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Following potential 2015 draftees

Basically everyone seems to be in agreement on this. It's just a matter of what we would have to give up. If packaging our pick with a future one (like the GS or OKC pick) could land us Mario, we'll be set. If we have to give up more than that, I don't know if DL would pull the trigger.

If Detroit, Sacramento etc go for that with the OKC pick, I'd do that in a heartbeat. But that GS pick is one Steph Curry injury away from being in the lottery. Bogut and Iggy will be 33 in 2017 and who knows how the league is going to look with the new Salary Cap rise coming up.

You run the risk of the wing position becoming a logjam with Winslow or Hezonja. But you can always create a package in a year or two with a wing, Burke + draft pick for an unhappy all-star.
 
I worry about the defense in the second unit with Burke, Burks, Booker and possibly Tomic. Johnson would be a great defensive SF for the second unit, who could possibly start alongside Hayward and could play some PF with small ball. I'd much rather have Tomic and Johnson than Kaminsky only as there is no guarantee we get anyone in FA.

Don't get me wrong I like both Kaminsky & Johnson. To me the emergence of Hood is messing up our plan a little bit. If we draft Johnson, that's 4 starting calibre players with only 2 starting spots (Hayward, Hood, Burks, Johnson).



Drafting Kaminsky however would fill a real gap/need.
 
I am just going to go on the record and say it right now - if we keep the pick - I don't want Kaminsky! I could be really off on this one, but to me his ceiling looks like a solid rotational player. This is quite possibly the last year for some time that we are going to be picking in the lottery and I don't want us to be wasting a pick on a guy whose best case scenario is being a player in the Kelly Olynyk mold. I don't think he's athletic enough, I don't think he's quick enough, I don't think he defends well in space, in pnr and in the post(damn, does he give up deep position on every single post up!). I get why people like him, because he's very skilled offensively and can stretch the floor and his floor is probably higher than most prospects at the 10-15 range, but I'd rather we swing for the fences one last time. I would draft Oubre, Dekker, Winslow, Johnson, Booker, Dunn, Grant, Poeltl, Portis, Looney, hell maybe even Lyles before I draft Kaminsky. Maybe not all of them will turn into starter-level players or better in the league, but I feel like the chance with all of them is better than the chance with Kaminsky.
 
I think the Jazz are going to end up 10th in the draft order and find themselves debating Oubre, Looney and maybe Johnson if they can't move up. I don't really see Kaminsky on the Jazz, unless he turns out to be an awesome stretch shooter. That said, I think they should make a solid offer to Sacramento to move up to their projected 6th or 7th pick. Sacramento should be looking at Looney, Turner, Lyles and the #1 PG in this draft. The Jazz can make that happen and make it worth their while. Maybe Sacramento takes Winslow or WCS though. Who knows...

Jazz would target Hezonja, Porzingis or Winslow.

I agree with Stiches. I don't think Kaminsky is a game-changer for us, primarily due to his lack of quickness. I'd honestly rather have Turner even though he seems to run like a duck.
 
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Here's an article about first impressions of Sam Vecenie from CBS Sports about the Hoop summit prospects:


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-o...world-team-measurements-and-practice-analysis
Nike Hoop Summit: World Team measurements and practice analysis
By Sam Vecenie | CBSSports.com
April 8, 2015 12:30 am ET

The 2015 Nike Hoop Summit has brought together some of the best NBA draft prospects in the world. Practice for the World Team kicked off on Monday and Tuesday, but prior to that the players were measured for heights, weights, wingspan, standing reaches, and some other measurements. Here is how that team's roster looks, how they measured out, and then some analysis from Tuesday's practice, which was the first one I was in attendance for following the Final Four.
ZSX3kKU.jpg

Thoughts:

* Skal Labissiere is one of the bigger names in attendance here, and nothing about him has disappointed to this juncture. At 7-foot tall in shoes with a 7-1.5 wingspan, he has the size to play the center position in the NBA, and his body is continuing to put on weight, which is a good sign. However, the measurements aren't the most impressive part of Labissiere. It's his play. The Kentucky recruit basically dominated from the beginning to the end of practice on Tuesday, outplaying another potential 2016 top-10 pick in Thon Maker by a considerable margin in their matchup. His fluid athleticism is readily apparent at every turn, whether it be on defense where he contested just about every single Maker shot on the perimeter, or on offense where he was terrific in the pick-and-roll and pick-and-pop, as he has terrific instinctual awareness of where to find the soft spot in the defense. He already has an incredibly soft touch, and his range seems to have increased out to the college 3-point line (he attempted a couple of NBA level 3s, but they didn't look as comfortable mechanically). He was the best player on the floor Tuesday, and I was told it was a similar story on Monday by others. Like everyone here, he still has a way's to go, but it wouldn't shock me if he ended up as the No. 1 recruit in the 2015 high school class.

