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Fainting Hillary

Feel free to look at Trump as harmless.

I will never support the election of a demagogue. Never. Especially not one that campaigns on scapegoating minorities and marginalized communities within the U.S..

I would support ANYONE in opposition to such a person.

Lucky for us we have a highly competent person running against Trump. Now let's not be completely stupid and make sure #nevertrump
 
Comparing anyone or anything to Hitler or Nazis = you're argument loses all credibility.

Like, seriously. It's the go to move when you are officially grasping for straws.

Example: in 4th grade my Mom didn't want me to have a girlfriend even though I was with the hottest girl in school. I told her that she was being exactly like Hitler because he didn't like people to do certain things either. Or something. (True Story)

Trump to Hitler takes an insaaaaaaaane amount of projecting.
 
Comparing anyone or anything to Hitler or Nazis = you're argument loses all credibility.

Like, seriously. It's the go to move when you are officially grasping for straws.

Example: in 4th grade my Mom didn't want me to have a girlfriend even though I was with the hottest girl in school. I told her that she was being exactly like Hitler because he didn't like people to do certain things either. Or something. (True Story)

Trump to Hitler takes an insaaaaaaaane amount of projecting.

I disagree. Trump = small hands retarded Hitler

Like I said, it's dumb to see a jackass like that as a real threat right until they **** up the whole planet.
 
Oh, but Hillary had the same private email server that several of the Secretary of State's had before her. An email server that was set up under the advice of the staff at the State Department. Not something she insisted on because she's Hillary, just what everyone had before her.

And she had people in some sort of crazy Chinese Fire Drill changing uniforms on the tarmac instead of invading a foreign nation in what would have been a failed attempt at saving an embassy. Said embassy requested additional help just like every other embassy around that time. embassy staffing had been reduced across the board.

And she has undercover Parkinson's.

Better elect the guy who has the support of the White Nationalists. I mean, millions of racist white people couldn't be wrong, could they? And even if you're not a white nationalist, you shouldn't be concerned that every racist in the U.S. finally has a candidate they can get behind, I mean, you want the same things they do anyway...even though you're not a racist. I mean, Mexicans are ****ing our **** up. You don't have to be racist to see that. All you want is for people to respect our unrealistic fantasyland immigration policy. And you want someone to build a big wall of freedom to make them respect those unrealistic immigration policies.

I usually see presidential candidates for what they are. Not really all that important in the scheme of things. I'd really like to have pride in the U.S., though, and not have to face the world having elected a demagogue who scapegoats minorities and brags about the size of his ****ing hands and his "good brain".

He's a guy who's main argument against a major party challenger was to call the guy "Little Rubio." That's who Trump is. That's the kind of prick we're considering for President of our country.

I'd like to have Trump in a room with no armed Secret Service agents. I'd take on for the team 100%. But that won't be necessary. We'll have a competent President because there just aren't enough idiots out there to get Trump elected.
 
Trump = Hitler is akin to Obama = True Leader of ISIS, in my book.

Yeah, I don't agree.

I think trump is genuinely dangerous.

He has emboldened White Nationalists. That is already more harm that Obama ever did and he isn't even president yet.
 
Yeah, I don't agree.

I think trump is genuinely dangerous.

He has emboldened White Nationalists. That is already more harm that Obama ever did and he isn't even president yet.

Is this to you a guilty by association thing? Like, if bad people like things about him then he is bad?

Or are you saying these "white nationals" that have been emboldened are now more dangerous because of Trump? If that's the case, what do you think they will do?
 
I back Gameface 100% in this discussion.....

We are all familiar with the adage paraphrased as "learn the lessons of history or be doomed to repeat them" To do that today in America, and to understand the rise of a man like Trump, we need to recognize that in periods of great cultural and social change, and economic dislocation, the time is ripe for the appearance of demagogues. That is one lesson of history. To recognize when the time is opportune for the appearance of a demagogue. The tools of a demagogue include stoking the fears a demagogue knows exist within his society, creating scapegoats upon which anxious people can project their fear and anger, and offering up a strong man image as the one who will solve their problems. Understanding then, how to recognize a demagogue is another lesson of history.

And when one recognizes that Trump is that demagogue, it is only natural to bring to mind examples from history in which a demagogue coming to power has spelled disaster.

W. Michael Blumenthal is a man who arrived in the United States as a refugee from Nazi Germany. He is also an ex US Secretary of the Treasury. Here is an essay he wrote, from the perspective of someone who understands how important it is to recognize the lessons of history and make informed decisions based on recognizing the need to avoid, at all costs, allowing a man like Trump to assume power.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/9664110?utm_hp_ref=politics

"It worries me that Trump and what he preaches reminds me so painfully of the posturing and rhetoric of last century’s European demagogues. His “politically incorrect” attacks on the establishment, his belligerent rhetoric against Muslims and Mexicans, the blaming of foreign countries for domestic problems, and the half-truths, outright lies and bullying of opponents all sounds distressingly familiar to me. His boasts of personal strength, pathological egomania, the lack of humility or capacity for self-criticism, his narcissism and vanity and the promise of easy solutions with strongman boasts — all these are part and parcel of the same rhetoric the fatal European dictators of my youth used to mislead the public and to undermine and ultimately destroy democracy."

