A few years ago in the playoffs, when Fisher was in New York and Deron was injured, Dee Brown, who hardly played at all during the regular season, came in and played with a great deal of poise and energy.
Derek Fisher is probably one of the most damaging examples to your argument that you could think of. During his season with the Jazz, Fisher got completely pwned repeatedly at the 2 spot and averaged about 38% FG for the season (and an underwhelming <31% from the trey), which was probably among the league's worst for starting SGs.
Besides a truly heroic return during the playoffs and perhaps a few other clutch shots, his on-court performance was subpar, and he is one of the greatest examples of the opposite extreme: Sloan overplaying a player despite his truly damaging the team's success. You have just pointed out a better example than any other one that I have shared of the misguided judgment that Sloan has SOMETIMES had in evaluating players, and it is reasonable to infer that Fisher's high character, reputation, and locker-room leadership influenced Sloan (unintentionally; all players want to play) to give DF more minutes than what was optimal for the team. He should've been substantially a backup point guard to Deron, with MAYBE 5 MPG extra alongside D-Will per game plus possibly extra minutes in clutch time.
Same with Price, who was third string behind Deron and Knight a couple years back. He was virtually the best player on the floor in one of the last games against the Lakers that year.
Great. And Price is an excellent example of a player who is useful (beyond giving DW a rest) for specific situations such as annoying Kobe or defending Jason Terry or dunking over Boozer. Your mention of Price is bad example because Fesenko has hustled pretty hard in games--too hard, sometimes, leading to excessive fouls. And if you are suggesting that Price has worked hard off the court, as in practice, then it hasn't paid off to the extent that it ought to, because he is still hovering at a 40% FG (just like Fisher, coincidentally) with very low assist rate for a point guard. So while both Fes and Price have been helpful defensively, at least Fes--even in the limited minutes that he has gotten--has been able to keep his FG percentage above 50% in the past two seasons, and I would reckon that 50% FG for a center is equivalent to 45% FG for a guard.
Neither of them complained that they couldn't play well because Sloan hadn't played them more during the year. Both said that they just worked all year to "be ready" as Sloan asked them to be.
Irrelevant. Fisher averaged 27 MPG. That is far above the 10 MPG or so that I have been saying for a long time that is the minimum to develop players (or keep veterans in game rhythm, for that matter). Also, I don't see that Fesenko has been complaining very much, even though he has logged about half the PT that Ronnie Price did at the same point in his NBA career. Also, most of the time Deron does a good job out there, so there are fewer situations in which Price (or the backup PG) "should" be out there instead of the alternatives. Okur and Boozer and sometimes Millsap (not usually for lack of effort) on the other hand, were more often innefective at the 4/5, and porous interior defense was a primary problem almost every night. Fesenko was a potential mitigation or stopgap for that problem for 10-15 MPG, and Sloan didn't use that resource enough.
Nor do I recall them claiming that they would have been better than Jordan, if only they had played more earlier.
Typical Hopper hyperbole drivel that I have never claimed. For most of this argument, I have stated that Fesenko deserved 10 to 15 minutes per, in large part because few players of any skill level can develop with less time than that. You seem to be going out on some tangent about whether Fisher-Price toyed (pun intended) with complaining to Sloan. As I have laid out in detail above, Fisher should have been kissing Jerry's feet for giving him more time than what was best for the team. That hasn't happened so much for Price, but he should be grateful that a 40%-shooting backup PG who doesn't run the offense very well could stick around for so long.
Zup wit dat, ya figure?
With regard to Price, I recall Sloan sayin that Price proved he should have been played more earlier in the year. But Sloan wasn't sayin that because Price sucked and he wanted him to be better and/or to learn how to try harder. He said it because Price *was* good, and gave it all he had. Big difference.
Absolutely ridiculous that you are following up Fisher example with Price. RP is one of the hardest workers on the court, and he has been a crucial defender at times, but his shooting has been poor and inconsistent. If Price were the standard for effort (sometimes sacrificing his body), then few players would fit.
Pretty much any player on the team but Ronnie Price would be a better example for your argument, given that 5 years and 4 times as many minutes as Fesenko has not been enough for him to turn into a consistent point guard. If anything, I could make an argument that he needed more playing time also because he barely made the 10 minutes per available game threshold, both last year and over his career, and whatever effort he has put forth in practice and off the court hasn't been enough for him to turn into a more reliable shooter or a more prolific distributor. In other words, you have provided me with an example of a player with serious work ethic but either insufficient minutes or talent or both to become a reliable backup--yet another boost for my argument. Given that Fes has shown signs of progress that began toward the end of last season, it is reasonable to predict that Fes's threshold of skill has not been reached. As for Ronnie P, I'm not so sure. At some point, NBA players level off; and he's now 27 years old, vs. a mere 23 1/3 for Fesenko.