* The current No. 1 recruit in the 2015 high school class and another potential top-five pick in 2016 is also in Portland in Ben Simmons. He arrived on Tuesday following his most valuable player performance in the high school national championships, and was measured at 6-foot-10 with a 6-11 wingspan and an 8-7 standing reach. Those aren't great numbers, but they aren't necessarily a backbreaker either for a point-forward type like Simmons. He probably won't be able to defend power forwards regularly, but his future seems to lie on the wing anyway. He's working with the perimeter players here, and even got to see some time as a point guard on Tuesday. For me, he was probably the second-best player on the floor behind Labissiere, which isn't a surprise given his general standing as a prospect.

* The measurement that really jumps off the page here is undoubtedly Zhou Qi, the 7-foot-2 Chinese center with a 7-6.5 wingspan. As far as I know, his standing reach of 9-6.5 would be the second longest in the NBA behind Rudy Gobert's. Much like Gobert, Zhou is already a terrific rim protector internationally, as he led the CBA in blocks in his rookie season with 3.3 in 29 minutes per game. His 10.7 percent block rate dwarfed the next closest competitor's (Slava Kravtsov, formerly of Detroit Pistons' fame, had a 6.1 percent block rate). The question with Zhou is obviously the frame, as 209 pounds is incredibly frail for that size. It's something to keep an eye on throughout the week, although he did not play Tuesday after apparently picking up an ankle injury on Monday.

* George de Paula is one of only two prospects on this roster that is currently in my 2015 NBA mock draft. And as you can see, there's a pretty clear reason he's there. At 6-foot-6 with a 6-11.5 wingspan, he would be among the biggest point guards to ever play the position in the NBA. Put it this way: I currently have Justin Anderson from Virginia in the first round in 2015 as a small forward, and Lucas is about the same size. There's also the matter of his hands. Again, I feel reasonably confident saying that de Paula's hands would probably be the biggest among any point guard's to ever play in the NBA. He used those hands and that length to good use in practice on Tuesday, as he's a complete terror in passing lanes. He picked off countless passes in transition and generally made it tough on whoever he was defending to initiate offense. The questions with him are more offensive, as his first step and shooting ability leave quite a bit to be desired. I've got him in the second round right now.

* Thon Maker measured well at 7-foot with a 7-3.25 wingspan, plus has put on some weight to get up to 218. He looks bigger, and with his broad shoulders it looks like his frame would be able to stand another 15-20 pounds. He's working with the big men here (his perimeter skill level has led some to speculate if his future is as a massive wing a la Kevin Durant), and looked pretty solid during practice despite Labissiere getting the better of him. He made a couple of 3s, and used his length to block a few shots in the lane. It's fair to say though that he still doesn't look totally comfortable in the post with his footwork, and that will be the biggest place for him to work to improve.

* Other quick hitters.....Cheick Diallo was MVP of the McDonald's All-American game mostly due to his work level, and that's continued here. He was active athletically and on the glass with his 7-4 wingspan.....Nedim Buza looks the part of a small forward at 6-8 with a 6-11 wingspan, and his ability to shoot will probably get him drafted in the next two years.....Despite his lack of size, Federico Mussini looks the part with his play. He's considering college still, and he would make an NCAA coach really happy with his level of polish, poise, and terrific shooting.....Jamal Murray and Stefan Peno are two of the younger guys here, and they went back and forth in their matchup Tuesday. Murray will be an interesting college guy to look at down the road, and Peno will continue to develop at the powerhouse that is Barcelona.....Finally, Tai Wynyard is the youngest player here, and he looked it today. The Kentucky commit for 2016 struggled a bit with the length surrounding him, which isn't a total surprise given his inexperience and his size. Still, simply being here will be a good experience for him.
 
If you can get a "solid rotation player" at 12 you do it. Kaminksy is a super safe pick and like One Love has pointed out, actually fills a big need.
 
This is what Kaminsky would look like if he were as good as Cody Zeller. Problem is, I don't think he's as good as Cody Zeller.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd_GJZ5qWjM
 
It was also interesting to read on Chad ford's chat. That a could let players are putting pressure on Russell. That Winslow could go higher than him.
 
