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Trade deadline discussion

I feel bad that I want to see Clarkson get traded because I really like the guy. He became a Jazz man real quick when he got here, and had a big impact last year. He has obviously slipped...yeah, a lot. But it will still be hard to see him go. I really wish he had gone the other way this year and been more impactful for us. But now I want to see him go and bring back someone who can actually help us.
 
One guy I always liked who is rotting in the G-League is Zach Collins. He's a good defender and can shoot the three. You'd think some NBA team would have him on their roster.
 
jom2003 said:
Bogey isn't shooting at the same percentage as Barnes... One is at 38.5% on 6.5 attempt and one is 40.4% on 5 attempts, almost a 2% gap. And Barnes's now been shooting 38% or above from deep for 4 straight seasons and 6 times across his 10 year career, so it's not like this is some kind of outlying performance from him.

And like I said, ones being overused and ones being underused. Getting your shot isn't necessarily an indicator for being a good shooter. It has everything to do with your teammates and coaches.

We happen to have one of the leagues best screen setters in Rudy and top 10 PG in Conley so of course shooters will find it easier to get open looks. Especially for a guy who's been struggling with the ball in his hand all season like Bogey, he's already getting more shots than he normally would had he played on a team like the Kings where they just let Fox ball hogging with no regards to teammates whatsoever.

No reason Barnes can't get 6-7 shots from deep per game if we can get him on the Jazz. And keep in mind even without teammates creating for him, he can also create on his own more consistently without turning the ball over.
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One shooting 1.5% worse than the other but shooting 30% more attempts... if Barnes attempts go up they will likely be of slightly worse shot quality and his percentage will go down. Getting attempts up is actually a great indicator that you don't need as much space or have a quicker release or higher release or some other factor. Maybe the guy is just more judicious... that is fine but volume ****ing matters and I'm sure Kings coaches and players know Barnes can shoot and would love to get him more shots. It isn't just a lever you pull.

Its a mild upgrade and the cost is significant.
 
kabenac said:
One guy I always liked who is rotting in the G-League is Zach Collins. He's a good defender and can shoot the three. You'd think some NBA team would have him on their roster.
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He's on San Antonio's roster. He's perpetually hurt and likely working his way back from injury.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
One shooting 1.5% worse than the other but shooting 30% more attempts... if Barnes attempts go up they will likely be of slightly worse shot quality and his percentage will go down. Getting attempts up is actually a great indicator that you don't need as much space or have a quicker release or higher release or some other factor. Maybe the guy is just more judicious... that is fine but volume ****ing matters and I'm sure Kings coaches and players know Barnes can shoot and would love to get him more shots. It isn't just a lever you pull.

Its a mild upgrade and the cost is significant.
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you are overthinking it. barnes doesn't get as many shots up because...well, he doesn't get as many touches.

Bogey's 23.4% usage is 4% above Barnes and 4th highest on the entire Sacramento roster. If you watch Kings game you see Barnes can come on the floor then do cardio for 5 straight possessions without getting any touches on the ball. How are you supposed to get your shots off when you aren't even touching the basketball. That's why I called Barnes your ultimate low usg% player. Hard to find another player who can get you 16points a game with a usage lower than Tristian Thompson.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
One shooting 1.5% worse than the other but shooting 30% more attempts... if Barnes attempts go up they will likely be of slightly worse shot quality and his percentage will go down. Getting attempts up is actually a great indicator that you don't need as much space or have a quicker release or higher release or some other factor. Maybe the guy is just more judicious... that is fine but volume ****ing matters and I'm sure Kings coaches and players know Barnes can shoot and would love to get him more shots. It isn't just a lever you pull.

Its a mild upgrade and the cost is significant.
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even if you put Barnes shooting a slight downgrade to Bogey, he's a major upgrade in all other areas of the game. You can trust him in the clutch, handle the ball without turning it over, rebound at a respectable rate and not to be a huge defensive hole easily exploited by other teams.
 
jom2003 said:
you are overthinking it. barnes doesn't get as many shots up because...well, he doesn't get as many touches.

Bogey's 23.4% usage is 4% above Barnes and 4th highest on the entire Sacramento roster. If you watch Kings game you see Barnes can come on the floor then do cardio for 5 straight possessions without getting any touches on the ball. How are you supposed to get your shots off when you aren't even touching the basketball. That's why I called Barnes your ultimate low usg% player. Hard to find another player who can get you 16points a game with a usage lower than Tristian Thompson.
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https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm...r_id1=barneha02&p2yrfrom=2022&sum=0&request=1

They are so similar... just check out the head to head comparison there. The one year Barnes played with a good rebounding center his rebound numbers were even similar. If Barnes raises his usage his turnovers will also come up.

Over their careers Bogey is 1.3% higher on 3 point shooting on MUCH higher volume and 3% higher on 2 point shooting. Go ahead and state whatever reason you think it is that Barnes shoots like 50% less threes than Bogey as volume goes up percentages go down... its just ****ing science.

I think maybe you are under thinking it.
 
LogGrad98 said:
I feel bad that I want to see Clarkson get traded because I really like the guy. He became a Jazz man real quick when he got here, and had a big impact last year. He has obviously slipped...yeah, a lot. But it will still be hard to see him go. I really wish he had gone the other way this year and been more impactful for us. But now I want to see him go and bring back someone who can actually help us.
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Hey this proves I have feelings about other people, so I am not a sociopath!! Suck on that court-ordered therapist!!
 
jom2003 said:
even if you put Barnes shooting a slight downgrade to Bogey, he's a major upgrade in all other areas of the game. You can trust him in the clutch, handle the ball without turning it over, rebound at a respectable rate and not to be a huge defensive hole easily exploited by other teams.
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He's not a major upgrade in any of those areas. I honestly think if both guys were white or both guys were black no one would argue this. His turnovers are slightly lower and assists minimally higher and you yourself said he is a lower usage guy... do you think turnovers go up or down with more usage.

All of the defensive stuff is based on nothing... the "clutch" stuff is based on a few shots he has hit for a ****** go nowhere franchise... half their games are garbage time. His clutch shooting this year is in the low 30s on 2s and 3s and bogey is basically 50/40. Last year Bogey struggle but Barnes didn't light the world on fire. Both guys have some nice game winners... So does Furkan Korkmaz but it doesn't make him "clutch"

They are damn near the spider man meme.
 
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