soft on what and hard-asses on what.