That's one reason to not have him. Additional picks and saving $10-$20 million are also reasons.
The Jazz are trading D-Will to New Jersey!?
- Thread starter YB85
- Start date
That's one reason to not have him. Additional picks and saving $10-$20 million are also reasons.
Have you not watch this team lately. The Jazz are 4-17 and 0-4 since Sloan has left. They traded their best player for two players who helped their team go 17-40. Unless the Jazz hit it big in the lottery and Favors turns out to the stud everyone things he can become then we could easily become part of the bottom-feeders in the NBA.
D
Deleted member 365
Guest
You might have a point about age.
But Harris is merely 1 year older than Deron. What is he, 28? I'm not so sure here in that 30-31 is that old. I know we shouldn't expect him to play like he's stockton until age 41. But I'm not so sure that these guys won't be in their primes here in a few years anyway. I'm not expecting much of a dropoff from our current core guys in the next few years.
Well the Jazz don't get to keep the pick if they make the playoffs so perhaps having two picks this year will help the team improve faster versus only having one first round pick. I know lower lottery picks are never that great but perhaps the Jazz find a solid bench player. Last time I looked our bench was pathetic.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
I thought Jimmer played for BYU;-)
D
Deleted member 365
Guest
I know of someone who should be available in the mid first round, who could play PG, can shoot the hell out of the ball, a fine player to come off the bench, and a fan favorite.... He also shouldn't have a problem with the race and the main religion here...
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
I think it is top-17 protected. There will be 3-4 teams in the East with worse records than the #8 seed in the West. So basically that means if the Jazz makes the playoffs, the pick is gone.
And thriller, don't kid yourself, this draft is fairly weak. Jimmer will be a lottery pick a la Hayward. I doubt he slips below #10.
jimmy eat jazz
Well-Known Member
I'm a little late to all of this but after having read everything I can about this trade here and elsewhere, here's my very tentative conclusion.
Miller and KOC panicked. There was no need to pull the trigger this early. For all the abuse he has suffered, I find myself in agreement with Borat. I would strongly have preferred the Jazz to have waited until the CBA was ironed out before taking such a drastic step. Although everything now thinks the odds of Deron staying were small, things can and do change. What happened with Crymellow and LeBron was not pre-destined to happen here. There's no telling what might have happened between now and 2012, and with the CBA in the mix, it remained a highly fluid situation, that might have resolved itself yet in the Jazz's favor. It also strikes me as far fetched that the Jazz could not still have gotten good value for Deron in 2012 if things did not work out. I find it hard to believe that there would not have been good offers on the table for one of the elite point guards in the league. The Jazz did not need to make this move at this time--there was time and there may well have been opportunity to make this work, and in the worst case most likely they could STILL have gotten good value in a trade.
With all that, I'm not so high on Favors. He strikes me as an unproven project. I'll take a bona fide superstar any day of the week over a project. Favors may turn out to be great, but I see the odds as likely that he doesn't. To me, the risk that Favors turns out to be the beast everyone hopes he is around as high that we lose D-Will. The draft choices don't excite me as much--once you get past the first few in the draft, you're largely into role players or quality starters, not superstars, and you DO NOT win in this league without superstars. It's worth, in my opinion, taking a risk to hold onto the superstar you do have than to dump him in a gamble on unknowns and potential superstars.
What galls me also is that I re-upped my season tickets the day before all this went down. It's worth money to me to pay to watch a team with a chance, albeit it an outside one, to advance deep in the playoffs, though admittedly this wasn't going to happen this year. But if you have a superstar to build around, then your odds are greater. Now, we are a collection of role players, projects, and scrubs. Houston Rockets, Milwaukee Bucks, Charlotte Bobcats, Indiana Pacers are now our max potential, while Sacramento, New Jersey, Toronto are an as likely outcome.
The odds of us getting another superstar of D-Will's caliber appear slim--we don't have a high enough draft pick and this is not a top free agent destination. I'm not optimistic, but hoping to be proven wrong. But in the end, Miller and KOC acted out of fear, dumped the one superstar we had or could have had, and in the process, I think, have doomed this club to bubble mediocrity with not even outside hope of deep playoff penetration.
Miller and KOC panicked. There was no need to pull the trigger this early. For all the abuse he has suffered, I find myself in agreement with Borat. I would strongly have preferred the Jazz to have waited until the CBA was ironed out before taking such a drastic step. Although everything now thinks the odds of Deron staying were small, things can and do change. What happened with Crymellow and LeBron was not pre-destined to happen here. There's no telling what might have happened between now and 2012, and with the CBA in the mix, it remained a highly fluid situation, that might have resolved itself yet in the Jazz's favor. It also strikes me as far fetched that the Jazz could not still have gotten good value for Deron in 2012 if things did not work out. I find it hard to believe that there would not have been good offers on the table for one of the elite point guards in the league. The Jazz did not need to make this move at this time--there was time and there may well have been opportunity to make this work, and in the worst case most likely they could STILL have gotten good value in a trade.
