The Jazz, David Lee, and Golden State

[green]

There was a rumor that David Lee would be coming to Utah. Many of us wondered why would Utah take on his contract. I wondered out loud if Barnes would be a part of that deal.

Well, I read this tonight from Zach Lowe:

"But their cap sheet is structured so that every time someone is due a raise, another big deal comes off the books. The Dubs can max out Green this summer, re-sign Stephen Curry to a $30 million mega-max deal in two years, and — if they play their cards right — still have enough money to nab a big free agent at some point during that process. It may cost them Harrison Barnes, but that’s a trade-off the Warriors will make if they have to."

https://grantland.com/the-triangle/winners-and-losers-in-the-nba-playoffs/

Boom. There you go. If GS wants to clear cap room, this is a way to do sign Green, and clear room right now:

Utah trades Burke and their pick to GS for David Lee and Harrison Barnes. Why does GS do this? Two reasons:

1 - They are going to lose Barnes this year or next year. They can't keep him. He will be too expensive, and Lowe illustrates this above.

2 - This move can get them down to 60 million, 7 million under the cap. They can then add some vets to help them win another title. Plus they add a draft pick. Plus Livingston has been terrible for them. Burke may be an upgrade for GS.

Why does Utah do this? They do take on Lee for a year, but they clear 15 million the summer of 2016. They get a year or two trial run on Barnes, who is a valuable player. Better than anyone they can get on the market. This also doesn't affect Exum's development. Utah would still need another vet PG, but would have added a big and a potential very, very good player.

After this trade, GS would have a lottery pick and a cap number of 60 million.

I'd do this if I were Utah. Look at this team:

Exum/vet PG/Cotton
Hayward/Burks
Barnes/Hood
Favors/Booker/Lee
Gobert/Favors

That team makes the playoffs. I really, really like that team.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Barnes is meh... Lee is poop and if anyone is giving a pick in that deal it is GS.

 

[stitches]

Barnes is meh... Lee is poop and if anyone is giving a pick in that deal it is GS.

I like Barnes, but Lee is on a huge contract(i.e. we are doing them a favor by taking it) and if we are sending Burke their way we would need to be getting a pick indeed, rather than giving up one.

 

[green]

Barnes is meh... Lee is poop and if anyone is giving a pick in that deal it is GS.

Serious? You're joking, right?

Barnes shoots 48%, 40% from three, PER of 13, good defender, etc. Odds are you aren't going to get that with the 12th pick. Plus, can Utah get a fourth big as good as Lee in FA? Probably not. People were all banana standing over Tomic, but down on Lee? At least we know Lee can be a backup in the NBA. Best realistic case scenario for Tomic is a Lee-level player.

I'd do this trade. In.A.Heart.Beat.

Young player that fits in to start and age wise and can grow with the team? Check.
Could that young player get to All Star level? Yes.
Is he affordable? Yes.
Does he allow the other young guys to develop? Yes.
Can he play multiple positions? Yes.
Can he stretch the floor? Yes. He would instantly become our best three point shooter.
Does this hurt your cap future? No.

There is no downside to this trade. Not one. Do it.

 

[green]

I'd add, that if I were Utah and I wanted to keep an asset (the pick or Burke), I'd keep Burke. If GS said they would take the pick for Lee and Barnes, I'm skipping to the bank.

 

[Hedda Gambler]

There is no way to make this trade legal before the draft as we don`t have anything close to the salary required to match the incoming ones.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

I'd add, that if I were Utah and I wanted to keep an asset (the pick or Burke), I'd keep Burke. If GS said they would take the pick for Lee and Barnes, I'm skipping to the bank.

Ur brain dead!!!

 

[green]

Don't be a ****ing idiot u noob freaking moran!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I want no god damned fuching ******** part of those Moran idiot players and give a freaking pick as well!!! U must be damned brain dead. That's the dumbest trade!!!!! Ever!!!!!!!

lol. This is classic. So you'd keep a #12 pick over Barnes? You do realize that when you draft at #12, you are hoping that your pick is half the player Barnes is. But, you value that pick more?

