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Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz

NBASupes said:
He's getting 37 million. That's a lot of money and he's 31 years old with limited offensive value. If you really had to compare him to someone of the past, I think we would all agree, it would be Dikembe Mutombo. Look what Atlanta got for him from Philadelphia?

I disagreed. He got played off the floor. He just wasnt that effective in either of those series for a max cat. I didn't get that vibe from Mitchell who has elevated his game in the playoffs for most of his career.
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We slowed the Mavericks offense down though and our offense led by Don shooting like 30% is the reason we lost, lol.
 
SteakNEggs said:
Gobert didn't allow 32 ppg to a decent player that averages 19 in the other two series. That was the difference in this series... Not Gobert
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I wouldn't write off Brunson as just a decent player. He's definitely up and coming for emerging talent. It wasn't Gobert who allowed that but that's what he's supposed to limit with the scheme Utah plays with his aggressive running guys off the 3pt line into the mid-range region or around the basket for Gobert to clean up.
YoungJefe said:
We slowed the Mavericks offense down though and our offense led by Don shooting like 30% is the reason we lost, lol.
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Slowed down??? Dom played horribly in that series but we have too many series that are showcases for Donovan.
 
NBASupes said:
Slowed down??? Dom played horribly in that series but we have too many series that are showcases for Donovan.
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Against the Mavericks we held them to 104 ppg for the series and they really only had two good offensive games against us. In the other 4 games we held them to 93, 99, 102, and 98.

If we're holding them to 102/98, as the team with the #1 offense in the NBA, we have to win those games.

Don was terrible in the series so our offense tanked and we lost.
 
NBASupes said:
I didn't get that vibe from Mitchell who has elevated his game in the playoffs for most of his career.
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Don’t know what to tell you then. You obviously didn’t watch as closely as you thought you did. Mitchell was like a bull fighter on defense, and his defense has gotten worse every year as far as giving effort on that side to the tune of Harden (rockets years). If yo rewatch the series, you’ll see that just about every time Gobert looked bad was because he had to help, and there was no team defensive rotations. The real problem was shot making and hero ball and not utilizing Gobert on offense.
 
YoungJefe said:
Yes I did watch both series. Against the Mavericks we held them to 104 ppg for the series and they really only had two good offensive games against us. In the other 4 games we held them to 93, 99, 102, and 98. Our offenses inability to get anything going was the reason we lost that series. There isn't a single defensive player in NBA history that can protect everyone on the court in playoff basketball. Marcus Smart was just DPOY and got absolutely destroyed in the finals by Curry, lol.

Please don't ever compare Gobert to Clint. And even last year Trae was not efficient, he's a chucker in the playoffs that can easily be taken out of a game. Dude's a career 40% shooter in the postseason. So based on your logic Trae is worth about Coby White and a 1st.
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Dallas scored anytime they needed a basket, saying you held them to 104 while you scored only in the 90s is nothing to brag about. It shows that even if Gobert has a positive impact in his struggles, his lack of offense for someone making 37 million is highly noted. Marcus Smart did an excellent job when matched up on Curry compared to the others who are similar to Rudy but Marcus is making 16 million and 19 million per compared to Rudy's 37 million and 44 million per.

I didn't compare them but if I did, Gobert to me, a top 15 player. Most NBA guys agree. https://theathletic.com/2762726/202...tier-2-superstars-just-short-of-the-very-top/
Capela is a top 60 player. Most NBA guys see him as a top 60 guy. https://theathletic.com/2753332/202...heck-in-at-tier-4-alongside-40-other-players/

Trae had a 46/38/90 with a per of 25.4 and 60 ts is not efficient? Man, you starting to disappoint me with a lack of Basketball Intellect. This isn't a good look for Jazz fans with your misrepresentation of them. Leave it to the quality posters to talk about hoops with me. You might not be on that level yet.

I see Capela as about 90% of the player Rudy is but he's not worth 50% less in contract than Rudy and he's making 18 million. Rudy is making 38 million next year. Yeah, Rudy for what he is and that contact might be a mismatch. I see it like John Collins. Impact-wise, JC is worth 25 million but reality-wise, he probably should get a max of 20 mil per. Rudy should probably be getting like 25 million at this age. 30 million is a value overpay and what he's getting is a massive overpay value-wise.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
Don’t know what to tell you then. You obviously didn’t watch as closely as you thought you did. Mitchell was like a bull fighter on defense, and his defense has gotten worse every year as far as giving effort on that side to the tune of Harden (rockets years). If yo rewatch the series, you’ll see that just about every time Gobert looked bad was because he had to help, and there was no team defensive rotations. The real problem was shot making and hero ball and not utilizing Gobert on offense.
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So you believe Mitchell has been a defensive sieve every playoff series he's played since he's been on the Jazz?
 
NBASupes said:
Dallas scored anytime they needed a basket, saying you held them to 104 while you scored only in the 90s is nothing to brag about. It shows that even if Gobert has a positive impact in his struggles, his lack of offense for someone making 37 million is highly noted. Marcus Smart did an excellent job when matched up on Curry compared to the others who are similar to Rudy but Marcus is making 16 million and 19 million per compared to Rudy's 37 million and 44 million per.

I see Capela as about 90% of the player Rudy is but he's not worth 50% less in contract than Rudy and he's making 18 million. Rudy is making 38 million next year. Yeah, Rudy for what he is and that contact might be a mismatch. I see it like John Collins. Impact-wise, JC is worth 25 million but reality-wise, he probably should get a max of 20 mil per. Rudy should probably be getting like 25 million at this age. 30 million is a value overpay and what he's getting is a massive overpay value-wise.
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Man you are obtuse, it's Rudy Gobert's fault that Donovan and Conley got destroyed.

