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Longest Thread Ever

Males and females are two sides of a teeter totter, and both have equal weight.

If the male moves to the female side what happens to the balance. If the female moves to the male side what happens?

You adjust the fulcrum so the ride is still fun.

As to the treatment offered what specifically are you talking about? Not agreeing on your cage idea, of course.

Men are commanding, women are bossy. Men are aggressive, women are ball-busters. Men are independent, women are old maids.

Men have their own boxes, as well. However, the male cage comes with social power, the female cage does not, hence the caging bears more heavily on women.
 
and, for OB, no. . . . a sensible fellow will not make a cage of the roles, but merely a useful tool than can be efficiently applied to problems at hand, like how to best rear the kids.

Self-fulfilling prophecies. We raise our sons with millions of messages telling them that girls are better at raising kids, and our daughters that men should be the ones working outside the home. Then, when they respond to our conditioning, we proclaim it as natural.
 
again. . . . . probably better "morals" than the usual froth trotted out by secular humanists as well. . . . . and certainly better "morals" than any set of laws made out by legislators or tyrants. . . .

Actually, very similar to the moral writings of many secular humanists, when read by those who want to learn about them as opposed to dismiss them.
 
You adjust the fulcrum so the ride is still fun.



Men are commanding, women are bossy. Men are aggressive, women are ball-busters. Men are independent, women are old maids.

Men have their own boxes, as well. However, the male cage comes with social power, the female cage does not, hence the caging bears more heavily on women.

teeter_totter.png


Doesn't look equal to me, and if you've ever ridden a teeter totter with one side heaver, or one side moved in it just doesn't ride the same.


Women are nurturing, men are soft. Women are kind, men are weak. Women are thoughtful, men are indecisive. Women are bold, men are pigs.

Fun game.

I don't think women have less social power than men, hence I don't agree that women are more "caged" than men.
 
Self-fulfilling prophecies. We raise our sons with millions of messages telling them that girls are better at raising kids, and our daughters that men should be the ones working outside the home. Then, when they respond to our conditioning, we proclaim it as natural.

Or it's true and it's just being played out, and it is natural.

Have you seen the messages out there? I'm much less worried about messages like this that occur millions of times than the other messages that are out there billions and trillions of times that do some real damage.... talk about responding to conditioning. I can't watch tv, a movie, listen to music, the radio, read a book or see a commercial without being exposed to some sort of message someone is trying to push on everyone and/or condition people to that is worse than this message. Seriously, I could watch/listen to something for 30 seconds and have it topped. Possibly because I don't have an issue with this particular message for the most part, but even if I did... it would be nowhere near the other false messages out there imo.
 
A gilded cage is nonetheless a cage. The treatment offered to women who don't enthusiastically take up that "honor", but forge a different path, reveal the cage for what it is.

Pretty sure having a man open a door for me rather than calling me his bitch involves being caged.
 
teeter_totter.png


Doesn't look equal to me, and if you've ever ridden a teeter totter with one side heaver, or one side moved in it just doesn't ride the same.


Women are nurturing, men are soft. Women are kind, men are weak. Women are thoughtful, men are indecisive. Women are bold, men are pigs.

Fun game.

I don't think women have less social power than men, hence I don't agree that women are more "caged" than men.

So I'm a pretty analytical, and almost always amazed to find out how other people actually "think", considering it to be "Neanderthal" in construction and comprehension, and people complain about what an arrogant high-handed contemptuous fellow I am, and what a pain to endure for any length of time. . . . .

So here's a brief run-down of how it all looks from my mountain. . . . and of course I also think God sees it pretty much the way I do. . . .

mere mortals are pretty much struggling with their stick-figure concepts of things, while reality is something like the Mona Lisa. . . . containing nuance and messages most of us can hardly come up to in a lifetime of striving for "higher ideals". We throw out insults at one another that are essentially of the same character as our own minds, calling others "neanderthals", for example, because they're seeing something we're not focused on at the moment. . . .

Men and women give one another far too much grief for their different tendencies, while God probably just wishes we would appreciate one another and learn something from each other.
 
“Worrying is carrying tomorrow's load with today's strength - carrying two days at once. It is moving into tomorrow ahead of time. Worrying doesn't empty tomorrow of its sorrow, it empties today of its strength.”
― Corrie ten Boom, The Hiding Place
 
“Life is but a Weaving” (the Tapestry Poem)

“My life is but a weaving
Between my God and me.
I cannot choose the colors
He weaveth steadily.