Ever heard of the phrase, "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"?

Barnes would be our best three point shooter. He can be our stretch 4. He can start at SF, push Hayward to the SG spot. He works great in this offense. Barnes is everything we hope Hood can become. He would be our wet dream if we picked him at 12.

Yet you value the pick over a known quantity?

Uhhhh. Ok.

I bet you were against trading Kanter for Harden as well. lol. That turned out well.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Serious? You're joking, right?

Barnes shoots 48%, 40% from three, PER of 13, good defender, etc. Odds are you aren't going to get that with the 12th pick. Plus, can Utah get a fourth big as good as Lee in FA? Probably not. People were all banana standing over Tomic, but down on Lee? At least we know Lee can be a backup in the NBA. Best realistic case scenario for Tomic is a Lee-level player.

I'd do this trade. In.A.Heart.Beat.

Young player that fits in to start and age wise and can grow with the team? Check.
Could that young player get to All Star level? Yes.
Is he affordable? Yes.
Does he allow the other young guys to develop? Yes.
Can he play multiple positions? Yes.
Can he stretch the floor? Yes. He would instantly become our best three point shooter.
Does this hurt your cap future? No.

There is no downside to this trade. Not one. Do it.

You know 15 is average PER right? 13 seems about meh to me. Barnes is okay i just don't see why we'd overpay for him. Either we give the pick for him or we take on lees ****ty contract and Barnes is the sweetener. Barnes plays on a team where he is getting wide open looks because Steph and Klay get a ton of attention. Decent defender but not great. He is only cheap for one more year and hits free agency as the cap skyrockets... So someone will overpay for him so it does kind of screw with our cap. I'd rather have hood or burks start... I think both guys are better players than him.

Lee is so terrible on defense... Kanteresque even. If we took him on we have no other meaningful FA dollars. Tomic would have been relatively cheap.

Then we add the pick... These picks are super valuable because if you get a contributor they are incredibly cheap... These picks are even more valuable with the rising cap. It is a big overpay IMO. If we really like Lee and Barnes we can get them much cheaper.

 

[green]

There is no way to make this trade legal before the draft as we don`t have anything close to the salary required to match the incoming ones.

Why would we have to match salary? This trade would put our salary up to 67 million, just under the cap. I could be wrong, and if I am there are very easy ways to work around this, such as make the trade 1 week later and pick for GS. That being said, this trade makes sense and would explain why there were rumors of Lee coming to Utah.

 

[stitches]

I'd add, that if I were Utah and I wanted to keep an asset (the pick or Burke), I'd keep Burke. If GS said they would take the pick for Lee and Barnes, I'm skipping to the bank.

The point is that you should keep BOTH the pick and Burke in such a trade. The price for taking Lee's contract is Barnes(and Lowe suggests it). If you send Burke their way he would have some marginal cost, too... thus them having to add a pick.

 

[ONE LOVE]

Barnes?


No.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

lol. This is classic. So you'd keep a #12 pick over Barnes? You do realize that when you draft at #12, you are hoping that your pick is half the player Barnes is. But, you value that pick more?

Ever heard of the phrase, "a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"?

Barnes would be our best three point shooter. He can be our stretch 4. He can start at SF, push Hayward to the SG spot. He works great in this offense. Barnes is everything we hope Hood can become. He would be our wet dream if we picked him at 12.

Yet you value the pick over a known quantity?

Uhhhh. Ok.

I bet you were against trading Kanter for Harden as well. lol. That turned out well.

Have you ever watched Barnes or are you still going off his HS hype?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Why would we have to match salary? This trade would put our salary up to 67 million, just under the cap. I could be wrong, and if I am there are very easy ways to work around this, such as make the trade 1 week later and pick for GS. That being said, this trade makes sense and would explain why there were rumors of Lee coming to Utah.

