The Biden Administration and All Things Politics

[One Brow]

It is not a gain that I have realized until I sell. How can I be taxed on something that hasn’t happened yet? For example, let’s say I put $15,000 into a fund, and over the course of a year and half, where I put that money gained value by 100%. Now those stocks that I purchased are worth $30,000. Have I gotten to take any of that money home?

To me, "gotten to" refers to opportunity. If you are asking if you had the opportunity to, then you certainly did. Further, you had, and have, the opportunity to borrow against that gain.

No, not unless I sell. I should not be able to be taxed on that gain, until I sell those stocks and that money can actually hit my pocket, it’s actually liquid now. Heck, if I keep that money there and it crashes, and I lose all my money, do I get those taxes on “unrealized capital gains” back?

As a matter of fact, you do get to claim it as a capital loss, offsetting other capital gains.

The whole thing is stupid, and the people it will hurt the most is the middle class.

To my understanding, the stock purchases of the middle class are largely tied up in vehicles that don't get taxed at all until retirement (401Ks, IRAs, etc.), and this proposal doesn't change that.

 

[Hax0rs]

Because if the value of a stock has doubled, that's a genuine gain even if you don't sell the stock, and not imaginary.

WRONG

Banks say otherwise. You can actually use some stocks for collateral as a loan, therefore they have value.

This doesn't make your FALSE claim TRUE

 

[One Brow]

WRONG

By what standard?

This doesn't make your FALSE claim TRUE

What's your standard for something having monetary value, if it's not the ability to get money for it?

 

[Hax0rs]

By what standard?


What's your standard for something having monetary value, if it's not the ability to get money for it?

Once again, if a stock doubles and you don't sell, you've gained no value.

I would love to see your example of where someone took a stock that doubled overnight, and used it as collateral for a bank loan the next day.

 

[One Brow]

Once again, if a stock doubles and you don't sell, you've gained no value.

I would love to see your example of where someone took a stock that doubled overnight, and used it as collateral for a bank loan the next day.

Is anyone talking about paying taxes on overnight increases in capital worth?

While there are stricter limits in place now, that type of borrowing was one of the factors of the boom in the 1920s and the collapse in 1929.

 

[Hax0rs]

Is anyone talking about paying taxes on overnight increases in capital worth?

While there are stricter limits in place now, that type of borrowing was one of the factors of the boom in the 1920s and the collapse in 1929.

Damn boy, its hard for you to say you're wrong huh?

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Utah's not the friendliest of states for that for sure. I'm not a proponent of taxing SS or IRA distributions overall.

There is no way they get that one through. There are a lot of property owners in the United States.

Imagine you have a home worth $1 million. Because of moronic spending bills, inflation skyrockets and the value of your house goes up 30% in a single year. By taxing unrealized capital gains it means that $300k your house just went up in value is now part of your taxable income. If you make $100k at your job, because of the real estate market, you could end up owing in taxes more money than you earned all year. No one is going to vote for that.

 

[One Brow]

Damn boy, its hard for you to say you're wrong huh?

Are you saying that no one uses their stocks as collateral for loans? If not, what am I wrong about here?

 

[Gameface]

Taxing unrealized capital gains is a horrendous idea, imho.

Not only could it hurt a lot of normal people who have retirement funds invested in the stock market, it has the potential to force people to sell stock to cover their tax burden which would very possibly cause a massive stock market crash as millions of investors are compelled to sell when they otherwise would not have.

 

[RandyForRubio]

Taxing unrealized capital gains is a horrendous idea, imho.

Not only could it hurt a lot of normal people who have retirement funds invested in the stock market, it has the potential to force people to sell stock to cover their tax burden which would very possibly cause a massive stock market crash as millions of investors are compelled to sell when they otherwise would not have.

Thank you!

 

[One Brow]

Taxing unrealized capital gains is a horrendous idea, imho.

Not only could it hurt a lot of normal people who have retirement funds invested in the stock market, it has the potential to force people to sell stock to cover their tax burden which would very possibly cause a massive stock market crash as millions of investors are compelled to sell when they otherwise would not have.

