I don't see a path to being a championship contender based on our current roster and future assets compared to the rockets and thunder. We can probably add the griz and spurs to that group as well. The thunder are already elite and have the assets to continue to get better. I don't see any path where we try to stay competitive with Lauri and Sexton that pushes us to their level. The rockets aren't there yet but damn the pieces that they have already collected look like they could be special. Then they have the nets picks and swaps for the next 4 drafts and I think there is a pretty good chance that all 4 end up top ten picks. Do any of you see a path to getting to their level because I don't? They are already a lot better than us and that is with them being injury riddled this year and having a significantly better young core of players. Lets blow this up and swing for the fences with top 5 picks over the next few years along with what we can get for Lauri and Sexton.
Should we go full rebuild?
- Thread starter sip
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homeytennis
Well-Known Member
I can't endure another season like the last two. Going full rebuild will insure many more crappy seasons. I will find something else to do.
The plan so far is perfect. Just avoid the John Collins trade type of mistake and the Jazz will build a contender in time.
How exactly is it perfect? I just don't see a way that we are able to catch up with the rockets and thunder.
I feel like it is a lot more painful to be stuck in the lower to middle tier playoff seed which is where I think we may be heading.
I’ve always believed that having the star players is more of a power position than having whatever picks/assets you get for trading him. We should keep Lauri, having Lauri on our team is a privilege.
Having said that, I also don’t believe in wasting a player’s prime nor do I believe with trying to compete for a half a year only to quit and tank for the other half. By doing this, the Jazz have essentially limited the rewards for trying to win or lose. The goal for winning is the play in. The goal for tanking is to get the 9th pick. Not a ton of reward either way.
They may have squeezed out some extra value by waiting (or they may have lost some), but that comes at a cost of pissing off Lauri after lying to him. If the Jazz want to do Lauri+young players, I think that is fine. If that’s what the FO wants, do it. But actually do it. Don’t play half a season and then quit. Do not go after John Collins if your plan was to not compete. What they’re doing does not install a lot of confidence in me. Either #1, they totally went against their plan of Lauri+youngins and delayed their tank or #2 they actually thought they had a winner and now they’ve pivoted to tanking bc winning didn’t work. Either they had a plan all along but executed poorly or they had a bad plan, it didn’t work, then they switched it.
My first choice would be to move forward with Lauri and build around him. My second choice would be to move him and start over. My least favorite choice is to keep Lauri, but basically operate as if he’s not there and repeatedly wave the middle finger at him.
Having said that, I also don’t believe in wasting a player’s prime nor do I believe with trying to compete for a half a year only to quit and tank for the other half. By doing this, the Jazz have essentially limited the rewards for trying to win or lose. The goal for winning is the play in. The goal for tanking is to get the 9th pick. Not a ton of reward either way.
They may have squeezed out some extra value by waiting (or they may have lost some), but that comes at a cost of pissing off Lauri after lying to him. If the Jazz want to do Lauri+young players, I think that is fine. If that’s what the FO wants, do it. But actually do it. Don’t play half a season and then quit. Do not go after John Collins if your plan was to not compete. What they’re doing does not install a lot of confidence in me. Either #1, they totally went against their plan of Lauri+youngins and delayed their tank or #2 they actually thought they had a winner and now they’ve pivoted to tanking bc winning didn’t work. Either they had a plan all along but executed poorly or they had a bad plan, it didn’t work, then they switched it.
My first choice would be to move forward with Lauri and build around him. My second choice would be to move him and start over. My least favorite choice is to keep Lauri, but basically operate as if he’s not there and repeatedly wave the middle finger at him.
The Jazz are already rebuilding. They're committing to their young players for the most part. They'll trade Clarkson this offseason and then everyone from the Quin Snyder era will be gone. Barring some major trade, the Jazz will add three more draft picks in next year's draft to hopefully change their core. Then it will be another couple seasons of young players soaking up major minutes.
The Jazz are floating along, picking up young talent, developing a few assets, and looking for an opportunity to acquire a top 10-caliber player to really build a contending team, whether that opportunity is through the draft or trade. Those opportunities are rare, but there's no other path to ascension.
Saying the Jazz wanted to make the Playoffs this year was probably just hype to sell tickets early in the season.
The Jazz are floating along, picking up young talent, developing a few assets, and looking for an opportunity to acquire a top 10-caliber player to really build a contending team, whether that opportunity is through the draft or trade. Those opportunities are rare, but there's no other path to ascension.
Saying the Jazz wanted to make the Playoffs this year was probably just hype to sell tickets early in the season.
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Jaanipoeg
Well-Known Member
I think it's important to remember how volatile basketball progression is and not to get too weighed down in the present
A few weeks ago, Jalen Green looked like a disaster on the trade market and now he is looking incredible. The Rockets were far below .500 and I don't think any Jazz fan was worried about them as an insurmountable juggernaut. Now, they look incredible and so all their players have a different shine to them.
Atlanta after their ECF finals run a few years ago looked primed for greatness. Since then they've been a play-in team. Previous Thunder teams looked like an unstoppable young core that then crumbled surprisingly quickly.
I agree that this timeline isn't perfect, just also that perception can change fast. This off-season will give us a lot of direction.
What do you mean by build a team around Lauri?
How good can a Lauri led team really be? I think you are being extremely generous.
Douchebag K
Well-Known Member
the amount of draft picks coming should mean we get lucky and hit on one or two of them This sucks but it's kinda going ok. We could be Detroit
It means build a team with Lauri on the team.
Sardines
Well-Known Member
No team in the NBA can execute a 5 year plan to win a championship from a rebuild with perfection. None. There are too many moving parts. The original plan will never be the eventual plan.
Luck is needed for any team to rebuild into a contender. I'm just talking about being a contender.
This is just the reality, man. Small markets are at a distinct disadvantage in the NBA, so even more luck, more good fortune is needed on top of sound leadership.
Any small market team that starts flailing and scrambling because they need to "swing for the fences" at every single pitch that is thrown is doomed.
The Jazz are better than that. Might be disappointing for instant gratification types, but it is true.
This could take a while. This could take a long while.
Our best assets will be our own picks rather than the wolves and cavs. The rockets already have better talent and the future nets picks and swaps have way more value than the wolves and cavs picks right now. It will be very difficult to pass the rockets in the future. They are already significantly better than us this year and have been riddled by injuries all year.
So you are agreeing with me? Luck is definitely involved so getting as many high end bites at the apple is a big deal.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
I got killed by a lot of different posters for hating on this trade. I was called hater and all manner of idiocy.
And now because of this stupid trade we should trade Lauri and pray we don’t pull another Favors like trade to fix our mistakes
HermanG
Well-Known Member
What? When the FO mailed it in we were worried if we can catch the Rockets in a race towards the bottom. Now all of a sudden they are significantly better?
Are you worried about the 42/33/80 Jalen Green or the 53/15/60 Amen Thompson turning into superstars? Or maybe its Cam Whitmore, who is close to worst in their internal BPM rankings and is probably the worst black hole we have seen a rookie been in a long time. Who are the guys Rockets have that are causing you to hyperventilate?
Sengun is great btw, but not like he is #1 in a contender level guy. Jalen Green has been hot as of late, but unless he seriously leveled up midseason its a hot stretch and despite improving him numbers lately his total body of work for the year is still very meh.