Oft’ times He weaveth sorrow;
And I in foolish pride
Forget He sees the upper
And I the underside.

Not ’til the loom is silent
And the shuttles cease to fly
Will God unroll the canvas
And reveal the reason why.

The dark threads are as needful
In the weaver’s skillful hand
As the threads of gold and silver
In the pattern He has planned

He knows, He loves, He cares;
Nothing this truth can dim.
He gives the very best to those
Who leave the choice to Him.”
― Corrie ten Boom
 
“It was at a church service in Munich that I saw him, a former S.S. man who had stood guard at the shower room door in the processing center at Ravensbruck. He was the first of our actual jailers that I had seen since that time. And suddenly it was all there – the roomful of mocking men, the heaps of clothing, Betsie's pain-blanched face.

He came up to me as the church was emptying, beaming and bowing. “How grateful I am for your message, Fraulein.” He said. “To think that, as you say, He has washed my sins away!” His hand was thrust out to shake mine. And I, who had preached so often to the people in Bloemendaal the need to forgive, kept my hand at my side.

Even as the angry, vengeful thoughts boiled through me, I saw the sin of them. Jesus Christ had died for this man; was I going to ask for more? Lord Jesus, I prayed, forgive me and help me to forgive him. I tried to smile, I struggles to raise my hand. I could not. I felt nothing, not the slightest spark of warmth or charity. And so again I breathed a silent prayer. Jesus, I prayed, I cannot forgive him. Give me Your forgiveness.

As I took his hand the most incredible thing happened. From my shoulder along my arm and through my hand a current seemed to pass from me to him, while into my heart sprang a love for this stranger that almost overwhelmed me. And so I discovered that it is not on our forgiveness any more than on our goodness that the world's healing hinges, but on His. When He tells us to love our enemies, He gives, along with the command, the love itself.”
― Corrie ten Boom
 
“Mama,' I said as I set the tray on the bed and sat down beside it, 'can't we do something for Tante Bep? I mean, isn't it sad that hse has to spend her last days here where she hates it, instead of where she was happy? The Wallers' or someplace?'

'Corrie, Bep has been just as happy here with us--no more and no less--than she was anywhere else. Do you know when she started praising the Wallers so highly? The day she left them. As long as she was there, she had nothing but complaints. The Wallers couldn't compare with the van Hooks where she'd been before. But at the van Hooks, she'd actually been miserable. Happiness isn't something that depends on our surroundings, Corrie. It's something we make inside ourselves.”
― Corrie ten Boom, The Hiding Place
 
“It was at a church service in Munich that I saw him, a former S.S. man who had stood guard at the shower room door in the processing center at Ravensbruck. He was the first of our actual jailers that I had seen since that time. And suddenly it was all there – the roomful of mocking men, the heaps of clothing, Betsie's pain-blanched face.

He came up to me as the church was emptying, beaming and bowing. “How grateful I am for your message, Fraulein.” He said. “To think that, as you say, He has washed my sins away!” His hand was thrust out to shake mine. And I, who had preached so often to the people in Bloemendaal the need to forgive, kept my hand at my side.

Even as the angry, vengeful thoughts boiled through me, I saw the sin of them. Jesus Christ had died for this man; was I going to ask for more? Lord Jesus, I prayed, forgive me and help me to forgive him. I tried to smile, I struggles to raise my hand. I could not. I felt nothing, not the slightest spark of warmth or charity. And so again I breathed a silent prayer. Jesus, I prayed, I cannot forgive him. Give me Your forgiveness.

As I took his hand the most incredible thing happened. From my shoulder along my arm and through my hand a current seemed to pass from me to him, while into my heart sprang a love for this stranger that almost overwhelmed me. And so I discovered that it is not on our forgiveness any more than on our goodness that the world's healing hinges, but on His. When He tells us to love our enemies, He gives, along with the command, the love itself.”
― Corrie ten Boom

There is something in this experience of Corrie ten Boom as explained here that I can vouch for, because it has common elements with my own experience. I could not doubt the truth of this story as she tells it, for unless she had experienced it, she could not have told it as she did.

So I did a google search, so I could tell my kids more about Corrie ten Boom, and found this:

ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cfp51vLZb4

This is one of those "What? You too?" things. . . . .
 
Doesn't look equal to me, and if you've ever ridden a teeter totter with one side heaver, or one side moved in it just doesn't ride the same.