Retirement funds would likely be exempt, since taxes don't get paid on them until people retire. I agree that if they were not exempt, this would be a huge problem.

 

[Gameface]

Retirement funds would likely be exempt, since taxes don't get paid on them until people retire. I agree that if they were not exempt, this would be a huge problem.

What about the other thing where it could cause a massive selloff and crash the market?

 

[RandyForRubio]

What

What about the other thing where it could cause a massive selloff and crash the market?

Or taxing people on money they’ve never received. How many people are going to be able to stay in a system like that? Hint: it’s not the people that do not have a lot of disposable income.

 

[One Brow]

What about the other thing where it could cause a massive selloff and crash the market?

It's a lot less massive when the retirement funds are exempt. The people with surplus wealth will primarily be the people affected.

 

[Gameface]

It's a lot less massive when the retirement funds are exempt. The people with surplus wealth will primarily be the people affected.

I don't agree. I think it would have massive unintended consequences. I think it would start with people who legitimately had to sell to pay their taxes and would cascade into people selling to get ahead of the tank and would end in significant financial harm that would be far greater than any potential tax revenue benefit.

I think it is an extremely stupid idea based on some notion that everyone who wins in the stock market has stockpiles of real cash ready to pay these taxes no problem. I think many who invest in the stock market are deeply leveraged in stocks and they could only pay these taxes by dumping stocks that they wouldn't have otherwise. That will begin a massive sell off and cause significant economic harm that will hurt every single person in the world.

 

[Red]

New Donald Trump on SNL….

 

[Safetydan]

I don't agree. I think it would have massive unintended consequences. I think it would start with people who legitimately had to sell to pay their taxes and would cascade into people selling to get ahead of the tank and would end in significant financial harm that would be far greater than any potential tax revenue benefit.

I think it is an extremely stupid idea based on some notion that everyone who wins in the stock market has stockpiles of real cash ready to pay these taxes no problem. I think many who invest in the stock market are deeply leveraged in stocks and they could only pay these taxes by dumping stocks that they wouldn't have otherwise. That will begin a massive sell off and cause significant economic harm that will hurt every single person in the world.

I don't think an unrealized gains tax would hit anybody under a certain reasonable amount of net worth, overall.

Am I wrong on this? I thought it was called a billionaire tax for a reason.

Secondly,

You're saying that selloffs to pay taxes would lower stock valuations thus hurt "every single person in the world". I strongly disagree. I think you're overestimating the sell-off and you're overestimating the harm done to the vast majority of the people most at risk of real material harm (the poor).

The harm done, if any, are a burden of those who overwhelmingly own most of the assets that will marginally and temporarily lose their value. Who owns most of the stock? Poor people and immigrants? The tiny middle class? You and me don't own **** comparatively. And I don't know why I should care if the net worth of billionaires and millionaires drops. I don't know why I should care if my net worth drops a little bit if it means that others can have more. The tax gains actually have a real shot at improving the lives of those who actually need it. Obviously, the tax needs to be used effectively which is never guaranteed.

Of course, the unintended consequences of an action like this are going to be overblown. CNN will make it seem like the sky is falling. The goddamn stock market does not equal the material conditions of the human lives that live in this country and we only seem to care about one of those things.

If unrealized gains are a no-go, how would you tax Jeff Bezos who apparently only earns an annual 70,000 dollars in salary?

 

[Avery]

SNL hasn't been funny since the 90's IMO.

At least that guy has a good Trump voice, I'll give him that.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Is anyone following the Project Veritas and Ashley Biden diary story? The FBI has inadvertently confirmed what was previously believed a conspiracy theory hoax.

Some pages said to be from Ashley Biden’s diary were published on the internet immediately before the election. It included some stuff about being molested and “not appropriate” showering with her father, Joe Biden. It was believed to be a hoax intended to play into creepy Biden sniffing little girl’s hair.

The FBI raided the home of Project Veritas founder James O’Keefe to recover the diary and any information on how Project Veritas came to possess it. The diary is real. The FBI says the diary was stolen in a burglary.

 

[One Brow]

If true, that should certainly end his Presidency.

I've seen confirmation that a diary exists, but not that the one in the Project Veritas office was that diary. No doubt further developments await.