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**Jazz fanz realistic finals expectations? 10 years? 5 years?

Lakers_Slapper

Lakers_Slapper

Well-Known Member
I'm a fan of over 25 years. I'm all about improvement, but the real question is, when is our next trip to the finals? It may seem like a long shot, which is my exact point. Why is it ok for the fanz to accept anything less than a title contending team? Let me guess, give them a shot, they'll come along, they're getting it together etc, etc. Why is it that we spend every off season waiting to see how every other team improves themself? The jazz however? Sign and draft an overabundance of PF/C's. At what point, as fanz do we demand a championship caliber team? We're really going to post how ok we are with a team that maybe will win 42 games? When is enough.....enough?
 
I give it 3-6 years. Why? Because I don't think Jazz are going to sell off one of our strugglers for a name currently in the NBA. They're going to say "We believe in so-so talent and blah blah blah" Only way we win earlier is if the strugglers GTFO Kanter style.
 
Lakers_Slapper said:
I'm a fan of over 25 years. I'm all about improvement, but the real question is, when is our next trip to the finals? It may seem like a long shot, which is my exact point. Why is it ok for the fanz to accept anything less than a title contending team? Let me guess, give them a shot, they'll come along, they're getting it together etc, etc. Why is it that we spend every off season waiting to see how every other team improves themself? The jazz however? Sign and draft an overabundance of PF/C's. At what point, as fanz do we demand a championship caliber team? We're really going to post how ok we are with a team that maybe will win 42 games? When is enough.....enough?
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1. First off, define a title contending team. From 1997-2015, here is the list of WC champions: Utah, SA, LA Lakers, Dallas, OKC, Golden State. That's it. Six teams in the past 19 years. Utah was one of them. And until 2 years ago, when the true rebuild began, they were in playoff contention pretty much every season.

2. I think you have your draft history a bit slanted. Counting trades (i.e. picks made for or by another team), Utah has had 8 first-round choices since 2010:

PG's: Burke, Exum
Wings: Hayward, Burks, Hood
Bigs: Kanter, Gobert, Lyles

That seems like a pretty even distribution to me. And if you were to include our 2nd rounders, it would lean even further in the direction of PG's and wings.

3. As for improvement, do you not get that we are entering year #3 of a rebuild? How long did teams like Boston, LA, Chicago, Detroit, etc. take to build their teams back up after stars retired? KOC did it in a matter of just a couple of seasons after Stockton and Malone left. He gave us a team that made it to the WC Finals. And then he and everyone else realized Boozer and AK were just too flawed to carry Utah further. The ONLY team that has not rebuilt in 20 years is SA. They have a great FO, but they also got lucky with all the injuries in 1996-97, getting the #1 pick and winding up with Duncan.

4. So what moves would you have Utah make? Are there any realistic ones? Our front court is one of the best in the league now. Burks and Hood will battle it out for the SG spot. The ONLY question is at PG. And it's hardly DL's fault Dante blew out his ACL. This late who is available to replace him...Chalmers? Puh..leeze. Look at his stats last year. He's half the guy he used to be.
 
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The difference between me and you is you accept a playoff spot as title contention. We both know that there are several teams per year that make the playoffs and have no chance of contending for a title. Your obviously ok with that. 8th, 5th, 4th, seed is acceptable. I watched a jazz team from the 80's, find a way to contend year after year. Although falling short, they were there. You think the Deron Williams, Carlos Boozer jazz team was a contender? ? Lol. That comes down to pure common sense. Unfortunately common sense isn't so common apparently.
To answer your question, the jazz need to do something other than build a roster of 50% power forwards. Burks? Shooting guard? Wow. How about a player that puts a star of another team in their place? PERIOD.
 
I say about 5 years.

Also, I'm of the opinion that western conference finals equals contending
 
You have a crappy attitude, Slapper. Just be grateful you have a team that consistently wins and occasionally puts a magic season together. Not to mention that the Jazz do it organically, so to speak, and don't try to buy the rings like the Nets or Knicks. Try coming from a state that doesn't even have a pro team like Nebraska and maybe you'll understand how lucky you are to have what you have. I'm 23 and never even been to an nba game for hell sakes!

