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Jazz Offseason Plan

Go back in time and slap the **** out of DL and Zanik on draft day. Tell them their ‘model’ is absolute trash and trust what your eyes tell you.

Don’t get fleeced by the ****ing Knicks. Make the super obvious draft pick (Bane) that a bunch of message board schmucks know is the right move (Lyles/Booker 2.0).

Remind them that when the trade deadline comes around that if a guy is unplayable in the regular season, it’s safe to assume he also will be useless in the postseason, and maybe look elsewhere.

Unfortunately, this was the year. Maybe next season we get more healthy, or things break our way a bit. But this year was about as close as the Jazz can get to the stars aligning. It’s a bummer.
 
I say trade Rudy and build around Donovan. Rudy has been exposed and small ball is now the way to go. If Rudy could stop creating and causing so many turnovers, we would've won this series by now. But he is just so inept offensively that he hurts the team and stops momentum. The question is what can we get for Rudy.
 
Bawse Dawg said:
We will never get near equal value for Rudy. And while his impact can be lessened in a playoff series he is still very important to our team. The backup C minutes should be enough to convince anyone of that. But I guess not.
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Rudy’s limitations are exactly why it would make sense to have the C depth be more perimeter-oriented because the Jazz have no ****ing versatility. It’s just:
-put big man in paint
-hit as many threes as you can shoot
-sometimes pass inside

It’s not a winning formula in the playoffs at all. If you’re not gonna have the best top-end talent then you sure as **** better have versatility on your roster.

To answer the more general question of the thread; last off-season was the last chance to do anything substantial and the Jazz used their two best assets to grab two low-skill centers and giving the entire bag to their best low-skill center. The Jazz have almost no chance at even a diamond in the rough because they pissed away all of their 2nds, too. Homers laughed at the criticisms while the Jazz thumped teams reeling from a compressed regular season but this **** was always real, was always a problem, and now we are directly facing the consequences.

The upshot to this is I can spend less of my summer(s) figuring out what the Jazz can do to improve the roster.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Rudy’s limitations are exactly why it would make sense to have the C depth be more perimeter-oriented because the Jazz have no ****ing versatility. It’s just:
-put big man in paint
-hit as many threes as you can shoot
-sometimes pass inside

It’s not a winning formula in the playoffs at all. If you’re not gonna have the best top-end talent then you sure as **** better have versatility on your roster.

To answer the more general question of the thread; last off-season was the last chance to do anything substantial and the Jazz used their two best assets to grab two low-skill centers and giving the entire bag to their best low-skill center. The Jazz have almost no chance at even a diamond in the rough because they pissed away all of their 2nds, too. Homers laughed at the criticisms while the Jazz thumped teams reeling from a compressed regular season but this **** was always real, was always a problem, and now we are directly facing the consequences.

The upshot to this is I can spend less of my summer(s) figuring out what the Jazz can do to improve the roster.
Click to expand...

DL should be fired, and then trades giving up valuable pieces will have to be made this offseason. We have skilled offensive players that can help teams and should have trade value. We just went too all-in on too many players with the same skillsets.

If this isn’t the offseason with the most changes in the last few years, I will be surprised. I expect tumult. If there is no tumult, we’re doing it wrong. Our one-dimensional core is aging out, but still has some trade value.
 
Ineptimusprime said:
DL should be fired, and then trades giving up valuable pieces will have to be made this offseason.

If this isn’t the offseason with the most changes in the last few years, I will be surprised.
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I’ll tell you what’s gonna happen:
-The Jazz will try to re-sign Conley but they have a number they say no to.
-Either Conley walks, or the Jazz end up trading Favors, Bogey, or Clarkson for little or no returning salary and no returning assets (they might have to send assets, they just don’t have any).
-in whatever iteration, the Jazz will add nothing of value and will lose something(s) of value.

This absolutely is/was the year. I doubt the franchise will ever have a more open-path for as long as I live.
 
Bawse Dawg said:
We will never get near equal value for Rudy. And while his impact can be lessened in a playoff series he is still very important to our team. The backup C minutes should be enough to convince anyone of that. But I guess not.
Click to expand...
Well our backup C minutes are going to another center with zero offensive ability. If our backup center was somebody like Batum, we would have some sort of sample to evaluate what all our shooters would look like surrounded by a 5th shooter instead of a space filler.
 
NUMBERICA said:
I’ll tell you what’s gonna happen:
-The Jazz will try to re-sign Conley but they have a number they say no to.
-Either Conley walks, or the Jazz end up trading Favors, Bogey, or Clarkson for little or no returning salary and no returning assets (they might have to send assets, they just don’t have any).
-in whatever iteration, the Jazz will add nothing of value and will lose something(s) of value.

This absolutely is/was the year. I doubt the franchise will ever have a more open-path for as long as I live.
Click to expand...
If this is what happens, we’re on a downward slide for the next few years and Don is a Knick in a few years.

It being the case that we are bound to get worse or enter cap hell with a non-contending core, I think we should embrace getting worse and try to move our aging players this offseason for younger players and try to get more on Don’s timeline. Try to start the reload now so it’s not a complete rebuild in 3-4 years.
 
Ineptimusprime said:
If this is what happens, we’re on a downward slide for the next few years and Don is a Knick in a few years.

It being the case that we are bound to get worse or enter cap hell with a non-contending core, I think we should embrace getting worse and try to move our aging players this offseason for younger players and try to get more on Don’s timeline.
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Our aging players don’t have substantial positive trade value at their age and contract statuses. The Jazz are straight stuck.