This is what Kaminsky would look like if he were as good as Cody Zeller. Problem is, I don't think he's as good as Cody Zeller.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd_GJZ5qWjM


Totally different players but they are both white and ugly, so it is kind of what it would look like.

Franks skills are shooting, passing, and driving. The first two will translate and the third should as well because players have to close out hard. He will be a rich mans olynyk who is a really effective bench big.

He could turn out to be a better version of memo... That is his upside. Most of the swing for the fences guys flame out... You just forget their names. It is easier to remember the giannis and the Gobert's but we forget about the Sene and korolov types.
 
Totally different players but they are both white and ugly, so it is kind of what it would look like.

Franks skills are shooting, passing, and driving. The first two will translate and the third should as well because players have to close out hard. He will be a rich mans olynyk who is a really effective bench big.

He could turn out to be a better version of memo... That is his upside. Most of the swing for the fences guys flame out... You just forget their names. It is easier to remember the giannis and the Gobert's but we forget about the Sene and korolov types.

Also don't forget what Locke said (if you trust him), that DL was pretty high on drafting Olynyk in the 2013 draft before Corbin suggested that we draft Trey. So there is a precedence of sort for the Jazz being interested in a Kaminsky type of player.


The Okur comparison is an interesting one too, he was pretty effective for us even in that Jerry Sloan offense that wasn't geared towards guys shooting 3's... I can't even begin to imagine how Quin would incorporate Kaminsky's shooting into our current offense.
 
Also don't forget what Locke said (if you trust him), that DL was pretty high on drafting Olynyk in the 2013 draft before Corbin suggested that we draft Trey. So there is a precedence of sort for the Jazz being interested in a Kaminsky type of player.


The Okur comparison is an interesting one too, he was pretty effective for us even in that Jerry Sloan offense that wasn't geared towards guys shooting 3's... I can't even begin to imagine how Quin would incorporate Kaminsky's shooting into our current offense.


If Kaminsky can really shoot like Okur, that's one thing, but that's yet to be proven. Kaminsky's footspeed and post-ups around the rim are not as good as Zeller. That's the comparison I was trying to make.

I wouldn't take Kaminsky ahead of Stanley Johnson. I don't think I'd take him a head of Oubre either, whom I still see as a prototypical wing. With Kaminsky vs. Looney it's a debate about what kind of back-up big you want. However, Looney is likely to be the better long-term player. Turner is likely to be better long-term as well. Keep in mind, it's 2 years from now when Gobert and Exum are really developed. We still have a season or two development window to bring in a young player, and Kaminsky isn't good enough to forgo that opportunity, imo.

That is, I don't like the opportunity cost of drafting Kaminsky when this is probably our last lottery pick for a long time. He won't make us a fundamentally different or better team. Porzingis probably would, but we're not likely going to get him.
 
Next year, the Jazz will be drafting in the 17 range. That seems like where you pick up a back-up big. If we're in the 10 or 11 spot this year, it's a rare opportunity to draft a good wing, particularly in this draft. If we can't move up, I'd say don't fight it and get Johnson or Oubre. Both will be top 6 or 7 rotation players. The Jazz have talent at every position. Now they need stars to emerge.
 
If Kaminsky can really shoot like Okur, that's one thing, but that's yet to be proven. Kaminsky's footspeed and post-ups around the rim are not as good as Zeller. That's the comparison I was trying to make.

I wouldn't take Kaminsky ahead of Stanley Johnson. I don't think I'd take him a head of Oubre either, whom I still see as a prototypical wing. With Kaminsky vs. Looney it's a debate about what kind of back-up big you want. However, Looney is likely to be the better long-term player. Turner is likely to be better long-term as well. Keep in mind, it's 2 years from now when Gobert and Exum are really developed. We still have a season or two development window to bring in a young player, and Kaminsky isn't good enough to forgo that opportunity, imo.

That is, I don't like the opportunity cost of drafting Kaminsky when this is probably our last lottery pick for a long time. He won't make us a fundamentally different or better team. Porzingis probably would, but we're not likely going to get him.

Like Spy said before our best hope at the moment (without trading up) I think is Johnson OR Kaminsky.


Gun to my head, I think I'd go with Johnson with a slight edge just because of the potential going forward. But I wouldn't pick Oubre/Turner over Kaminsky.
 