To answer your lame *** question though, the Jazz will win it all this year.
 
Lakers_Slapper said:
The difference between me and you is you accept a playoff spot as title contention. We both know that there are several teams per year that make the playoffs and have no chance of contending for a title. Your obviously ok with that. 8th, 5th, 4th, seed is acceptable. I watched a jazz team from the 80's, find a way to contend year after year. Although falling short, they were there. You think the Deron Williams, Carlos Boozer jazz team was a contender? ? Lol. That comes down to pure common sense. Unfortunately common sense isn't so common apparently.
To answer your question, the jazz need to do something other than build a roster of 50% power forwards. Burks? Shooting guard? Wow. How about a player that puts a star of another team in their place? PERIOD.
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I never said appearing in the playoffs was contention. I, too, watched the teams from the 80's and 90's. They didn't contend every season. In many years they fell way short. The Boozer/Williams/AK team made it to the WC Finals. I'd say that was contending. Needed just one more player to put Utah in the Finals, but Utah was never able to attract another all-star caliber player via free agency.

Projected roster:
C: Gobert, Withey, Pleiss
PF: Favors, Booker, Lyles (Jerrett)
SF: Hayward, Ingles
SG: Burks, Hood, Millsap
PG: Burke, Neto, Cotton, Exum

You say we have a roster of 50% PF's. I'll call you on this, just as I did on your false draft hyperbole. We have 3, which is comparable to what other teams carry. Oh, 4 right now if you count Jerrett, who is likely waived after training camp. So 4/16 (for now) = 25%. Please enroll in a remedial match class.

Would I love to see an all-star at PG or SG? Yes, by all means let's go out and get that player. Just tell DL who he is and how much he'll sign for. I'm positive DL is just sitting on his butt waiting for the phone to ring.

Or maybe - just maybe - Utah already has a player with that potential already on the roster. Hell, by your measure, Utah should have traded Favors after 2 years or Gobert after one - neither did very much. So let's trade Hood. And trade Exum as soon as he heals. Neither of those guys are all-stars after 1 season.
 
2018/2019 - 4 years. When the teams average age is closer to 28.

This is obviously a damn tricky question. Many factors involved. Gotta take into account that the field of teams will be improving over that span of time too. The NBA isn't like the other leagues. There's only 450 roster spots, which basically forces all teams to be in a constant bulking and then cutting cycle.

There's also future salary cap moves that will have grave consequences, ya just can't afford to miss on a big $$ player playing in the western conference. Unless the Jazz can pull a warriors/david lee type situation, and there's obviously some luck involved with that.. (E.g. Draygoon Green in the 2nd round)

However I do think(hope) the Jazz roster possesses the talent to be able to make a big jump in the quality of their play(55 win team) by the 2017/2018 season. The PG position is obviously the area with the most room for improvement, obviously the Jazz will need an above-average PG to make a serious run in the western conference playoffs.

The responses might be different if the current PG situation wasn't as it is. I'm really not concerned about Dante though, or the PG position because the Jazz are solidly stacked with wings and bigs, they can afford to sift thru the PG's til they find the right one.


The question I have for y'all is, Is there anyway the Jazz can speed up this process(and at what cost)?? I have some idea's..



Also; If the responses in this thread are true. It's fair to ask, shouldn't they sorta be trying to tank a bit now?? (while the fans are aware they aren't in striking distance)
 
PG_AB said:
The question I have for y'all is, Is there anyway the Jazz can speed up this process(and at what cost)?? I have some idea's..
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Yes, trading for a PG. But it has to be done without sacrificing a key player.
Core players: Gobert, Favors, Hayward, Hood, (Exum - maybe)
Tradeable: Burks, Burke, Lyles (and everyone else)

IMO, Hood is a better fit and better overall player than Burks. Rodney is going to be a 40%+ 3PT shooter. I'd like them both on the team because I think Alec could be a great sixth man. But Utah needs a quality PG. Even if healthy, Exum was a couple of years away from being the PG Utah needs. He's got great potential, though, so I'd be hesitant to trade him. But the three I listed plus all of our picks are tradeable assets. Obviously, throw in any expiring contracts too.