The best-case scenario is that the Jazz keep Mike at a reasonable number and the Jazz are able to offload Favors without sending assets. Maybe they find another Royce or Ingles in the scrap heap and they can play in a couple of years.
 
At the trade deadline, Chicago traded decent young center Wendell Carter Jr. and two 1st round picks for Vucevic. I guarantee you some team would trade something substantial for Rudy who has much more trade value.

Is it Charlotte who throws a ton at us? Boston? Indiana? New Orleans? Sacramento? Another?

Rudy's trade value is at it's absolute highest. In a few years, we will be cussing his $45 million annual salary. If Don and Rudy need a split, the time to trade Rudy is this summer. We don't want to do it, but it just makes sense.

The only other idea is if we somehow get some great player fit like Jerami Grant by trading Bojan and Clarkson. Then we re-sign Conley.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Our aging players don’t have substantial positive trade value at their age and contract statuses. The Jazz are straight stuck.

The best-case scenario is that the Jazz keep Mike at a reasonable number and the Jazz are able to offload Favors without sending assets. Maybe they find another Royce or Ingles in the scrap heap and they can play in a couple of years.
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Not substantial, but they have some trade value. We could get something good for Bogey and/or Clarkson.

Yeah, I know we likely get worse in the short term.
 
campaignist said:
Im not on the trade Rudy train. If he didn’t have to do 80% of the lifting on defense and rebounding, he’d be just fine.
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This is the biggest issue. Clippers are going all wings, and Gobert can’t guard both the perimeter and the paint because no one can stay in front of their man. Clippers small ball has exposed this. The only problem is we can’t address this in free agency because we are over the cap, and getting rid of Conley I think won’t help this. I’m just not sure how we put the right Players around him. Guys who can defend and hit the three ball at a high rate. Late in the fourth I thought the jazz needed to sit Gobert and bring in JC. Clippers made shots because they were in rhythm offensively because Gobert can’t be everywhere at once. Clippers got wide open shots specifically because of this.
 
I'll never understand the FO going all in on older, unathletic players vs. aligning with Donovan's timeline in pairing him with younger, longer, more athletic wings. It makes no ****ing sense. Now we're stuck between a rock and a hard place in that our older players don't have tradeable value.

If DL isn't canned this offseason.... how do you squander away the past 4 seasons after seeing Donovan's rookie year?!
 
LoPo said:
Rudy's trade value is at it's absolute highest. In a few years, we will be cussing his $45 million annual salary. If Don and Rudy need a split, the time to trade Rudy is this summer. We don't want to do it, but it just makes sense.
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I don’t think teams will be clamoring to give the jazz a haul like that for Gobert with that big contract specifically because he can’t get his own offense other than put backs.
 
LoPo said:
Well our backup C minutes are going to another center with zero offensive ability. If our backup center was somebody like Batum, we would have some sort of sample to evaluate what all our shooters would look like surrounded by a 5th shooter instead of a space filler.
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I’m not saying there isn’t some version of a more versatile team featuring Don and without Rudy that is more successful in the postseason.

But we simply can’t make it happen. The team was built around Rudy. He has WAY less value anywhere else. So the number 1 asset you might flip, you are getting pennies on the dollar in terms of impact back in a trade. Gobert guarantees you a great regular season defense and is a huge floor raiser. Lose him and play-in game or missing the playoffs completely becomes a real possibility.

And beyond that. The asset cupboard is absolutely wiped clean. While I understand the desire. We are simply in no position to completely rebuild the roster that just got us the best record in the league. We don’t have the moves to make.

Let Ryan Smith spend a bonkers luxury tax bill by retaining Conley. And run it back hoping for better health luck. And make some roster improvements on the fringes. I don’t see any other viable options.
 
Ineptimusprime said:
Not substantial, but they have some trade value. We could get something good for Bogey and/or Clarkson.

Yeah, I know we likely get worse in the short term.
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Homey is going to go full Homey here. Let Conley, Niang, Oni, Morgan, Ersan, Matty Ice and Hughes go. To replace them: 1st round draft pick, resign Mudiay, look to what new coaches put on the waiver wire for former first round picks, sign the following Aussie players: Jock Landale, Jarell Martin (1st round pick of Memphis in 2015), John Mooney (a Jack Cooley with talent), Anthony Drmic (has played against the Jazz a couple of times in pre season), go and sign the best undrafted rookie players there are and tell Quin that he is going to give these guys a chance. Brantley and Forrest get to stay. At least they played hard when called upon.
 
l Abach l said:
I'll never understand the FO going all in on older, unathletic players vs. aligning with Donovan's timeline in pairing him with younger, longer, more athletic wings. It makes no ****ing sense. Now we're stuck between a rock and a hard place in that our older players don't have tradeable value.

If DL isn't canned this offseason.... how do you squander away the past 4 seasons after seeing Donovan's rookie year?!
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I know Tobias Harris got a lot more than Bojan, but Harris is a better all-around player and about four years younger. That’s one thing.

Another thing is Malcolm Brogdon is basically the perfect backcourt mate for Mitchell and went for a rate that I refuse to believe the Jazz couldn’t have gotten him.

Conley and Bogey have been good. But the age thing was always a problem, not to mention Bogey’s bad D and passing and Mike’s size. And I get it, the Jazz got both of them whereas they probably only could’ve gotten one of Harris or Brogdon. But they also get to keep assets to build the team with and that’s important.

If the Jazz win it all (or get damn close) by going all-in on aging dudes, then it’s hard to argue against it. Anything less and it looks pretty damn short-sighted.
 
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