Trade Idea
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I've heard such ignorant and incorrect arguments before. I suggest you study the cultures and history of the Middle East and India and see how they view women. So to state the obvious truth is not bigoted at all. Stone wives to death who commit adultery. Not allow single women to go out alone unless accompanied by a male family member. Treat male children much better than female children. Need I go on. The Arab chiefs had huge harems of women who were actually sexual slaves. Learn your history.
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There is nothing wrong with it. I didn't realize using rape in such a context was offensive. Forcing someone to have sex is not the only meaning of the word. Look it up. People are putting their own interpretations and personal sentiments on the word but my meaning had nothing to do with sex. I meant it was taking an egregious unfair advantage. I was not thinking of sex, at all.
latin jazz
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You do like to double down uh? I've spent substantial time in all the countries you mentioned due to work and holidays. And I'm aware to some of the struggles women face. But to talk about "all those nations in that region" when referring to Turkey, Bangladesh, India, the Arab countries, the Middle East, is just pure bigotry and ignorance on your part. Like they all are the same. Maybe it's time you practice some political correctness...
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I don't believe you understand the full nature of my comment because it was directed towards an individual who I believe is a woman masquerading as someone from the MIddle East. Pure ignorance? The histories and customs of these nations belies this. Maybe I shouldn't paint such a broad brush but women in this region of the world have been more suppressed than other places, and that's a fact.
I struggle to understand your position often, but it looks like you're suggesting that the only people that would be offended at making light of rape is if:
-they are a woman (from Bangladesh or Turkey? IDK)
-they are being disingenuous.
If I (and most people here, apparently) are not understanding, it's on you to do a better job at communicating.
Or you could just... stop?
latin jazz
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What nations? What regions? Is Turkey the same as Bangladesh? What about Saudi Arabia? Is it the same region as Iran?. I wonder how a farsi speaking person would react to your comments. You are missing the point of treating very different countries as one, even if they have commonalities.
You have made lots of offensive comments in this thread. But I guess you feel entitled to it because you are "stating the obvious", "the facts" and "freedom of speech" with no concerns about how others might react. As @cowhide pointed out, it takes just a little effort to think how words can impact others.
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Who said I was making light of raping women. That's your interpretation not mine. Stop projecting your thoughts on mine.
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I could care less what you think. You're a disingenuous idiot who is ignorant of the history of those nations.
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Who are you talking to and why are you like this?
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I'm just being honest, and I'm the one being attacked by you and others. I simply made a statement and you don't like a word I used to describe the situation because it offends women. Well, you know men are raped too. But I put no sexual connotation on the word and you and others who are attacking me have.
I would like to move on from this as soon as anybody else, but I just wanted to point out that:
On a personal note; I know we have had conflicts and whether you know it or not, I make a conscious effort to not be the mean-spirited person I have been in the past (though I fail more than I would like). But this isn't about me, and it's not even about you necessarily either. Let's try to be better people whenever we have an opportunity to.
This is exactly the problem. You weren't thinking. You didn't know it was offensive. That's not the worst thing! My goal is not to rake you over the coals. It isn't anyone's. People have taken great care in communicating with you about this. The trick with learning the little things you can do to make the world slightly more hospitable for others is to not see attempts at well-meaning correction as an attack on you. I think I speak for the others that have spoken when I say we just think it's better to not use that term to describe something so unserious as a basketball trade.
On a personal note; I know we have had conflicts and whether you know it or not, I make a conscious effort to not be the mean-spirited person I have been in the past (though I fail more than I would like). But this isn't about me, and it's not even about you necessarily either. Let's try to be better people whenever we have an opportunity to.
latin jazz
Well-Known Member
Also, on the same note as Numberica and to leave this discussion behind, I think it's worth taking the time to break some stereotypes. Gender-based violence or the diminished role of women in society is not only a "those nations" thing. For those interested, there are several sources and studies at the World Bank, WHO, UN Women, ECLAC, the European Comission, and several NGOs, which can enlight us on the subject. Most statistics and studies show gender-based violence, femicide rates and intimate partner violence is a global problem but some of the worst numbers can be seen in Latin America (with worst offenders being Brazil, Mexico, Honduras, El Salvador, Peru, etc). And none of those were included in the "those nations" list, which obviously - and unfortunately- had a muslim bias.
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If the word is so offensive, then maybe we should ban it from the English language. I don't see the profanity filter x-ing it out.
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Do they have a history of killing women who commit adultery? And in those situations, the men involved in the act are not at all punished. It is the Muslim culture that has been more oppressive to women than any other. Sure, the Catholic Church was also very oppressive and burned thousands of women at the stake for "witchcraft" during the Middle Ages. But Arab culture tops it in its general attitude. I have a friend from India and the women there have traditionally been second-class citizens. This is historical tradition. Yes, in the modern word things are changing but culture changes slowly. Look at the South today despite all the Civil Rights reforms and agitations, still very racist. I don't believe in political correctness. I think it's disingenuous and patronizing. It's just not honest and I try to be.
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That's all I have to say and we have gone way off topic. It's ridiculous. I did not want to engage in this conversation but I feel I have been unfairly attacked simply for using a word that some people are offended by. Did I say I think raping a person is a good thing. Am I trivializing raping a person? That's your interpretation. People have used that word like this as long as I have been alive and it had no sexual connotation whatsoever.
latin jazz
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To answer your question. Yes. Woman are killed for less than adultery in Latin America. And yes, the men involved oftentimes go unpunished. A strong macho culture and impunity permeates society. The worsening of the problem led to massive demostrations in several countries, called "Ni una Menos". I'm surprised you don't know about this problem in Latin America.
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