How the Mormons Make Money

[northeast]

Like building lots of big buildings that are exempt from being taxed like other real estate?

 

[Dr. Jones]

Like building lots of big buildings that are exempt from being taxed like other real estate?

As I said, those that give are more likely to see the good in things and those that don't, don't. I'm not debating the merits of any specific thing, but rather the psychological/philosophical side of the equation.

 

[northeast]

Some people know that a charity is bad , and they support it for their own selfish reasons.
You are generalizing. Different people are involved with charity for different reasons.

You are assuming that charity is good.
You are using circular reasoning.

I would agree that most people who donate to a charity because they want to be charitable tend to over value in their mind the supposed good that the charity does, and are relatively blind to the negative consequences of the charity.

 

[Archie Moses]

If America was trying to build malls and create a dependency on its secretive government filled with old white men behind closed doors (and it might be), asking for 10% of the wealth that I will accrue over my life while in return offering a place in Heaven and for blessings that may or may not be real--but we certainly have no way of telling (what a racket, that is), and Heaven which paradoxically is a place you can only get to after you die (and for some reason no one wants to do that, for some reason) and the money is then useless, anyway, but God lives in Heaven and one has to wonder what he is using the money for, but to build malls that sell stuff that would be useless when we get in to heaven--and we do want to get in--all the things the church invests in seems sort of trivial, unless their goal was just to be a tax exempt business, unless it's like a Fast Food Heaven or something, like if that's our idea of Heaven, like if Heaven is just America the nice neighborhood while Hell is the bad neighborhood, but just for eternity, and maybe Heaven has a currency and the 10% tithing the church asks for is actually just an investment, or like you're putting that money in an trust fund and the more you pay/less porn you watch the bigger the house you get in Heaven, but, anyways.

I guess I get your point. You're saying that the government can tax and that's the same as the Mormon church asking for a tax. That they're the same thing: taxes I pay to the government and taxes I pay to Prophet Monson. But, Ideally (and I don't want to get into politics) the government represents its people, and does societies work. Ideally. The government at this point in time though, is not offering me salvation or threatening damnation. And I can see a stop sign. When we pay for stop signs we can see them.

I don't see any blessings. Well, I guess I see shopping malls.

Tithing payers should consider themselves partners in the building of the Mall and demand a cut. And not feel bad about needing help to keep their lights on.

If I give my 10% to the Mormon Mall Fund (MMF, please send the donations you can, because every state should have a mall and a temple), and can't pay my electric bill, but I go to the church and they agree to help me pay my light bill, while also making sure I know that they're helping me out and I agree that they are helping me out, and probably making me feel bad about it...

That's called a dependency.


This post kind of got away from me but I had fun writing it.

I totally get that tithing seems like a way bad idea to someone who doesn't actually believe in what they are giving the money to. I just don't see why you're so bunged rummed about it? If you're not, it sure looks like you're carrying a lot of animosity. (Also, why is it that a tithing payer is always struggling to pay for lighting or gas bills? lol)


On a different note, I was talking to one of my friends the other day about how the church literally has enough food, money, land, etc to help not only its members, but also millions and millions of other people. If there was some sort of a fallout/war and the country went ape ****, the church and a lot of its members are prepared to not only help themselves, but to help others as well. I personally find that comforting, but to everyone their own.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Some people know that a charity is bad

I'm sure you're right.

, and they support it for their own selfish reasons. You are generalizing. Different people are involved with charity for different reasons.

I'm also in agreement that people have different motivations. I also agree that I was generalizing. No arguments from me so far.

You are assuming that charity is good.

How did you get that from what I posted? You're wrong on that one.

You are using circular reasoning.

Really? Based on this post??

"I suspect that those that give to charity see a lot of good it does.
I suspect those that don't give to charity feel it would be a waste anyway."

I would agree that most people who donate to a charity do not see the bad they are doing, and many imagine they are doing good when they are not.

Wow, that some jaded viewpoint there. I'm not sure how we got to debating whether charity is good or bad when all I said was it's in the eye of the beholder .. but you are seriously a crusty ol' hater if you actually believe that charity is more bad than good. JMO.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I totally get that tithing seems like a way bad idea to someone who doesn't actually believe in what they are giving the money to. I just don't see why you're so bunged rummed about it? If you're not, it sure looks like you're carrying a lot of animosity. (Also, why is it that a tithing payer is always struggling to pay for lighting or gas bills? lol)


On a different note, I was talking to one of my friends the other day about how the church literally has enough food, money, land, etc to help not only its members, but also millions and millions of other people. If there was some sort of a fallout/war and the country went ape ****, the church and a lot of its members are prepared to not only help themselves, but to help others as well. I personally find that comforting, but to everyone their own.

It's funny, even though I agree with your post (generally), I found chicken's post rather funny and repped him for it. I get why people think it's crazy .. and sometimes their logic (even when it contains a sprinkle of malice) makes me see things from others eyes and I can laugh about it.