Timing... Can't be done before July 1st because that is when our cap space opens... Draft is late June.

 

[Stifle Tower]

Giving up THREE significant assets in the #12 pick, Burke AND our cap space in order to shore up our deepest position with Barnes and get a 1yr rental in Lee? Seriously is Harrison an all-star worth all that? Hood can be every bit the shooter. If we want to spend money on another wing why not just get Danny Green? Look at his regular season shooting percentage. AND we'd still have the #12 to get a young big, Burke to be a backup or future piece.

Btw, if you've used up all our cap space by taking on Lee how do you sign a veteran PG? Maybe JL III would be available for the vet minimum

 

[green]

You know 15 is average PER right? 13 seems about meh to me. Barnes is okay i just don't see why we'd overpay for him. Either we give the pick for him or we take on lees ****ty contract and Barnes is the sweetener. Barnes plays on a team where he is getting wide open looks because Steph and Klay get a ton of attention. Decent defender but not great. He is only cheap for one more year and hits free agency as the cap skyrockets... So someone will overpay for him so it does kind of screw with our cap. I'd rather have hood or burks start... I think both guys are better players than him.

Lee is so terrible on defense... Kanteresque even. If we took him on we have no other meaningful FA dollars. Tomic would have been relatively cheap.

Then we add the pick... These picks are super valuable because if you get a contributor they are incredibly cheap... These picks are even more valuable with the rising cap. It is a big overpay IMO. If we really like Lee and Barnes we can get them much cheaper.

Lee is an afterthought. Lee only plays if Favors or Gobert gets hurt. What other big would sign with us this year? Tomic would not have been cheap. To get him over here, we would have to offer 6-7 million per year just to match what he is getting paid over there. To really get him out here, we are talking 8 per year for three years. Lee is 15 for one year. Lee is a known quantity. Tomic is not.

Picks are way over-rated. Big time. Saric, Adams, Lamb, Burks, Henry, Henderson, Jason Thompson, Young, Hilton Armstrong, Korolev, Swift, Collision, Ely, Radmonivic, Etan Thomas.

Those are your #12 picks this century. Name me one of those guys you would pick over Barnes.

If you can get Barnes for the #12, even if it means eating money for only one year, you do it. Especially when you have Favors and Gobert, and they need outside shooters.

Name me one player the Jazz can pick up for 4 million this offseason who shoots 40% from three. Then name me one player the Jazz can get for 4 million in FA who can play the PF spot and shoot 40% from three.

Any smart person does this deal. Barnes and Lee for Burke and the pick.

No brainer.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I've just never watched Barnes and thought... If we had that guy we'd be great. It's more like... Is Harrison Barnes even playing tonight?

 

[green]

Giving up THREE significant assets in the #12 pick, Burke AND our cap space in order to shore up our deepest position with Barnes and get a 1yr rental in Lee? Seriously is Harrison an all-star worth all that? Hood can be every bit the shooter. If we want to spend money on another wing why not just get Danny Green? Look at his regular season shooting percentage. AND we'd still have the #12 to get a young big, Burke to be a backup or future piece.

Btw, if you've used up all our cap space by taking on Lee how do you sign a veteran PG? Maybe JL III would be available for the vet minimum ��

Exception to be used for the PG.

 

[green]

The point is that you should keep BOTH the pick and Burke in such a trade. The price for taking Lee's contract is Barnes(and Lowe suggests it). If you send Burke their way he would have some marginal cost, too... thus them having to add a pick.

That's fine. GS sends back a future protected pick.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

I feel like we've helped those guys enough. Granted, that team falls apart the minute either Curry or Bogut get hurt.

The GS'17 pick is unprotected. Jazz aren't giving it back. They'd be owed more if they're going to absorb Lee.

The question the Jazz have to ask themselves: do they want to pay Barnes in a year?