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trade partners made in heaven: Utah and Detroit

NAOS said:
do you think Jennings is better than Trey, in general?
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Yes, but I am not sure that will be the case in several years time. I think Trey can be a very good second option for us, if, of course, he is willing to play that role.

NAOS said:
do you think Jennings is better than Trey in Q's system? (recognizing, of course, that it is less position-focused than other systems)
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I think neither is ideal, since both seem to be ball-dominant and Trey's instinct is to pound the ball and look for his shot. But Trey have flashed some great facilitator moments this season. I think he's better(more willing) facilitator in the pick and roll. On the other hand Jennings is probably the faster playing PG, which would probably help with pace. Jennings' shot selection is about as horrific as you can get in the league right now, but he also drives and draws more fouls. In general I'd say it's very close as to who's the better fit.

NAOS said:
Your post is seems to imply that any deal for Jennings would be a bad one. There are, of course, bad scenarios. Are there good ones, too?
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I wouldn't say any deal would be bad, but in general at our current level of rebuild I don't see why we should go for it. Unless we are desperate to improve by 2-3-4 wins this season(which of course would harm our draft position as well) I really don't see much sense in giving up assets(first round picks) to get him. We have to keep in mind exactly what kind of player he is and what his ceiling is(whatever player he is right now is about his ceiling). I think he's a bottom 5 starting PG in the league.

In general I see him as a liability in our current situation - he's good enough to harm our draft positions next year, but not good enough to start for us in the long-term, also he's not likely to improve much. He also comes with a 8 million dollar tag, which for a long-term bench player(if we assume Exum will be our first option) is very very steep price. We are in a small market that can't really afford to pay a long-term backup PG 10-12% of our salary cap... His contract expires in 2 years so I guess that can be looked as a positive(we don't have to get tied with his contract for too long)... but see... this is exactly what I am talking about - every time I start talking about contracts with the feeling and sentiment that they are burdens, I worry. Every time I start looking at the length of the contract and feel relieved when I see it's short, I can't help but think that this is a liability contract that we should never give up assets for. If anything we should be getting some asset back(say second-rounder).

I don't know if I answered your question. In general I'd see a trade for Jennings as good, if we get some value long-term(or asset wise) in return, or if we shed off some of our own liabilities(we don't have any really right now - if Burks doesn't pan out he's as close of a liability as we have).
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Wait Burke is Mateen Cleaves and Jennings is a potential stud? Jennings is 25... at this point he is who he is. People can cite Monta, but he plays with one of the 5 or 10 best players in the league and has a great head coach. Monta is the exception... not the rule. Monta also showed more potential early than Jennings ever did.

When looking at trade assets you have to factor in contract. Trey Burke will make $8 M over the next three years... Jennings is making over $16 M during the next two years. For two players who are statistically similar (although different players), that's a big difference.

After watching Jennings dribble the air out of the ball for 5 or 10 games you'd likely change your mind about trading for the guy.
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He has to dribble the air out of the ball in Detroit. Who else is going to make plays? Andre Drummond? Josh Smith? Greg Monroe (way too crowded in the paint for post options). Jennings gets to the FT line, that alone puts him light years ahead of Burke offensively.

https://stats.nba.com/player/#!/201943/tracking/shots/

Brandon Jennings is a 48% spot-up 3pt shooter this year on 1.9 attempts per game.

In comparison, Trey Burke is a 33% spot-up 3pt shooter this year on 3.7 attempts per game.


Could Jennings flourish in a system that takes the ball out of his hands a bit more and creates spot-up opportunities?
 
freakazoid said:
Is this a real question?
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Rebuilding implies you're tearing the car down to frame and starting over. Adding Bogut is more like making over kitchen
With Italian granite countertops and Belgian altitude wood cabinets. So yes it is a real ****ing question. You comparing a Jennings requisition to a Bogut requisition is ****ing retarded.
 
Honestly, take a peep at Detroit's roster. It's a complete dumpster fire team and the fact that Jennings has even managed to put up slightly efficient stats is pretty impressive.

0 playmakers on the team other than him and hardly any shooting. Would Burke even crack shooting 30% on this team?
 
Cy said:
He has to dribble the air out of the ball in Detroit. Who else is going to make plays? Andre Drummond? Josh Smith? Greg Monroe (way too crowded in the paint for post options). Jennings gets to the FT line, that alone puts him light years ahead of Burke offensively.

https://stats.nba.com/player/#!/201943/tracking/shots/

Brandon Jennings is a 48% spot-up 3pt shooter this year on 1.9 attempts per game.

In comparison, Trey Burke is a 33% spot-up 3pt shooter this year on 3.7 attempts per game.


Could Jennings flourish in a system that takes the ball out of his hands a bit more and creates spot-up opportunities?
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Trey has been off this year to start and Jennings has been hot. Jennings second year he shot 39% overall and 32% from 3.... which is a hair better than Trey has shot this year.

He does go to the line which is good, but he has always dribbled the air out of the ball regardless of teammates.

If we are going to trade Trey and a first rounder (protected) with some cap fodder... we could do better than BJ. If we sent them expirings and a handful of 2nds they'd jump all over it.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Trey has been off this year to start and Jennings has been hot. Jennings second year he shot 39% overall and 32% from 3.... which is a hair better than Trey has shot this year.

He does go to the line which is good, but he has always dribbled the air out of the ball regardless of teammates.

If we are going to trade Trey and a first rounder (protected) with some cap fodder... we could do better than BJ. If we sent them expirings and a handful of 2nds they'd jump all over it.
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What else could we get for Burke and a lottery protected pick? I'm interested to hear this.
 
Cy said:
I just feel like Jennigns is one of those players that if he finds the right team, he will really flourish.
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You might be right, but I just don't see it. He makes bad decision, his shot selection is very poor, he seems like a really selfish player to me.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YavMt-uJgw

Could Burke ever do this against Wall?

Has Burke ever won a PG matchup vs. a top-10 PG?
 
I am so sick of huge boob size. His brand of trolling sucks. He ruins threads on the reg.
 
Here's an analysis of the Brandon for Brandon trade:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9oy0Abg2To
 
Here's his free agency video with some advanced stat analysis:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnHndbNPYi0
 
Cy said:
Nice, use stats from a few years ago to make a point.
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it's more about patterns and faults of his play than the actual stats, although, I have to admit I don't have access to synergy stats for his more recent play so this indeed could be misleading video with outdated tendencies, if he's actually improved on any of the things mentioned in the video.
 
Cy said:
What else could we get for Burke and a lottery protected pick? I'm interested to hear this.
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I think it would put us in range to get Ryan Anderson. I don't think either is a great trade partner straight across, but in a 3-way it could get done. Something like this: https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/6529373

Also, its not a matter of what we could get right now... what value could we get during the draft if we packaged our pick and Trey. Would someone give us a 1st rounder for Trey right now? I don't think it is inconceivable.

Trey is better than he has shown this year and he is dirt cheap. If we move him it should be for a clear upgrade and BJ isn't that.
 
Detroit is a perfect trade partner for just about everyone. Pretty crazy.
 
Cy said:
Nice, use stats from a few years ago to make a point.
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Better than using a 15 game sample size to say a player is efficient. Let's revisit BJ's numbers when the season is over... if he is still shooting the ball this well then I'll say he's a clear upgrade.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Better than using a 15 game sample size to say a player is efficient. Let's revisit BJ's numbers when the season is over... if he is still shooting the ball this well then I'll say he's a clear upgrade.
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I was just saying he has been efficient in opportunities that would increase in Utah
 
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