What should the FO do if we are 0.500 by January?

[NUMBERICA]

They obviously never had a choice like that.

Anyway, OKC executed a multiyear scorched earth tank. There was never any question about what they were going to do. They wanted to hit rock bottom.

I’m confused by this comment. So what’s wrong with the Jazz tanking is they’re being weak-willed about it? Or?

 

[NUMBERICA]

They had two years in the tank. They just did it right. They sent Al Horford home instead of letting him continue to play. They sat SGA a **** ton of games. They basically did what we did last year... except they did it for two years. They had choices. They made choices and the followed through with their commitment.

Correct. Sitting SGA doesn’t seem to have ruined his development or caused a cancerous loser culture, either.

Our organization is just run by cowards, whose cowardice is dragging out the number of years we end seasons desperately trying to lose games.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Correct. Sitting SGA doesn’t seem to have ruined his development or caused a cancerous loser culture, either.

Our organization is just run by cowards, whose cowardice is dragging out the number of years we end seasons desperately trying to lose games.

I think Presti and OKC trigger something weird. Like what he did isn't genius but he is regarded as one. I think he is just really disciplined and smart. I don't think we have the discipline to fully commit and stay on one path at times. We want to be skinny while eating cake ya know.

We also seem to get tripped up by things that could have been easily foreseen but catch us by surprise. I realize post-Walker injury the team projected as a loser and is winning more than expected... but coming into the season with Walker this is a record that could be considered possible. I'm just not sure why they thought they needed to keep all the expiring contracts for trade purposes. We have enough exceptions and other things to do deals. Should have cut bait with a couple guys before they came into camp tbh.

It seems like they are on a path now (hopefully) that they embrace the tank more. Who knows though.

 

[Zombie]

I think Presti and OKC trigger something weird. Like what he did isn't genius but he is regarded as one. I think he is just really disciplined and smart. I don't think we have the discipline to fully commit and stay on one path at times. We want to be skinny while eating cake ya know.

We also seem to get tripped up by things that could have been easily foreseen but catch us by surprise. I realize post-Walker injury the team projected as a loser and is winning more than expected... but coming into the season with Walker this is a record that could be considered possible. I'm just not sure why they thought they needed to keep all the expiring contracts for trade purposes. We have enough exceptions and other things to do deals. Should have cut bait with a couple guys before they came into camp tbh.

It seems like they are on a path now (hopefully) that they embrace the tank more. Who knows though.

My read is that this has less to do with discipline (or cowardice) and more to do with OKC's front office and ownership all being on the same page throughout their tanking years, something I don't think is the case with Utah. Especially since baby Ainge arrived.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

My read is that this has less to do with discipline (or cowardice) and more to do with OKC's front office and ownership all being on the same page throughout their tanking years, something I don't think is the case with Utah. Especially since baby Ainge arrived.

I definitely buy that. I think DA is also an "opportunist" where Presti is a detailed planner.

I also wonder where Ryan sits in all this. Like I wonder if part of the way Austin gets the gig is telling Ryan what he wants to hear and he wants to move on from the tank? I can definitely see how having 3 (4 if you count JZ) big voices pulling different directions how it might look a bit disjointed.

I just see such a clear line of demarcation of when the tank should end. Its weird not to sprint to the finish here.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Austin Ainge made the team worse on paper. He traded away Sexton and Collins, two players many would say were at least average starters.

He got a center who got booted from two teams who badly needed a big man. And a center who just had his worse season as a pro who is 37 years old.

Main way to make the team worse right now is playing Cody and Taylor a lot of minutes, but they might not be that bad. Cody is our best wing defender and Taylor can at least hit shots sometimes. The Jazz also seem to actually believe both players have a future and don't want to overextend them just for the sake of losing and wrecking their confidence.

So it basically comes down to sitting Lauri or Keyonte. I would imagine it would be very difficult to sit Keyonte. He's playing for his contract extension. Who knows how amicable Lauri is to sitting games given he could be a lock for his 2nd all-star game and the only thing that would stop that is not playing enough games.

Austin said he wouldn't do any tomfoolery, and he has stuck by that, but I'm curious to see if he changes his mind given how bad the rest of the NBA has been which I'm guessing he didn't see coming

 

[KqWIN]

I don't think there's an issue with FO and ownership not being on the same page. Problem is that they were on the wrong page....or they were only able to turn the page half way. Ryan has to take the flack for selling our pick for $$$, but we're in a poor situation mostly due to DA's greed. Up until this point, I think Ryan has allowed the FO to do as the please. It's not a small thing for a new owner to sign off on trading two superstar players immediately with an All Star game coming. Hardy has also been very compliant whenever the mandate comes in. When he's allowed to do his best to win he does, but when the mandate comes he has had no problem with it. IMO, we have great synergy between ownership, FO, and coaching. We just have bad FO.

I do think patience has run out, but that is another thing where the FO and ownership appear to be on the same page with.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Austin Ainge made the team worse on paper. He traded away Sexton and Collins, two players many would say were at least average starters.

He got a center who got booted from two teams who badly needed a big man. And a center who just had his worse season as a pro who is 37 years old.

Main way to make the team worse right now is playing Cody and Taylor a lot of minutes, but they might not be that bad. Cody is our best wing defender and Taylor can at least hit shots sometimes. The Jazz also seem to actually believe both players have a future and don't want to overextend them just for the sake of losing and wrecking their confidence.

So it basically comes down to sitting Lauri or Keyonte. I would imagine it would be very difficult to sit Keyonte. He's playing for his contract extension. Who knows how amicable Lauri is to sitting games given he could be a lock for his 2nd all-star game and the only thing that would stop that is not playing enough games.

Austin said he wouldn't do any tomfoolery, and he has stuck by that, but I'm curious to see if he changes his mind given how bad the rest of the NBA has been which I'm guessing he didn't see coming

Its the bold part that kinda gets me each time. Individually I can see how you don't see one team being bad or whatever... but there are almost always a couple teams that join the fray. The only thing you can control to an extent is how bad you are. Their job is to be ready for some of these things. Boxing himself into a weird statement for no reason was a dumb move too. Easy to correct if you don't have an ego though.

With Walker we were pushing it a bit. Now that he is out it looks like a tank is fully achievable... but why give Will options that he can play instead of the tank commanders?

Nurk wasn't bad in Charlotte. They did the deal to get the better overall player and a second round pick. It was a tank move though.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Locke continues to seem pretty convinced the Jazz will do what's necessary to keep the oick