Capela is 90% of what Rudy is yet we've always had a top tier defense and have been a 50+ win playoff team for the last 6 seasons while you guys were one of the worst defensive teams in the league, a play in team, and got absolutely destroyed in the first round.

Rudy is a 6x All-Star, 6x All-NBA Defense, and 3x NBA DPOY. John Collins sucks and so does Capela.
 
YoungJefe said:
Yes I did watch both series. Against the Mavericks we held them to 104 ppg for the series and they really only had two good offensive games against us. In the other 4 games we held them to 93, 99, 102, and 98. Our offenses inability to get anything going was the reason we lost that series. There isn't a single defensive player in NBA history that can protect everyone on the court in playoff basketball. Marcus Smart was just DPOY and got absolutely destroyed in the finals by Curry, lol.

Please don't ever compare Gobert to Clint. And even last year Trae was not efficient, he's a chucker in the playoffs that can easily be taken out of a game. Dude's a career 40% shooter in the postseason. So based on your logic Trae is worth about Coby White and a 1st.
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Youre using ppg instead of offensive rating lmao.

Ppg is going to be lower because the pace is much slower.
 
YoungJefe said:
Against the Mavericks we held them to 104 ppg for the series and they really only had two good offensive games against us. In the other 4 games we held them to 93, 99, 102, and 98.

If we're holding them to 102/98, as the team with the #1 offense in the NBA, we have to win those games.

Don was terrible in the series so our offense tanked and we lost.
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Your offensive rating in the regular season is fool's gold like Atlanta's. It's not real. In February, I had you and the Hawks on my fraud alert for playing a spammy offense that would easily get exposed in the playoffs. Look at Golden State, their offensive rating was meh but in the playoffs, it was a nightmare to stop their offense. When you spam things in the RS and teams don't have time to adjust, you can catch teams off guard but I was never fooled by Atlanta or Utah's offensive success.
 
NBASupes said:
Your offensive rating in the regular season is fool's gold like Atlanta's. It's not real. In February, I had you and the Hawks on my fraud alert for playing a spammy offense that would easily get exposed in the playoffs. Look at Golden State, their offensive rating was meh but in the playoffs, it was a nightmare to stop their offense. When you spam things in the RS and teams don't have time to adjust, you can catch teams off guard but I was never fooled by Atlanta or Utah's offensive success.
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Well why are you on a Jazz board discussing Rudy when you have Collins who is just as impactful and Capela who's basically the same player. You guys are set with two All-NBA level big men.
 
YoungJefe said:
I'm not going to go back and forth with someone that thinks John Collins is as impactful as Rudy Gobert or that Clint Capela is 90% of the player Rudy is.
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No one thinks John Collins is close to being the impact Gobert is. You are making that up to make your trash opinions more credible when you don't know what you are talking about.
 
NBASupes said:
No one thinks John Collins is close to being the impact Gobert is. You are making that up to make your trash opinions more credible when you don't know what you are talking about.
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You're right, Rudy is $5M more valuable so Collins is 75% of him based on your numbers and Capela is 90% of Rudy. Those are your words not mine.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
Like I said he’s gotten worse every year. The last two have been atrocious, but he’s never been a stalwart defender by any means.
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You have him playing next to Conley. Before when he was next to Rubio, he could guard PGs where he was much better against but his standing reach is only 8'4, that's below average for a 2 guard defensively. Rubio was defensively versatile and could guard 1s and 2s. That really helped Donovan on defense.
 
YoungJefe said:
You're right, Rudy is $5M more valuable so Collins is 75% of him based on your numbers and Capela is 90% of Rudy. Those are your words not mine.
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He's 31 years old and limited offensively, when you look at team building value, you only have one max guy, Mitchell. Gobert is a max impact guy but in the mind of team building, he should never be a max cat. You don't pay guys like him and Mutombo that type of money, especially in their 30s.
 
NBASupes said:
You have him playing next to Conley. Before when he was next to Rubio, he could guard PGs where he was much better against but his standing reach is only 8'4, that's below average for a 2 guard defensively. Rubio was defensively versatile and could guard 1s and 2s. That really helped Donovan on defense.
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Rubio wasn’t the same defender when he got here. It’s also not a question of defensive ability it’s a question of effort, and he gives none, and hasn’t for a while
 
NBASupes said:
He's 31 years old and limited offensively, when you look at team building value, you only have one max guy, Mitchell. Gobert is a max impact guy but in the mind of team building, he should never be a max cat. You don't pay guys like him and Mutombo that type of money, especially in their 30s.
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Rudy Gobert is currently 29 years old. Rudy Gobert has been the main reason we've been a 50 win playoff team in the West for 6 consecutive seasons. Rudy is an All-NBA, All-Star, DPOY level player and you just said that Capela is 90% of him and Collins is 80% of him. So why did you guys only win 43 games and have the 26th best defense in the NBA?
 
@NBASupes

Rudy Gobert is limited offensively.

Last season....
Rudy Gobert: 15.6 ppg on 71% FG
John Collins: 16.2 ppg on 52% FG

In the playoffs the last two seasons...
Rudy Gobert: 14.7 ppg on 74% FG | 12.0 ppg on 64% FG
John Collins: 13.9 ppg on 55% FG | 9.4 ppg on 48% FG

Interesting...
 
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