Hopper
Banned
I dunno, Mo, but that's the way it sounded to me:
Sirkickyass said:
In any event, that's not the question I initially asked, which you have now kinda skipped over. Are you going to address that question?
Jesse Jackson is a Clown and Needs to Stop Already
- Thread starter Archie Moses
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I dunno, Mo, but that's the way it sounded to me:
In any event, that's not the question I initially asked, which you have now kinda skipped over. Are you going to address that question?
in answer to your (much) earlier question, YES, I emphatically did feel that part of what you were being warned against was the habit of making repeated, consecutive posts. If you want to make your own rules, pay for a premium account and have your own forum. It really doesn't cost much.
It makes it difficult for me to find the posts that I AM interested in reading, particularly if they're not particularly lengthy posts. All I see are repeated posts that I'm trying to ignore (or if you're on my "ignore list" I get repeated posts to that effect). The end result is that the board is difficult for me to read.
I don't know if what I've said is going to make sense to you. Even if it does, my guess would be that you're going to come up with more questions. But I'll tell you something, I'm starting to feel like I'm just spinning my wheels here, and it's getting annoying to me. So don't count on getting any more questions answered by me at this point in time. I feel I've invested as much time in this topic as I care to for now.
Hopper
Banned
OK, Mo, I respect that. Let me offer my apologies for annoying and inconveniencing you so badly by responding to posts and asking questions.
D
Deleted member 95
Guest
The internuttz:
Serious Business.
Serious Business.
no need to apologize. it sounds kind of snide anyhow. what gets especially annoying - or perhaps tiring is a better way to put it - is that it seems there's never going to be an answer that satisfies you.
once again: I'm starting to feel like I'm just spinning my wheels.
Look at Taint go -- he's officially annoyed one of his FEW supporters into submission by being the obnoxious *** hat that we've all grown to despise. Way to go, Taint, er, OneBrow.
I'm starting to think that maybe Write4u isn't as psycho as we all thought.
I'm starting to think that maybe Write4u isn't as psycho as we all thought.
Archie Moses
Well-Known Member
I personally think this could have been handled a lot better than it was. It was like a bad PR campaign gone terrible wrong.
Hopper
Banned
Mo, sometimes I actually ask questions just to try to understand the thought process that led a person to a given conclusion. But not everyone likes to do that, let alone "debate" an issue. When it comes to this kinda thing, I have found that people generally more or less fall into one of 3 categories:
1. People who welcome questions, and enjoy responding to them, even if just for the sake of the discussion and for the opportunity to better identify and elucidate their own reasoning process for themselves,
2. People who really neither welcome nor attempt to deter questions, but who feel it's a waste to spend very much time explaining their thought processes to someone else, and
3. People who almost resent being asked questions, and see it as some kinda discourteous imposition on them.
People who are in category 1 have trouble understanding/relating to people in category 3 (and vice versa, it works both ways).
No one is either right or wrong about this. People are just different, that's all. Sometimes just understanding the other person's preferences helps stop the interactions from becoming too annoying for anyone involved.
1. People who welcome questions, and enjoy responding to them, even if just for the sake of the discussion and for the opportunity to better identify and elucidate their own reasoning process for themselves,
2. People who really neither welcome nor attempt to deter questions, but who feel it's a waste to spend very much time explaining their thought processes to someone else, and
3. People who almost resent being asked questions, and see it as some kinda discourteous imposition on them.
People who are in category 1 have trouble understanding/relating to people in category 3 (and vice versa, it works both ways).
No one is either right or wrong about this. People are just different, that's all. Sometimes just understanding the other person's preferences helps stop the interactions from becoming too annoying for anyone involved.
Hopper
Banned
Along those same kinda lines, I have also found that:
1. Some people welcome the presentation and advocacy by others of new, or alternative, viewpoints, just to see if there's something there they haven't considered or given much thought to.