...."What matters most is that Donald Trump’s expressed views represent a challenge to our most fundamental values. Indeed, to American democracy itself. History shows that, with someone like him, there cannot be rational dialogue or compromise. There can be no doing business with a candidate for the White House who demonizes an entire religion, endorses torture, belittles women, is master of ethnic slurs, compliments foreign dictators and insults our friends and allies.

Such a candidate cannot be advised, appeased, or controlled from the inside. He can only be brought down if ostracized and exposed."
 
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Is this to you a guilty by association thing? Like, if bad people like things about him then he is bad?

Or are you saying these "white nationals" that have been emboldened are now more dangerous because of Trump? If that's the case, what do you think they will do?

It's like a "Wink-wink, nudge-nudge, Bob's your uncle" kind of thing. Like not being willing to condemn David Duke. Like using coded language. Like pulling memes and talking points from White Nationalist websites and promoting them.

It's kind of like guilt by being guilty. If Trump didn't have the support of racists he would lose half his support. He knows it and the rest of us know it. He needs that support. Since he's not a typical Christian neo-con he can't just herd religious voters to his side, so he's found another voter base to appeal to.

Why do you think Trump appeals to White Nationalists? Just a silly goofball coincidence? Racists like strong leadership just like the rest of us?
 
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If I could expand a bit on the article by Blumenthal. The lesson being advanced is not "if we elect Trump, out will come the gas chambers for Muslims". The lesson is to understand the lessons of history where demagogues are concerned. One has to examine actual examples from history in order to do that. And, in so doing, for many, simply understanding those lessons, the conditions within a society that make the rise of a demagogue ripe, the techniques used by demagogues to gain power, and the damage to a society that can often result, all possible to learn through a study of history, should be enough to conclude no democracy does itself a favor ignoring these lessons, ignoring the parallels between past and present, and elevating a demagogue to power. History should tell us it is not wise to elevate anyone who constantly appeals to our baser instincts, and who appeals to the dark extremists among us. At a time when our nation is so divided, it's just not a smart move to appoint anyone who appeals to anger and racial animus.
 
If I could expand a bit on the article by Blumenthal. The lesson being advanced is not "if we elect Trump, out will come the gas chambers for Muslims". The lesson is to understand the lessons of history where demagogues are concerned. One has to examine actual examples from history in order to do that. And, in so doing, for many, simply understanding those lessons, the conditions within a society that make the rise of a demagogue ripe, the techniques used by demagogues to gain power, and the damage to a society that can often result, all possible to learn through a study of history, should be enough to conclude no democracy does itself a favor ignoring these lessons, ignoring the parallels between past and present, and elevating a demagogue to power. History should tell us it is not wise to elevate anyone who constantly appeals to our baser instincts, and who appeals to the dark extremists among us. At a time when our nation is so divided, it's just not a smart move to appoint anyone who appeals to anger and racial animus.

The Hitler comparison can be useful in terms of demagoguery and rise to power but it falls apart and ends up being counterproductive when equivalence of evil is brought into the equation. Otherwise, I agree with Gameface and your characterizations of Trump and the danger he poses and appreciate the effort to communicate the very real disaster he would be as president. Unfortunately, I think Trump’s appeal is too visceral and emotional for argumentation to be of much use. Half the voting public wants an authoritarian big daddy to snap his fingers and make things better. It’s an amazing turning point in American history, continue our great experiment in democracy or turn the world upside down by putting a virtual caricature of the Ugly American (loud, arrogant, demeaning, thoughtless, ignorant, ethnocentric) into power.
 
The Hitler comparison can be useful in terms of demagoguery and rise to power but it falls apart and ends up being counterproductive when equivalence of evil is brought into the equation. Otherwise, I agree with Gameface and your characterizations of Trump and the danger he poses and appreciate the effort to communicate the very real disaster he would be as president. Unfortunately, I think Trump’s appeal is too visceral and emotional for argumentation to be of much use. Half the voting public wants an authoritarian big daddy to snap his fingers and make things better. It’s an amazing turning point in American history, continue our great experiment in democracy or turn the world upside down by putting a virtual caricature of the Ugly American (loud, arrogant, demeaning, thoughtless, ignorant, ethnocentric) into power.
Interestingly, to me it feels like the Obama administration was the amazing turning point. American's didn't used to be embarrassed of America. Since Obama came along it seems that large numbers of people would be embarrassed not to be embarrassed of America in the same ways that he is.

Take immigration as an example. Bill Clinton gave a famous speech on immigration that sounds incredibly similar to what Trump is saying now, but even those aspects of Trump's plan that are exact duplicates of BC's plan are being bashed by the left as inhumane and embarrassing.