If Kaminsky can really shoot like Okur, that's one thing, but that's yet to be proven. Kaminsky's footspeed and post-ups around the rim are not as good as Zeller. That's the comparison I was trying to make.

I wouldn't take Kaminsky ahead of Stanley Johnson. I don't think I'd take him a head of Oubre either, whom I still see as a prototypical wing. With Kaminsky vs. Looney it's a debate about what kind of back-up big you want. However, Looney is likely to be the better long-term player. Turner is likely to be better long-term as well. Keep in mind, it's 2 years from now when Gobert and Exum are really developed. We still have a season or two development window to bring in a young player, and Kaminsky isn't good enough to forgo that opportunity, imo.

That is, I don't like the opportunity cost of drafting Kaminsky when this is probably our last lottery pick for a long time. He won't make us a fundamentally different or better team. Porzingis probably would, but we're not likely going to get him.

Kaminsky shot 41.6%... pretty memo like. I don't think his stroke is as pure as memo's, but I think his drives and post up game are better... or will be better than Memo's.

Zeller is a better post player, but I don't think that is how a smart coach will use Frank. Imagine Frank setting those ball screens up top for Burks, Hayward, Hood... the big will have to stay close to cover Frank's shot and if he gets too close Frank can drive into a wide open lane. This also opens up driving lanes for the wings. He's also a good passer.

Oubre is the only one I might consider of that group. His problem is he floats a bit... that can be addressed. He reminds me of Rudy Gay. Turner and Looney could both end up busting. Looney reminds me of Aminu and Turner's body may not allow him to be effective. If you've watched him play it is all sorts of awkward.

I would take Johnson before Frank and Porzingis, but I would be very happy if we are sitting at 12 and Frank dropped into our lap.
 
Like Spy said before our best hope at the moment (without trading up) I think is Johnson OR Kaminsky.


Gun to my head, I think I'd go with Johnson with a slight edge just because of the potential going forward. But I wouldn't pick Oubre/Turner over Kaminsky.


I would pick Johnson quite clearly over Kaminsky and prep him to play a Draymond Green-type role, something he has the physical talent to do if his motor and work ethic are up to it. I would definitely take Oubre over Kaminsky, as I think Oubre could be an ideal starting 2-guard giving us unparalleled length on the perimeter. I would have to think about Turner, but would probably take him over Kaminsky as well.

I think Kaminsky is going to look slow and clumsy at NBA speed, resulting in him not getting many minutes.
 
Kaminsky shot 41.6%... pretty memo like. I don't think his stroke is as pure as memo's, but I think his drives and post up game are better... or will be better than Memo's.

Zeller is a better post player, but I don't think that is how a smart coach will use Frank. Imagine Frank setting those ball screens up top for Burks, Hayward, Hood... the big will have to stay close to cover Frank's shot and if he gets too close Frank can drive into a wide open lane. This also opens up driving lanes for the wings. He's also a good passer.

Oubre is the only one I might consider of that group. His problem is he floats a bit... that can be addressed. He reminds me of Rudy Gay. Turner and Looney could both end up busting. Looney reminds me of Aminu and Turner's body may not allow him to be effective. If you've watched him play it is all sorts of awkward.

I would take Johnson before Frank and Porzingis, but I would be very happy if we are sitting at 12 and Frank dropped into our lap.


Good comments.

Oubre for the moment puts in more effort on defense than Rudy Gay, and if he's more disciplined with his shot selection, then being like Rudy Gay is not a problem. Some of these draft sites have also started comparing Oubre to Kendall Gill, who was solid defensively and at filling the lanes.

Zeller is a 7-footer with good speed and athleticism, plus a jumper out to 20 feet or so. I get the appeal of Kaminsky as a pick-and-pop player. I don't think he's a guy who will create much on his own in the NBA, though he has basic post moves. I just worry about his ability to play other aspects of the game--defense, rebounding, running the floor, pick-and-roll defense, etc. He looks a step slow to me.

I don't see Looney busting. He has good IQ, is a good passer, makes good reads, and can score in different ways. I just don't think the ceiling is as high as people supposedly say it is. It reminds me of how scouts gushed about Marvin Williams (a number 2 pick). Their games could be very similar.

Turner could bust, but if he works on his body and his footwork he has the talent to be close to a Jermaine O'Neal or Hassan Whiteside, who was also awkward coming out of college. A 7-footer with a money 12-foot jumper is a nice player to have.
 
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