2. Some people do not really want whatever their present opinions and attitudes are to be "disturbed" by the advocacy of alternative viewpoints, and
3. Some people welcome any encounter with an alternative viewpoint, not because they want to "consider" anything new, but simply because they welcome any opportunity they can get to prove they are right, and/or to ridicule and demean those who do not share their views. This helps them reinforce and "prop up" their current belief system, I figure.
1. Some people welcome the presentation and advocacy by others of new, or alternative, viewpoints, just to see if there's something there they haven't considered or given much thought to.
2. Some people do not really want whatever their present opinions and attitudes are to be "disturbed" by the advocacy of alternative viewpoints, and
3. Some people welcome any encounter with an alternative viewpoint, not because they want to "consider" anything new, but simply because they welcome any opportunity they can get to prove they are right, and/or to ridicule and demean those who do not share their views. This helps them reinforce and "prop up" their current belief system, I figure.
Hopper
Banned
Are you with Trout in hating me equally, whichever handle I choose to use at the time, eh, Vinny?
Hopper
Banned
Not sure what you mean by this, Archie. Care to elaborate?
I don't hate you Hoppy, I leave that emotion of effort for Kicky. You amuse me. Your writing style, your leaps in logic, the stands you take....it's all very amusing. Amusing in a pathetic sort of way. Like watching a one armed man try to solve a Rubik's Cube.
This reminded me of a joke I heard today:
Q: What do you call a guy who has his left arm and left leg cut off in a car wreck?
A: He's alright.
G-O-A-T
Member
This is very true. However, you fail to take into consideration that people can switch categories over time. Conversation that starts out intriguing will eventually become boring/annoying or worse, get completely derailed... it always happens. For instance, from the looks of things, several people have gone from category 1 to 3, in this thread alone, during the last few pages of discussion.
Not all people have the same degree of tolerance to continue a discussion... and in the case of this message board, I don't think it would be a stretch to say your tolerance level is second to none.
Same thing as above. It's great to share viewpoints, but if someone wanted to read 20+ pages worth of opinions they would probably just buy a book on the subject... or read a message board that specialized on that subject. On the flip side, if someone has 20+ pages worth of opinion to share, they might wanna consider writing a book themself... or heaven forbid, at least have the courtesy of starting their own topic instead of hijacking an otherwise interesting thread.
FYI, not all of this is directed at you Hopper... but I figured this might be an appropriate place to rant, you know... seeing how this thread started out as a tribute to the great Jesse Jackson and has now deteriorated into a semantics argument discussing internet message board communication rights.
Hopper
Banned
Hopper
Banned
Now that the "first post, new page" point has been passed, Goat, I'll add Hopper's comments, eh?
Obviously, the event of me getting an "infraction" has more effect on, and is therefore of more interest to, me than anyone else on the board. Even so, I never attempted to make a thread topic out of it, or otherwise initiate any kinda "argument" about it. Kicky, ever on the vigilant defensive (which ya might call "offensive," if ya catch my drift), apparently felt compelled to accuse me of "mischaracterization," somewheres along about page 3. Every post I made which was designed simply to correct what I thought were misstatements by him, generated another post by him which was designed to prove himself right, and me wrong. I'm not one to be cowed into submission, and therefore consent to what I believe to be erroneous claims, just because someone else is extremely adamant about asserting a contrary position, and/or just because that person may have some kinda power over me. I'm just funny that way, I guess.
Obviously, the event of me getting an "infraction" has more effect on, and is therefore of more interest to, me than anyone else on the board. Even so, I never attempted to make a thread topic out of it, or otherwise initiate any kinda "argument" about it. Kicky, ever on the vigilant defensive (which ya might call "offensive," if ya catch my drift), apparently felt compelled to accuse me of "mischaracterization," somewheres along about page 3. Every post I made which was designed simply to correct what I thought were misstatements by him, generated another post by him which was designed to prove himself right, and me wrong. I'm not one to be cowed into submission, and therefore consent to what I believe to be erroneous claims, just because someone else is extremely adamant about asserting a contrary position, and/or just because that person may have some kinda power over me. I'm just funny that way, I guess.
