Nah Kas is definitely an option at #5 if you’re not convinced by Tre/VJ/Ace.
Following Potential 2025 Draftees
- Thread starter Elizah Huge
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Nah Kas is definitely an option at #5 if you’re not convinced by Tre/VJ/Ace.
Based on what I saw, Kas can play defense. But he definitely coasted at times. No doubt about that.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
And I wouldn’t be happy with a move like that.
So do you like Key more than Kas?
Jazzinho
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I was thinking about him in the second round though. But it would make sense to use Wolves pick to get him now that we know it's a late first anyways. But not sure if he would be the BPA at 21.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
What does that have to do with anything?
Tremendous Upside
Well-Known Member
Wiggle is for slow people.
Definitely agree with this. I don't think we should expect any of Tre, Kas, Kon, or Fears to be good defenders....but Tre is the worst in my opinion. The others lack physical ability to be good defenders at the NBA level, but they at least put in more effort (Kas and Kon in particular).
Tremendous Upside
Well-Known Member
Always bet on dudes with two-part last names.
I think there’s a decent chance that if things fall just right you could package the Minnesota pick with Key and get Kas. As or more importantly, we kinda have too many decent-but-not-that-good guards.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
Well I don’t know who’s better because Kas hasn’t played yet in the nba. If I’m trading up it’s for a guy I love. I’d hate to trade Key and assets for what I hope is an upgrade of Key just to find out it was a wash or Key is better. I want a clear upgrade on the lineup not a player or position
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
Also I suspect Key would look nice on a good team. I honestly don’t know if I like or hate Kas. Hes hard to get a read on imo. I do think he has high bust potential and a high ceiling. Big red flag for me is he got worse when competition got stronger.
I'm curious what people think about the following: Player Type vs Player Grade when setting up a big board.
I think there are some player types that I value and frankly the NBA values more than others and how do you factor that in when the best player grades are for the least valuable player types?
For example, I don't have any question that Tre Johnson and Derik Queen should have a higher grade as a prospect than Kas. They were both more productive and more consistent. They both have elite qualities about them. However, I personally value the type of player that I project Kas to be vs what I project from them. So potentially they are more likely to hit within their player types, but Kas, who might be less likely to hit, if he does would be more valuable. Does that make sense?
I think it could be argued that we are often wrong when assigning a player type, but I would also argue we are often wrong when we assign a player grade.
Thoughts?
I think there are some player types that I value and frankly the NBA values more than others and how do you factor that in when the best player grades are for the least valuable player types?
For example, I don't have any question that Tre Johnson and Derik Queen should have a higher grade as a prospect than Kas. They were both more productive and more consistent. They both have elite qualities about them. However, I personally value the type of player that I project Kas to be vs what I project from them. So potentially they are more likely to hit within their player types, but Kas, who might be less likely to hit, if he does would be more valuable. Does that make sense?
I think it could be argued that we are often wrong when assigning a player type, but I would also argue we are often wrong when we assign a player grade.
Thoughts?
Almost all players get worse playing stronger competition. That’s not any kind of flag. Furthermore, his undoing came after (from) a forearm injury.
The other angle here is I honestly don’t know what Key’s role is on a good team. Seems it’s a 3rd guard/microwave scorer but he’s not very good on the ball IMO. I think Kas is a way better prospect: he’s more skilled on the ball, he is a WAY better playmaker/passer, and he is bigger. Even after having a pretty awful closing stretch, he had a 59% TS%. This combination of attributes also dramatically increases the viability of keeping/acquiring/playing Sexton types which can be extremely useful if the fit is right.
We’re getting in the weeds here, but I like Kas a lot and like him more than I liked Keyonte.
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seattlejazzfan
Well-Known Member
ace bailey might be the perfect example of that for me. wildly inconsistent. despite his 17 and 7 averages, he just wasn't very efficient over the course of the season, had extremely low assist numbers, yet he's a top 3 lock for me and it isn't close simply because he's a 6'9" SG who is a plus athlete and with a pure stroke (a pure stroke that didn't go in all that often). he has all the tools - at least on paper for both ends of the floor that the nba values, hence i probably have him higher than he deserves otherwise based on his production.
if he hits, he's a killer on both ends of the floor, but the likelihood that he misses is also pretty high.
the best things that one can say about bailey that are legit positives are that he plays really hard, cares defensively and he's one of the youngest dudes in the class.
Co-signed. I like VJ and Tre, but slightly undersized guards that hustle and play defense aren’t exactly the rarest archetype, nor is a shoot first SG that doesn’t play defense.
You hope Johnson’s defensive issue is one that is mostly of effort and that you can correct it. I might just be wrong on VJ, but I kind of have a hard time seeing him being worthy of the 3rd pick.
Bailey has problems, but ceiling isn’t one of them. Feels like you can shore up his shot selection problem with good old-fashioned coaching and development. The passing might never be good, but I think it can be improved and also shored up by other players.
I don’t know what his numbers ended at but in February, Tre Johnson had only allowed 0.788 points per possession and an opponent field goal percentage of 36.3%.
I get what you're saying. For me this is apparent when comparing VJ and Tre. I think you could make the argument that Tre's better within his archetype and the very top of his archetype is higher than that of VJ.....but I like VJ's archetype so much more. If you go down the list of players within VJ's archetype of love them all, from Jrue down to someone like Melton. I can't say the same for someone like Tre Johnson. Of course I like the top end outcomes like Booker or Herro, but if he falls short of that you will find a lot of players who I find to be overrated.
homeytennis
Well-Known Member
From the Portsmouth Invitational yesterday three guys that did well imho: Mathew Cleveland 6'7" guard from Miami (Fla), RJ Felton 6'3" guard from East Carolina and Tysen Degenhardt 6'8" forward from Boise State. This would be for the second round picks or UDFA signing.