Millers want more money
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That's not what I'm describing at all.
fishonjazz
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I think the second post was not serious. Sarcasm and whatnot I believe
Are the Millers doing all this as a do-gooder community employment project? Or is this an attempt to make a greater profit? I think that it is the latter myself. Aren't maintenance and upgrades part of a normal business expense? Why do the taxpayers have to foot some of the bill? Would the Millers not do this without the 40% tax break?
I can't speak for the Miller's motivation. Could be a little of both. LHM was a big community guy. I'm just saying the Jazz have a positive economic impact on the community. I'm not one of those who think the Jazz should be run as an altruistic non-profit enterprise. It's a business, and I think the Millers should get a reasonable return on investment, keeping in mind they have made a bundle on capital appreciation.
.
Yes, they are. I have no idea if they would do it without the tax incentive or if they would spend as much. They're just taking advantage of something that has become common practice. It's just getting publicity because it's the Jazz. States and communities offer tax incentives all the time to businesses who expand or re-locate. How about Start-Up New York? No taxes for 10 years.
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mellow
Well-Known Member
I am strongly FOR the RDA.
I was angry and trying to be funny when I responded to Green. But I'm not funny and I should never post what I type in anger.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
Ahh. Now I understand, and I strongly agree with your original post. On a side note, message board sarcasm is fraught with dangers and should only be attempted by trained professionals.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
Gives me greater confidence in our city government that they figured this one out so quickly.
green
Well-Known Member
Of course they did. Miller's income increasing is more important than public schools.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
Please explain how that extra $33 million in property tax (not to mention the impact on neighboring properties or other revenue sources) is going to hurt public schools.
mellow
Well-Known Member
Declining Value of the Arena, propped up by reinvestment....
Value History
Land ValueBuilding ValueMarket Value
2016 $ 0 $ 36,654,700 $ 36,654,700
2015 $ 0 $ 27,639,400 $ 27,639,400
2014 $ 0 $ 36,924,800 $ 36,924,800
2013 $ 0 $ 32,584,800 $ 32,584,800
2012 $ 0 $ 42,107,300 $ 42,107,300
From the Trib....
Members of Salt Lake City's Redevelopment Agency on Tuesday voted unanimously in favor of the tax increment reimbursement plan, which will allow the company to recoup the money over a period of 25 years.
"The improvements they will be making … will be significant and will really add value to the venue and to the neighborhood," said RDA vice chairman Derek Kitchen.
Approximately $12 million of that money would come from a percentage of the increased property taxes LHM would pay on the arena as a result of the improvements to the block. The company would also stand to receive a projected $3.9 million from interest on that money, according to city documents. LHM, meanwhile, will also get about $6.7 million — approximately $306,000 a year — that would come from tax increment the RDA collects from other parts of the city's Central Business District project area.
Kitchen said he would have liked to see the state or some other entity help cover that $6.7 million, saying that he worried about taking money away from the project area that could otherwise go toward homeless issues, transportation or public art.
From RDA web page: https://www.slcrda.com/finances.htm
Funding: Tax Increment
The financial engine that drives an RDA’s urban renewal efforts is tax increment financing. Tax increment is the increase (or “increment”) in the property taxes generated within a project area, over and above property taxes generated in that same area prior to the establishment of the RDA project area. The establishment of a project area and the collection of tax increment funds must be approved by the RDA Board of Directors and the local taxing entities (school district, library, water districts, county, etc.).
The tax increment generated in a project area is reinvested into that same project area, thus recycling the funds for a specified period of time, usually 20-25 years, after which the tax increment will again be available to the local taxing entities. During the life of the project area, the taxing entities continue to receive the same amount of property taxes that they received prior to the establishment of the project area, along with any share of the increment they may have negotiated with the RDA.
Improved redevelopment project areas contribute to the overall health and vitality of the city by reversing the negative effects of blight, while increasing the tax base from which the taxing entities draw their funds. In Salt Lake City, Redevelopment Project Areas’ tax bases have historically grown at twice the rate of surrounding areas that are not designated as RDA project areas.
Value History
Land ValueBuilding ValueMarket Value
2016 $ 0 $ 36,654,700 $ 36,654,700
2015 $ 0 $ 27,639,400 $ 27,639,400
2014 $ 0 $ 36,924,800 $ 36,924,800
2013 $ 0 $ 32,584,800 $ 32,584,800
2012 $ 0 $ 42,107,300 $ 42,107,300
From the Trib....
Members of Salt Lake City's Redevelopment Agency on Tuesday voted unanimously in favor of the tax increment reimbursement plan, which will allow the company to recoup the money over a period of 25 years.
"The improvements they will be making … will be significant and will really add value to the venue and to the neighborhood," said RDA vice chairman Derek Kitchen.