 

[Archie Moses]

I stand by the robbing comment. Paying 10% of your income or going to Hell is the equivalent of a highway robber.

Why can't you just let people believe that it's irrevocable law dedicated and given from a higher power/god for obedience and the building up of zion (super corny. haha)?

Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it's not true for other people. And let's say just for the hells sake of it that it's not true, at least its making people feel like their is more to life than nihilism.

I love you fallenchicken guy and btw, I don't pay tithing because I'm too selfish, but I'm not going to rip on those who do.

 

[northeast]

PKM, hurting me does not make you right. You are living in a fantasy world.

 

[Stoked]

Why can't you just let people believe that it's irrevocable law dedicated and given from a higher power/god for obedience and the building up of zion (super corny. haha)?

Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it's not true for other people. And let's say just for the hells sake of it that it's not true, at least its making people feel like their is more to life than nihilism.

I love you fallenchicken guy and btw, I don't pay tithing because I'm too selfish, but I'm not going to rip on those who do.

Amen to that.

 

[northeast]

what you characterize as ripping I see as trying to be helpful.

 

[Archie Moses]

what you characterize as ripping I see as trying to be helpful.

You nonbeliever and sinful man who does not submit himself unto god with a contrite spirit and broken heart shall surely burn in hell for the wrath of the almighty shall come upon thee swiftly and ye shall burn in fire and brimstone.

Btw I'm just trying to help.

Hehepeepeecaca.

 

[northeast]

somebody else just said that he thought that his neighbor whose kids didn't have enough to eat should maybe not give so much of his income to some church before buying food, or medicine or what not, for his own family.

how is that ripping?

 

[Dr. Jones]

PKM, hurting me does not make you right. You are living in a fantasy world.

Both sentences are laughable.

- I hurt you, really?

- I live in a fantasy world because I think that some, but not all, things that come from charitable giving are good?

So, as you have stated, people who give charitably do so for selfish and evil reasons and those that handle the charities do so for selfish and evil reasons. Gotcha. (oh .. and wow.)

 

[Scat]

So you two will get a room and NAOS will be left outside, in the cold, reading a "Do Not Disturb" sign, I presume?

No, we'll lock NAOS in the room with nothing but his thoughts while Conan and I go to the new mall and check out all the babes in sundresses.

 

[northeast]

Both sentences are laughable.

- I hurt you, really? You do not discuss the topic, but instead resort to calling me names in order to degrade my reputation and undermine my position.

- I live in a fantasy world because I think that some, but not all, things that come from charitable giving are good? No, this is totally different than what you said earlier.

So, as you have stated, people who give charitably do so for selfish and evil reasons and those that handle the charities do so for selfish and charitable reasons. Again, you are changing things around, saying I said things totally different from what i said.

Gotcha. (oh .. and wow.) wow what ?

my responses in bold

 

[Dr. Jones]

my responses in bold

Go back and read everything that was written. I betcha it sounds a hell of a lot more like what I just said than what you said above.

 

[northeast]

. When I pay a tithe, I have complete confidence that God will do good with it .. it's just faith.

evidence

 

[northeast]

As I said, those that give are more likely to see the good in things and those that don't, don't. I'm not debating the merits of any specific thing, but rather the psychological/philosophical side of the equation.

evidence

 

[northeast]

Go back and read everything that was written. I betcha it sounds a hell of a lot more like what I just said than what you said above.

You make up stuff about what I said.
Why not disagree with something I actually said, instead of saying I said things I did not say, and mocking me for those things?

 

[northeast]

Quote Originally Posted by northeast View Post
Some people know that a charity is bad
I'm sure you're right.

Quote Originally Posted by northeast View Post
, and they support it for their own selfish reasons. You are generalizing. Different people are involved with charity for different reasons.
I'm also in agreement that people have different motivations. I also agree that I was generalizing. No arguments from me so far.


Quote Originally Posted by northeast View Post
You are assuming that charity is good.
How did you get that from what I posted? You're wrong on that one.
So you are not assuming charity is good?
Quote Originally Posted by northeast View Post
You are using circular reasoning.
Really? Based on this post??
So you are not assuming charity is good?
"I suspect that those that give to charity see a lot of good it does.
I suspect those that don't give to charity feel it would be a waste anyway."

Quote Originally Posted by northeast View Post
I would agree that most people who donate to a charity do not see the bad they are doing, and many imagine they are doing good when they are not.
Wow, that some jaded viewpoint there. I'm not sure how we got to debating whether charity is good or bad when all I said was it's in the eye of the beholder .. but you are seriously a crusty ol' hater if you actually believe that charity is more bad than good. JMO.
So after saying I was wrong to say that you think charity does more good than bad, you are saying that you do think charity does more good than bad, and mock me for thinking otherwise.... and yet you will not discuss this topic.