It's become commonplace to judge the past based upon present day standards, so our Founding Fathers are being spoken about in the vilest of terms, and their names are being removed from elementary schools and other public buildings. It seems as if the left has gone crazy.

I'm as disappointed as anyone that the right would react by choosing a candidate like Trump (though maybe I'm going too far in saying "anyone" because there are some whose hate for him apparently knows no bounds). To me it's incredibly unfortunate that we don't have better choices.

Benjamin Franklin once said “We need a revolution every 200 years, because all governments become stale and corrupt after 200 years.” I guess we're overdue.
 
Interestingly, to me it feels like the Obama administration was the amazing turning point. American's didn't used to be embarrassed of America. Since Obama came along it seems that large numbers of people would be embarrassed not to be embarrassed of America in the same ways that he is.

Take immigration as an example. Bill Clinton gave a famous speech on immigration that sounds incredibly similar to what Trump is saying now, but even those aspects of Trump's plan that are exact duplicates of BC's plan are being bashed by the left as inhumane and embarrassing.

It's become commonplace to judge the past based upon present day standards, so our Founding Fathers are being spoken about in the vilest of terms, and their names are being removed from elementary schools and other public buildings. It seems as if the left has gone crazy.

I'm as disappointed as anyone that the right would react by choosing a candidate like Trump (though maybe I'm going too far in saying "anyone" because there are some whose hate for him apparently knows no bounds). To me it's incredibly unfortunate that we don't have better choices.

Benjamin Franklin once said “We need a revolution every 200 years, because all governments become stale and corrupt after 200 years.” I guess we're overdue.

Where to you get the idea Obama is embarrassed of America? It rings hollow to me. From my observation Obama is constantly praising American ideals and values.
 
Trump isn't anywhere near what Hitler was. All you guys can hold on to is that he wants to build a wall between Mexico and the US. If you're here LEGALLY there is nothing to worry about. He doesn't want to get rid of the Hispanic race. That's just asinine and I would expect nothing less from liberals.

Hillary has some obvious health issues. Have you seen her talk? She looks like a bobble-head. She had some kind of fainting or seizure episode. She is canceling more and more trips. She's old and it's catching up with her.

Plus she is a liberal. Not sure what there is to like. Trump isn't all that great ether but he doesn't come with anywhere near the baggage or issues Hillary does.


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Trump isn't anywhere near what Hitler was. All you guys can hold on to is that he wants to build a wall between Mexico and the US. If you're here LEGALLY there is nothing to worry about. He doesn't want to get rid of the Hispanic race. That's just asinine and I would expect nothing less from liberals.

Hillary has some obvious health issues. Have you seen her talk? She looks like a bobble-head. She had some kind of fainting or seizure episode. She is canceling more and more trips. She's old and it's catching up with her.

Plus she is a liberal. Not sure what there is to like. Trump isn't all that great ether but he doesn't come with anywhere near the baggage or issues Hillary does.


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So if Hillary gets elected and her health prevents her from finishing her term it still means we didn't elect Trump, right? Good enough for me.
 
Trump isn't anywhere near what Hitler was. All you guys can hold on to is that he wants to build a wall between Mexico and the US. If you're here LEGALLY there is nothing to worry about. He doesn't want to get rid of the Hispanic race. That's just asinine and I would expect nothing less from liberals.

Hillary has some obvious health issues. Have you seen her talk? She looks like a bobble-head. She had some kind of fainting or seizure episode. She is canceling more and more trips. She's old and it's catching up with her.

Plus she is a liberal. Not sure what there is to like. Trump isn't all that great ether but he doesn't come with anywhere near the baggage or issues Hillary does.


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I've taken dumps that had more insight than your posts.
 
Where to you get the idea Obama is embarrassed of America? It rings hollow to me. From my observation Obama is constantly praising American ideals and values.
You obviously respond positively to his backhanded compliments. I don't. There are so many examples of him praising American ideals in an obvious effort to shame those Americans who he disagrees with that it would be impossible to count them all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gouAcayDwLM
I think back upon when Michelle said, "For the first time in my adult life I'm proud of my country." At the time I thought that she could not possibly have meant that. It's become obvious that I was wrong. Obama, and much of the left, seem to see America as a country with a shameful history that owes much of the world apologies and reparations. It feels like he's okay with signing lopsided agreements because he believes we've thrown our weight around and been insensitive to other nations and people for far too long.
 
Trump isn't anywhere near what Hitler was. All you guys can hold on to is that he wants to build a wall between Mexico and the US. If you're here LEGALLY there is nothing to worry about. He doesn't want to get rid of the Hispanic race. That's just asinine and I would expect nothing less from liberals.

Hillary has some obvious health issues. Have you seen her talk? She looks like a bobble-head. She had some kind of fainting or seizure episode. She is canceling more and more trips. She's old and it's catching up with her.

Plus she is a liberal. Not sure what there is to like. Trump isn't all that great ether but he doesn't come with anywhere near the baggage or issues Hillary does.


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So you're all for building a wall then?
 
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