Approximately $12 million of that money would come from a percentage of the increased property taxes LHM would pay on the arena as a result of the improvements to the block. The company would also stand to receive a projected $3.9 million from interest on that money, according to city documents. LHM, meanwhile, will also get about $6.7 million — approximately $306,000 a year — that would come from tax increment the RDA collects from other parts of the city's Central Business District project area.
Kitchen said he would have liked to see the state or some other entity help cover that $6.7 million, saying that he worried about taking money away from the project area that could otherwise go toward homeless issues, transportation or public art.
From RDA web page: https://www.slcrda.com/finances.htm
Funding: Tax Increment
The financial engine that drives an RDA’s urban renewal efforts is tax increment financing. Tax increment is the increase (or “increment”) in the property taxes generated within a project area, over and above property taxes generated in that same area prior to the establishment of the RDA project area. The establishment of a project area and the collection of tax increment funds must be approved by the RDA Board of Directors and the local taxing entities (school district, library, water districts, county, etc.).
The tax increment generated in a project area is reinvested into that same project area, thus recycling the funds for a specified period of time, usually 20-25 years, after which the tax increment will again be available to the local taxing entities. During the life of the project area, the taxing entities continue to receive the same amount of property taxes that they received prior to the establishment of the project area, along with any share of the increment they may have negotiated with the RDA.
Improved redevelopment project areas contribute to the overall health and vitality of the city by reversing the negative effects of blight, while increasing the tax base from which the taxing entities draw their funds. In Salt Lake City, Redevelopment Project Areas’ tax bases have historically grown at twice the rate of surrounding areas that are not designated as RDA project areas.
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green
Well-Known Member
Money is like manure. If it is piled up in one place, it stinks. When it is spread out, it does great things.
There is no arguing that. Everyone who has half a brain believes this. Anyone who argues against this...well, is an idiot.
The argument lies in how do we spread the money out? Welfare? Government programs? Or do we allow private corps to spread it around?
The answer is in the middle. We need it all. We need corps to create jobs. We need govt to protect us from corps. We need a social welfare net.
We have swung too far to the deregulation side.
Back to the Millers, the question is this:
If the State didn't give the Millers the money, what would happen?
Nothing. They would do the improvements, they would make money, and life would go on with a more attractive downtown, homeless issues a little less worse, and a more enticing place to spend our money.
What happens if we do give the money to the Millers?
We lose the millions of dollars which could have gone to fix the homeless issue the area has, better transportation which could allow more people into the area (which means more money spent in the area) and it could have made the area more attractive, which brings more people, which brings more money.
So, what did we do? Did we look to drive more money there or just line some rich guy's pocket.
Poor and middle class people would rather line some rich guy's pocket.
Blows my mind. That money could have made the area nicer for you to enjoy. Instead, you guys wanted to allow Greggie boy to build another failed sports car racing park and screw over Jazz fans with their cheap tactics and missed playoffs.
There is no arguing that. Everyone who has half a brain believes this. Anyone who argues against this...well, is an idiot.
The argument lies in how do we spread the money out? Welfare? Government programs? Or do we allow private corps to spread it around?
The answer is in the middle. We need it all. We need corps to create jobs. We need govt to protect us from corps. We need a social welfare net.
We have swung too far to the deregulation side.
Back to the Millers, the question is this:
If the State didn't give the Millers the money, what would happen?
Nothing. They would do the improvements, they would make money, and life would go on with a more attractive downtown, homeless issues a little less worse, and a more enticing place to spend our money.
What happens if we do give the money to the Millers?
We lose the millions of dollars which could have gone to fix the homeless issue the area has, better transportation which could allow more people into the area (which means more money spent in the area) and it could have made the area more attractive, which brings more people, which brings more money.
So, what did we do? Did we look to drive more money there or just line some rich guy's pocket.
Poor and middle class people would rather line some rich guy's pocket.
Blows my mind. That money could have made the area nicer for you to enjoy. Instead, you guys wanted to allow Greggie boy to build another failed sports car racing park and screw over Jazz fans with their cheap tactics and missed playoffs.
Forever Jazz
Member
I can't like this post enough. Thanks for bringing common sense to this thread.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
Apparently you have never smelled the results of spreading a manure pile out or you wouldn't have used this analogy.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
They can respend money that they already spent? What are you talking about?
green
Well-Known Member
lol. Check this out:
https://www.sltrib.com/news/4007346-155/slc-passes-tight-budget-without-fixing
Go Millers and the bake the cake, fight for eight Jazz.
At least we helped out the billionaire, right?
https://www.sltrib.com/news/4007346-155/slc-passes-tight-budget-without-fixing
Go Millers and the bake the cake, fight for eight Jazz.
At least we helped out the billionaire, right?