G-O-A-T
Member
I see why your pissed... but what recourse do really have? You've asked your questions and you've got your answers... you might not like the answers, hell, the answers might not be intellectually satisfying to the majority of the board... but nevertheless, you got your answers! Just as an aside, often the reason people don't get the right answers is because they are asking the wrong questions (or asking in the wrong tone)... if you don't like your answers, take a step back and see if this is you.
The last couple pages have become a competition of wit... unfortunately, some refuse to admit when they are wrong, or worse, even recognize it. But I gotta say, in most cases, even the winner of an intellectual battle of the internetz still comes off looking just like the winner of a special olympics 100 meter race... you can finish that line off.
You seem like a pretty smart guy Hopper, and that's probably why you get accused of trolling... if you were a certain biology > gays type of guy, people would probably be more apt to answer your questions with simple responses... but considering that you seem capable of a higher level of thought, it's hard for people to understand why you skip the big picture in favor of the details so often. I don't know if you are really trolling or not... but if it's not trolling, I would suggest taking a step back and reading what kicky / moe is saying, and instead of looking for logical fallacies, just try to pay attention to their overall message.
Making mountains out of molehills is a job for lawyers... please leave it to them... even most of them only do it because they get paid too!
The last couple pages have become a competition of wit... unfortunately, some refuse to admit when they are wrong, or worse, even recognize it. But I gotta say, in most cases, even the winner of an intellectual battle of the internetz still comes off looking just like the winner of a special olympics 100 meter race... you can finish that line off.
You seem like a pretty smart guy Hopper, and that's probably why you get accused of trolling... if you were a certain biology > gays type of guy, people would probably be more apt to answer your questions with simple responses... but considering that you seem capable of a higher level of thought, it's hard for people to understand why you skip the big picture in favor of the details so often. I don't know if you are really trolling or not... but if it's not trolling, I would suggest taking a step back and reading what kicky / moe is saying, and instead of looking for logical fallacies, just try to pay attention to their overall message.
Making mountains out of molehills is a job for lawyers... please leave it to them... even most of them only do it because they get paid too!
Hopper
Banned
I've tried lookin at their overall message. I'll be the first to admit that I could be misinterpreting them and/or overlooking something. That said, the only "overall message" I can discern is something like:
1. My convenience counts, your inconvenience doesn't, and
2. We have the power, and therefore our orders must be obeyed. There is nothing to be considered or explained beyond that.
I've heard the same from people "in authority" all my life (not all, of course, but some). It makes PERFECT sense to them, but it never has to me. I guess there is a 3rd overall message, which is perhaps the one you are stressin, Goat, to wit:
3. What the hell are you gunna do about it? Can't do nuthin, right? So just shut up.
100 years ago, the whole "issue" and any/all "argument" would have been conclusively settled, once and for all, with all possible rebuttal refuted, by one simple observation:
"I'm white, you're black."
G-O-A-T
Member
3. Posting in an annoying fashion will lead to warnings and an eventual ban.
What is annoying? It's what the fellow members of the Jazzfan community say it is. There is no rhyme or reason... it's just what it is. If a moderator has to tell you that something is annoying, there are probably multiple people that feel that way.
Judging from the looks of the board over the last few days, it seems that you have gotten the point too... I'm not seeing the "skip" / "repost"'s anywhere like I was a couple days ago.
(As far as your new thread topic getting merged, I think you were right... but considering the way you were pumping up your post count over the past few weeks, I think Kicky was perfectly justified in doing what he did)
Frankly though, if you received a formal warning for your 1st incident of "annoying" conduct, that is unfortunate, because you may have honestly seen nothing wrong with it.
1. Conform to what is requested.
2. Leave for better places.
3. Stick around and piss people off until kicked out.
I'd pick whichever seemed most appropriate at the time...
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