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John Collins 5-Out Offense Thread

Elizah Huge

Elizah Huge

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It has been awesome to watch Hardy implement Collins as the Center in our 5-Out Offense.

I really think he’s starting to figure things out. He’s been beating defenders off of the dribble a lot more lately and he’s shooting the ball great. He’s been a lot better on the defensive end as well.

Here are his stats during this current 5-game win streak by the Jazz:

15.2 PPG, 6.8 RPG, 1.8 APG, 1.0 SPG on 68/50/80 shooting splits in 25.5 MPG

8/16 from 3 and 76.6 TS%(!!!)

+45 in this 5-game span
 
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Fairly early on it was obvious his finger injury is better as he's shot well for a while. The defensive side is key. If Collins can keep it up on defense he's wonderful to have on the floor as he's efficient on offense and can stretch the floor.
 
Elizah Huge said:
I really think he’s starting to figure things out. He’s been beating defenders off of the dribble a lot more lately
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Props to Collins for his good play as of late, but... he most certainly has not done that. LOL

Consistency with the 3pt shot is what makes or breaks him offensively. His role on this team is basically a corner spacer who will occasionally sneak into the dunker's spot. Collins and Lauri have both been shooting really well and the offense is humming as a consequnce. Theres TONS of space.

Let's hope he can keep this up.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
Props to Collins for his good play as of late, but... he most certainly has not done that. LOL

Consistency with the 3pt shot is what makes or breaks him offensively. His role on this team is basically a corner spacer who will occasionally sneak into the dunker's spot. Collins and Lauri have both been shooting really well and the offense is humming as a consequnce. Theres TONS of space.

Let's hope he can keep this up.
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View: https://twitter.com/UtahJazzClips/status/1746381447718482114/mediaViewer?currentTweet=1746381447718482114&currentTweetUser=UtahJazzClips
 
Tremendous Upside said:
Props to Collins for his good play as of late, but... he most certainly has not done that. LOL

Consistency with the 3pt shot is what makes or breaks him offensively. His role on this team is basically a corner spacer who will occasionally sneak into the dunker's spot. Collins and Lauri have both been shooting really well and the offense is humming as a consequnce. Theres TONS of space.

Let's hope he can keep this up.
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I dont know what counts for you as "beating off the dribble", but his drives have been decent. Last 5 games he is 5/9 on driving buckets, and for the season he is 35/70.. with roughly 1/4 being unassisted.
 
Glad to see a Collins Appreciation thread finally. Hardy was absolutely correct when he said that Collins is a center. Once moved to that position in the five out scheme, things really clicked for him and the spacing has improved and his reads have been on point imo.
 
Release the Kraken said:
Glad to see a Collins Appreciation thread finally. Hardy was absolutely correct when he said that Collins is a center. Once moved to that position in the five out scheme, things really clicked for him and the spacing has improved and his reads have been on point imo.
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What he's doing isn't that much different than what he was doing before. The shots are just falling and the whole offense is working better now, with more all movement and spacing. Collins is helping that, and it's helping Collins.

Whether he's playing the 4 or 5, his main job on offense is spacing from the corner and being ready to dive to the hoop along the baseline. He's not doing much posting up (if any), which is great.
 
HermanG said:
I dont know what counts for you as "beating off the dribble", but his drives have been decent. Last 5 games he is 5/9 on driving buckets, and for the season he is 35/70.. with roughly 1/4 being unassisted.
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I guess he's strictly a straight line driver. When he sees the rim and has a clear lane, he has a good chance of scoring. But when he needs "wiggle", switching hands and that kind of stuff... nah. He's simply now a good ballhandler.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
What he's doing isn't that much different than what he was doing before. The shots are just falling and the whole offense is working better now, with more all movement and spacing. Collins is helping that, and it's helping Collins.

Whether he's playing the 4 or 5, his main job on offense is spacing from the corner and being ready to dive to the hoop along the baseline. He's not doing much posting up (if any), which is great.
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Yeah, l can’t really distinguish what the difference is in his responsibilities if any, only responding to the earlier criticism that he wasn’t picking up the offense. Maybe the lane was too packed for him to navigate or whatever but I remember a few times that he was noticeably out of position in the play. But whatever the reasons, he has obviously found his comfort zone and is contributing to our recent success.
 
Tremendous Upside said:
Props to Collins for his good play as of late, but... he most certainly has not done that. LOL

Consistency with the 3pt shot is what makes or breaks him offensively. His role on this team is basically a corner spacer who will occasionally sneak into the dunker's spot. Collins and Lauri have both been shooting really well and the offense is humming as a consequnce. Theres TONS of space.

Let's hope he can keep this up.
Click to expand...

John's recent surge has nothing to do with shooting the ball well. He's basically shooting the exact same as he was earlier in the season. What has changed is his scoring inside the paint. He's finding his places and opportunities to score in the paint and it's made all the difference.

Playing without Kessler has helped, but he was also struggling mightily without Kessler to begin the season. I think it's a combo of the different personnel, Hardy using him more intelligently, John figuring out his spots, and also that it was not possible he was as bad as he was to begin the season.
 
Jazz aren't playing anyone in the dunker's spot anymore, John or Walker. The fact that our passing has adapted to Walker and Collins slashing from the corners has been a big difference. Walker is having to play with Key and Clarkson more because he isn't a threat to shoot from the corner like John who can easily play with Dunn.

It is really nice to have options and a coach willing to consider them.
 
framer said:
Jazz aren't playing anyone in the dunker's spot anymore, John or Walker. The fact that our passing has adapted to Walker and Collins slashing from the corners has been a big difference. Walker is having to play with Key and Clarkson more because he isn't a threat to shoot from the corner like John who can easily play with Dunn.

It is really nice to have options and a coach willing to consider them.
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I haven't been a Hardy fan but he has done a very good job of working out his rotations to find lineups that work best.
 
KqWIN said:
John's recent surge has nothing to do with shooting the ball well. He's basically shooting the exact same as he was earlier in the season. What has changed is his scoring inside the paint. He's finding his places and opportunities to score in the paint and it's made all the difference.

Playing without Kessler has helped, but he was also struggling mightily without Kessler to begin the season. I think it's a combo of the different personnel, Hardy using him more intelligently, John figuring out his spots, and also that it was not possible he was as bad as he was to begin the season.
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Just to give more context to this, John has been shooting 87% at the rim since he's come back into this new starting lineup. He was only shooting 68% before that....and it wasn't just a function of playing with Kessler. He was actually doing better at the basket with Kessler on the court.

It seems as though he has gotten his fastball back. The 4/5 lineups with Lauri are working as we may have expected in the off season.
 
Hitting the above the break three is part of the reason the other stuff is working imo. Being used more in the pick and roll (haven't checked the numbers so maybe its the same) is also helpful. If you have to guard him at the top it opens up driving lanes that spacing to the corner doesn't.

IDK... I need a bigger sample on the shooting from the top but its really promising. The defense is always going to be really bad but sometimes you play bad defense and teams miss (opposite is also true) so as long as the offense is elite the arrangement is helpful.
 
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