I doubt anyone of substance is available right now. Teams have pretty much set their rosters. But veterans could be available near the deadline as teams fall out of contention or young players force teams to give them playing time (like Gobert did over Kanter).
 
Lakers_Slapper said:
The difference between me and you is you accept a playoff spot as title contention. We both know that there are several teams per year that make the playoffs and have no chance of contending for a title. Your obviously ok with that. 8th, 5th, 4th, seed is acceptable. I watched a jazz team from the 80's, find a way to contend year after year. Although falling short, they were there. You think the Deron Williams, Carlos Boozer jazz team was a contender? ? Lol. That comes down to pure common sense. Unfortunately common sense isn't so common apparently.
To answer your question, the jazz need to do something other than build a roster of 50% power forwards. Burks? Shooting guard? Wow. How about a player that puts a star of another team in their place? PERIOD.
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No the difference between you and him is that he can actually see a plan unfolding (even if you don't like it) and you are just yelling and screaming but have provided no alternatives.
 
By 'enough is enough'... what do you pretend to do? Fix the team for them? Or just stop watching. The funny thing is that the Jazz have a more passionate goal of winning it than we do as fans. Why? Because they are doing something about it.

In DL I trust.
 
I would say Conference Finals 3 years from now, especially if OKC loses KD to an Eastern Conference team. Maybe the Finals the year after.
 
I don't really understand your question - you say the Jazz have done so badly in so many things but don't really provide solutions beyond "we should have an allstar SG".
 
mhindy said:
I don't really understand your question - you say the Jazz have done so badly in so many things but don't really provide solutions beyond "we should have an allstar SG".
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Because it is not about answers I think. It is about poking the beehive.
 
This is an impossible thing to predict. Obviously you can have a good sense if your team is a title contender going into a season, but to try to forecast more than a couple years into the future? Too many moving parts.

I think this team will surprise this year and establish themselves as a solid playoff team. Hopefully that builds into the next season. If it does who's to say we don't contend then? I wouldn't put money on it, nor would I put money on any team in the league being a title contender two seasons from now. There's just no way to know that with any confidence.
 
They'll have the option to match or agree to a contract with Trey Lyles going into his 5th season. Exum, Hood, Burke and Gobert could all be back on restricted deals from the summers of '18/'19.

Other than those 5 I don't know how reasonable it is to assume the Unrestricted Free Agents will be back if your talking a 5 year time frame. There's room for a few of the UFA's, How much cash is there to go around though??? Enough to keep all the y̶o̶u̶n̶g̶ prime talent?? probably not.. Hayward will be knocking on 30 then too..

Plus the Jazz have 17 draft picks in the next 4 drafts including 6 first rounders(numbers would be slightly be affected if OKC maneuvers into the lottery in 2018 and 2019.


To say 5-10 years is pretty damning about the potential of what they've got now - IMO
 
Harold Ballz said:
You have a crappy attitude, Slapper. Just be grateful you have a team that consistently wins and occasionally puts a magic season together. Not to mention that the Jazz do it organically, so to speak, and don't try to buy the rings like the Nets or Knicks. Try coming from a state that doesn't even have a pro team like Nebraska and maybe you'll understand how lucky you are to have what you have. I'm 23 and never even been to an nba game for hell sakes!

To answer your lame *** question though, the Jazz will win it all this year.
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I like this guy.
 
I say 5 years from now we should be solidly competing for a title (if we keep our core together). Remember, Stockton and Malone didn't start playing full-time together until the 1987 season, then it took another 5 years until they reached their first Conference Finals. Hopefully we get other pieces along the way that can speed up the process.
 
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