With all that, I'm not so high on Favors. He strikes me as an unproven project. I'll take a bona fide superstar any day of the week over a project. Favors may turn out to be great, but I see the odds as likely that he doesn't. To me, the risk that Favors turns out to be the beast everyone hopes he is around as high that we lose D-Will. The draft choices don't excite me as much--once you get past the first few in the draft, you're largely into role players or quality starters, not superstars, and you DO NOT win in this league without superstars. It's worth, in my opinion, taking a risk to hold onto the superstar you do have than to dump him in a gamble on unknowns and potential superstars.
What galls me also is that I re-upped my season tickets the day before all this went down. It's worth money to me to pay to watch a team with a chance, albeit it an outside one, to advance deep in the playoffs, though admittedly this wasn't going to happen this year. But if you have a superstar to build around, then your odds are greater. Now, we are a collection of role players, projects, and scrubs. Houston Rockets, Milwaukee Bucks, Charlotte Bobcats, Indiana Pacers are now our max potential, while Sacramento, New Jersey, Toronto are an as likely outcome.
The odds of us getting another superstar of D-Will's caliber appear slim--we don't have a high enough draft pick and this is not a top free agent destination. I'm not optimistic, but hoping to be proven wrong. But in the end, Miller and KOC acted out of fear, dumped the one superstar we had or could have had, and in the process, I think, have doomed this club to bubble mediocrity with not even outside hope of deep playoff penetration.
prodigy
Well-Known Member
Also the timing of D-Will becoming the bad guy in a lot of people's minds they saw the opportunity to deal him now so that jazz fans wouldn't go as crazy about trading a franchise player as they would before the sloan stuff. Instead a lot of people are saying good riddance to the villain. Which I don't like personally but that's the way it is.
Sneakers
Well-Known Member
Somethin about D-will just wasn't clicking with us anymore. It sucks because it feels like we pretty much grew up with him. But I mean after watching us these past few weeks... it wasn't working, Deron was stuck is pout mode and Utah was just rampant with speculation, anticipation and dread. So I at least can understand a little bit of where it came from.
Of course we're gonna suck now, but look, the last re-build took 3 years. The first probably had as much uncertainty as ever. The second year was filled with optimism cause of our new free-agents but just turned out to be a terrible, terrible year, and the third was more of an organic, "part of the process"
year.
I'm honestly not going to lie when I feel like we're still at least Status Quo of where we were pre-trade, only with an unknown in Favors and 2 extra lottery draft picks. So we'll see where it goes from here. I know we've all been conditioned to never count on the draft, but look how one player can turn everything around - CP3, Amare, D-will, the list goes on, and they aren't all even tip-top picks.
Basically, it comes down to draft moxy at this point. Maybe as the college game shakes out to the end of the year and KOC gets his eye on someone (as he did with D-will) he could parlay the Nets lottery pick (lets say #5), our probable lottery pick ( lets say #13) and like Millsap into a top-3 pick.
Of course we're gonna suck now, but look, the last re-build took 3 years. The first probably had as much uncertainty as ever. The second year was filled with optimism cause of our new free-agents but just turned out to be a terrible, terrible year, and the third was more of an organic, "part of the process"
year.
I'm honestly not going to lie when I feel like we're still at least Status Quo of where we were pre-trade, only with an unknown in Favors and 2 extra lottery draft picks. So we'll see where it goes from here. I know we've all been conditioned to never count on the draft, but look how one player can turn everything around - CP3, Amare, D-will, the list goes on, and they aren't all even tip-top picks.
Basically, it comes down to draft moxy at this point. Maybe as the college game shakes out to the end of the year and KOC gets his eye on someone (as he did with D-will) he could parlay the Nets lottery pick (lets say #5), our probable lottery pick ( lets say #13) and like Millsap into a top-3 pick.
asian_roger
Well-Known Member
hmm...
I think the Jazz management couldn't handle being taken over by Deron. In fact, everything they had to do is to keep D-Will happy. But does that necessary make the Jazz better? Lets face it, I liked Brewer but outside shooting really stank. Jazz also have to find a way to get rid of Miles...no way can let him ever go if Williams was here. D-will kept on moaning and complaining about the lack of talent around him....blah blah especially when he couldn't step up his own game.
I think the Jazz management couldn't handle being taken over by Deron. In fact, everything they had to do is to keep D-Will happy. But does that necessary make the Jazz better? Lets face it, I liked Brewer but outside shooting really stank. Jazz also have to find a way to get rid of Miles...no way can let him ever go if Williams was here. D-will kept on moaning and complaining about the lack of talent around him....blah blah especially when he couldn't step up his own game.