Women are nurturing, men are soft. Women are kind, men are weak. Women are thoughtful, men are indecisive. Women are bold, men are pigs.

Fun game.

I don't think women have less social power than men, hence I don't agree that women are more "caged" than men.

Riding differently is not necessarily a bad thing. I agree that patriarchy hurts men as well.

As for social power, there is a huge difference in the power level between being able to decide something and being able to influence a decision, particularly if you're not even in the meetings where the decisions are made. Whatever their influence, as long as women are not allowed to priests/bishops/cardinals/prophets/ministers/clerics/shamans/etc., they will have less power in that particular religion. If you are OK with that, just be OK with it. Don't pretend it's not true, that just insults me and, more importantly, demeans you.
 
Or it's true and it's just being played out, and it is natural.

Have you seen the messages out there? I'm much less worried about messages like this that occur millions of times than the other messages that are out there billions and trillions of times that do some real damage.... talk about responding to conditioning. I can't watch tv, a movie, listen to music, the radio, read a book or see a commercial without being exposed to some sort of message someone is trying to push on everyone and/or condition people to that is worse than this message. Seriously, I could watch/listen to something for 30 seconds and have it topped. Possibly because I don't have an issue with this particular message for the most part, but even if I did... it would be nowhere near the other false messages out there imo.

What's true is that some men are very naturally nurturing and home-oriented, and some men are not. Some women are very naturally career-minded and good providers, and some are not. We try to box up the nurturing men and the career-minded women into the roles in which they do not fit, to keep our model of natural alive, rather than allow the reality.

I agree there are many sorts of negative messaging. I do not agree that since there is starvation in Africa, we don't need to help the poor in the USA.
 
Riding differently is not necessarily a bad thing. I agree that patriarchy hurts men as well.

As for social power, there is a huge difference in the power level between being able to decide something and being able to influence a decision, particularly if you're not even in the meetings where the decisions are made. Whatever their influence, as long as women are not allowed to priests/bishops/cardinals/prophets/ministers/clerics/shamans/etc., they will have less power in that particular religion. If you are OK with that, just be OK with it. Don't pretend it's not true, that just insults me and, more importantly, demeans you.

Not sure who you are agreeing with because I did not state that I thought patriarchy hurts men or women, but nice attempt at putting words in my mouth.

You say riding differently is not necessarily a bad thing which is an ambiguous statement. It is not necessarily a good thing. Depends on your perspective doesn't it.

Obviously you and I view power in a very different light. I see this in a similar way as the Jews experience in waiting for their Savior/Messiah/War Leader that would break them free of bondage and make them a power nation in the world. A base misunderstanding of what their Savior would be and what he would be saving them from shaped their view and made it difficult for them to see the real Savior when he got there.

Power and authority are very different things. Power as the world views it is much different than true power. Priesthood authority is much different than priesthood power. Christ came with both power and authority. While the authority was necessary for him, it was his power that did the work. It was his power that was behind the miracles, behind the changing of people, behind what he taught. He did not come to kill, or be king of the country, or be a better version of Alexander the great. His real work was to change people, lift people, help people, free them in other ways.

In this same way every person has that same opportunity to have the power to shape lives, lift people, change people, and make a real difference in this world. Christ himself said something about his disciples doing greater miracles than he has done, and he did many physical miracles even to the point of raising the dead. The greater miracles beyond any of those physical healing miracles, is having a hand in changing people's hearts, helping to change who they are. That is more of a miracle than healing a disease, in the grande scheme of things.

Of course these ideas are imo... and the gospel of TM. Take that as you will.
 
What's true is that some men are very naturally nurturing and home-oriented, and some men are not. Some women are very naturally career-minded and good providers, and some are not. We try to box up the nurturing men and the career-minded women into the roles in which they do not fit, to keep our model of natural alive, rather than allow the reality.

I agree there are many sorts of negative messaging. I do not agree that since there is starvation in Africa, we don't need to help the poor in the USA.

I see you agreeing and disagreeing with someone.

I did make a statement about negative messages, so you can agree with me on that.

No clue who you are not in agreement with on the next line because I have made no statement about it.

You trying to put me in a box? If not, you might want to be more clear as to who you are agreeing/disagreeing with.
 
No clue who you are not in agreement with on the next line because I have made no statement about it.

It was a metaphor. There are messages we both agree are bad. That's no reason for me to ignore other, possibly less frequent messages that are bad.
 
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