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Bye Sap It Was Nice Knowing You

MoreFeasts said:
How can the Jazz afford to pay players what they are worth?
Okay, so maybe Sap is worth 10 mil.
What is the salary cap, (sorry I don't live and breath this stuff) don't they have to keep the totals around like 50 60 million?
You give a guy 10 million to be a marginal starter or first guy off the bench, who did not have a great year, and is not getting any younger....
How do you fill out a good roster, when you are start off paying a guy 10 million that half the fans think should be coming off then bench? That leaves like 45 million for the other 14 guys, how are they going to find 5 good starters with the cash left, when you 5th or 6th man is making 10 million? Excuse my rambling.
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Where is everybody getting this "Millsap did not have a great year and is in decline" crap from? His stats are the second or third best per 36 of his career, depending on how you look at it. He is very, very good. To say that Favors and Kanter are the future is one thing, but to say Sap is declining is not true. Here are his per 36 numbers. see significant difference, or anything that would indicate a decline in how he plays?
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/millspa01.html#per_minute::none
 
b_liner1 said:
cool, have fun playing them 48 minutes per game each.
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I'm a little lost. You said Millsap plays starters minutes because he is better than Landry, Favors and Kanter. You also said Landry plays backup minutes because he is worse than Millsap.

Statistically, they are the same player. That is why I keep bringing him up. He IS Millsap (sans the steals), only 1/2 the cost.

I don't want Millsap on the Jazz for 10 million because you will be paying him as a starter, yet if the Jazz are smart, you will be giving him the minutes of a bench player.
 
green said:
I'm a little lost. You said Millsap plays starters minutes because he is better than Landry, Favors and Kanter. You also said Landry plays backup minutes because he is worse than Millsap.

Statistically, they are the same player. That is why I keep bringing him up. He IS Millsap (sans the steals), only 1/2 the cost.

I don't want Millsap on the Jazz for 10 million because you will be paying him as a starter, yet if the Jazz are smart, you will be giving him the minutes of a bench player.
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landry plays 23 minutes per game. He is not Millsap minus the steals. He is Landry, who plays 23 minutes per game for a reason. I did not say that Millsap was better than Kanter or Favors. At this point, he produces more. If you sign Carl Landry, you have to bring in another guy as well. Landry at 6 million per, plus another big guy at 4 million per equals 10 million to replace one Millsap at 10 million. the other guy will not be as good as Millsap or Landry, and you will lose production. Millsap, Kanter and Favors each getting starter minutes, and Jeremy evans with spot minutes would be a good lineup in my opinion. Landry is fine as a consolation prize, but I have always thought that Millsap is a better player, and obviously so does the rest of the league, hence Carl Landry getting less minutes and less money. Per 36 they are pretty similar, but would Landry keep that production up at starters minutes? Who knows, but we do know that Sap can produce given 30+ minutes per game
 
b_liner1 said:
Where is everybody getting this "Millsap did not have a great year and is in decline" crap from? His stats are the second or third best per 36 of his career, depending on how you look at it. He is very, very good. To say that Favors and Kanter are the future is one thing, but to say Sap is declining is not true. Here are his per 36 numbers. see significant difference, or anything that would indicate a decline in how he plays?
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/millspa01.html#per_minute::none
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You proved my point.

Millsap per 36: 17 and 8, 49% FG
Landry per 36: 17 and 9, 54% FG

Now, if Landry and Millsap are the same player, and Landry is 1/2 the cost, why would you even consider Millsap at 10-12 per when Landry is making 4 million this year and you could probably easily get him at 6.
 
b_liner1 said:
landry plays 23 minutes per game. He is not Millsap minus the steals. He is Landry, who plays 23 minutes per game for a reason. I did not say that Millsap was better than Kanter or Favors. At this point, he produces more. If you sign Carl Landry, you have to bring in another guy as well. Landry at 6 million per, plus another big guy at 4 million per equals 10 million to replace one Millsap at 10 million. the other guy will not be as good as Millsap or Landry, and you will lose production. Millsap, Kanter and Favors each getting starter minutes, and Jeremy evans with spot minutes would be a good lineup in my opinion. Landry is fine as a consolation prize, but I have always thought that Millsap is a better player, and obviously so does the rest of the league, hence Carl Landry getting less minutes and less money. Per 36 they are pretty similar, but would Landry keep that production up at starters minutes? Who knows, but we do know that Sap can produce given 30+ minutes per game
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Landry gets less minutes because he has an intelligent coach who knows that Bogut and Lee are better than Landry.
 
green said:
You proved my point.

Millsap per 36: 17 and 8, 49% FG
Landry per 36: 17 and 9, 54% FG

Now, if Landry and Millsap are the same player, and Landry is 1/2 the cost, why would you even consider Millsap at 10-12 per when Landry is making 4 million this year and you could probably easily get him at 6.
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They are similar players, but I still think Sap is better, and can produce more.
 
b_liner1 said:
sad is the day when Mark Jackson is compared favorably to the coach of the Utah Jazz.
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Amen to that. I HATE Jackson. I was so glad he got that job because I thought he was going to fall on his face.

That being said, I'd trade Jackson for Corbin in a heartbeat.
 
Can we stop talking about mark jackon? I'll admit he's better than Corbin, but I don't want him anywhere near the Jazz..
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
I thought Sap would get that too, but I think his value has dropped this year. I think he is looking at around 8 million per year in FA.
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Agree. Landry, Hickson, and West have probably pushed Sap's value down, they are having comparable years and are UFAs. If the Jazz offer Sap 5 years averaging 8 million a year. He may take that over a team offering 4 years at 9.
 
David Stern said:
I absolutely want Millsap back if we can get a fair price on him. Also, is he a RFA?
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Last time the Jazz gave Sap a contract he was a RFA Portland gave him a sweet offer and the Jazz matched it .... so I'm sure this year both him and Big Al are just FA
 
Dream roster next year:

McCollum (24) / Udrih (18) / FA
Burks (28) / Caldwell - Pope (16) / Brandon Paul
Hayward (33) / Carroll (18) / Dunleavy
Kanter (30) / Landry (25)
Favors (30) / Salah Meijri / FA
 
b_liner1 said:
Why would he not just take the extension then? At least that gave him a raise from his current salary. He will probably command about 10 mil per on the market. I think the Jazz will pay it, and have him for the next four years. Is that a bad thing? If they are not playing Kanter and Favors because of it, then yes, but if they have a three big rotation of Kanter, Favors, and Sap, then we will have the best in basketball, as they are all three going to get all star consideration. Remember when Sap was averaging roughly the same numbers he is now, but getting all star consideration for a little bit? Yeah, he is good. All this crap about how he has lost his fire is just speculation. If he has lost his fire, then why havent his numbers dropped significantly? Why does he still lead the team in steals? How is he still so good, but so much smaller than all the other big men?

The reason we think he lost his fire, is because he is pretty much at his peak, and is not improving rapidly like he was before.
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Resigning Millsap at $10 million per is repeating the very same mistake they made with Memo. Millsap may be worth that salary to most teams, but not to the Jazz because we already have two big men that are better than Millsap: Kanter and Favors.
 
Milsap WAS worth the money. As of now hes moote and unnesessary. Favors and Kanter are the best bigs on the team and will be signing new expensive contracts soon.
 
Sad to see Sap go out on such a low note. It's made it hard to remember the better parts of his career
 
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