Yesterday - Bundy Ranch

[The Thriller]

“I want to tell you one more thing I know about the Negro,” the rancher began as he described a "government house" in Las Vegas where he recalled that all the people who sat outside seemed to "have nothing to do."

“And because they were basically on government subsidy, so now what do they do?” he said, as quoted by the Times. “They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never learned how to pick cotton. And I’ve often wondered, are they better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things, or are they better off under government subsidy? They didn’t get no more freedom. They got less freedom.”

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/cliven-bundy-are-blacks-better-off-as-slaves

What a patriot...

 

[One Brow]

If you keep on giving people things, it gives them less incentive to go out and do something for themselves. I believe the Indian Reservations are a prime example of this.

That's deep, deep, level of ignorance. I would say more, but this is the wrong thread for that.

 

[One Brow]

To add to that... it's immaterial to this matter. This is about rights not opinions. It's about conspiring politicians and government overreach not black or white, or gay or straight, or one's socio-economic class, or anything like that.

I agree here.

 

[Mission Accomplished]

I get that too, but remember that a blind squirrel is gonna find a nut some day. Just because on the immediate surface he's a cry baby that doesn't think he should have to follow the same rules as the rest of us doesn't mean there isn't an injustice being done. But that's why this isn't going to lead to a revolution, just feelings of resentment that maybe, someday, compounded with something a little less foggy, might lead to a revolution.

It's like an oreo.

Whiney little cattle rancher hijacking the price of beef WAY up(have you seen beef prices lately?) while whining about grazing fees/cattle head limits
Whole mess of civil liberties, states rights, and other legit issues in the middle
Racist redneck hillbilly hoping to get as much support from anyone and everyone possible with as little effort as possible

Personally I'm more outraged about the corporate money that is buying our government than some rancher that is choosing to circumvent laws and fees that have been on the books since before Ronald "the demigod" Reagan. I know that their is the argument which came first the chicken or the egg to the whole Cliven Bundy debate. But, meanwhile the SCOTUS has put in place first Citizens United and now they have made a decision on the McCutheon case which are far worse and have much larger consequences for us. Our country is turning from a Republic to and Oligarchy before our eyes.

Remember in this whole argument that Cliven Bundy is choosing to break the laws.

 

[Hantlers]

That's deep, deep, level of ignorance. I would say more, but this is the wrong thread for that.

You spend much time on a reservation OB? You spend any time with people from a reservation?

I would love to hear your experience with those from a reservation, as I'm sure it's extensive.

 

[Deleted member 848]

You spend much time on a reservation OB? You spend any time with people from a reservation?

I would love to hear your experience with those from a reservation, as I'm sure it's extensive.

There are tens of reservations surrounding my area, and I've visited them before. A friend of mine even grew up in a reserve.


OneBrow is right, and you are wrong.

 

[Hantlers]

How can we own the land? Native American's were here first, why don't they own it? They, too, have a preemptive right that's not being observed.

Cause we had a war, and we won.

 

[Hantlers]

There are tens of reservations surrounding my area, and I've visited them before. A friend of mine even grew up in a reserve.


OneBrow is right, and you are wrong.

Maybe it's different in Canada.

I've spent a lot of times on the ones in Montana and in North Dakota.

I'm not exaggerating with what I'm saying.

 

[Harambe]

Personally I'm more outraged about the corporate money that is buying our government than some rancher that is choosing to circumvent laws and fees that have been on the books since before Ronald "the demigod" Reagan. I know that their is the argument which came first the chicken or the egg to the whole Cliven Bundy debate. But, meanwhile the SCOTUS has put in place first Citizens United and now they have made a decision on the McCutheon case which are far worse and have much larger consequences for us. Our country is turning from a Republic to and Oligarchy before our eyes.

Remember in this whole argument that Cliven Bundy is choosing to break the laws.

When the law is crap and you can't change it, you have to move somewhere more of your liking. But if it's your home you've known all your life, your children have known all their lives, your parents knew all their lives, their parents... it gets a little more complicated.

Now, as far as the Oligarchy is concerned, that's already been established:

https://www.businessinsider.com/major-study-finds-that-the-us-is-an-oligarchy-2014-4

The U.S. government does not represent the interests of the majority of the country's citizens, but is instead ruled by those of the rich and powerful, a new study from Princeton and Northwestern universities has concluded.

The report, "Testing Theories of American Politics: Elites, Interest Groups, and Average Citizens" (PDF), used extensive policy data collected between 1981 and 2002 to empirically determine the state of the U.S. political system.

 

[Harambe]

Cause we had a war, and we won.

Oh, great, Brute Force is the answer. Glad to see you're all up on that... and all.

 

[Mission Accomplished]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSUXXzN26zg

What have we seen before Joe the Plummer the super hero a non licensed plumber owing back taxes out the ying-yang. How are these whack jobs becoming patriots? Yet, the people protesting Wallstreet are a bunch of freeloaders that want a free ride.

 

[One Brow]

Maybe it's different in Canada.

I've spent a lot of times on the ones in Montana and in North Dakota.

I'm not exaggerating with what I'm saying.

Right, it's just that the natives in Montana and North Dakota like living in poverty, because they don't have the drive white people have to live better. You know that, because you saw it. Got it.

 

[Harambe]

Maybe it's different in Canada.

I've spent a lot of times on the ones in Montana and in North Dakota.

I'm not exaggerating with what I'm saying.

I went to school with quite a few actually. See, Tooele County School District also brings in kids from the Goshute Indian reservation of Skull Valley, Utah. The kids were normal enough... the parents though is another story.

But not once did I see a people unwilling to work hard for themselves and their families. I only saw a defeated people that knew they were defeated. Many of them could have changed, but having seen their predecessors spirits they just don't believe they can do anything.

 

[Hantlers]

Oh, great, Brute Force is the answer. Glad to see you're all up on that... and all.

That's really what you took out of that?

You must really be one hell of an analyst.

 

[fishonjazz]

A shame that this thread probably gonna be bigger than the 2014 draft thread

 

[Hantlers]

Right, it's just that the natives in Montana and North Dakota like living in poverty, because they don't have the drive white people have to live better. You know that, because you saw it. Got it.

That's exactly what I said.

Crushed it OB, crushed it.

Oh and just to clarify, I'm not the one who brought color into this…that would be you.

Anyways, anytime you want to answer my question, feel free to.

 

[Mission Accomplished]

When the law is crap and you can't change it, you have to move somewhere more of your liking. But if it's your home you've known all your life, your children have known all their lives, your parents knew all their lives, their parents... it gets a little more complicated.

Now, as far as the Oligarchy is concerned, that's already been established:

https://www.businessinsider.com/major-study-finds-that-the-us-is-an-oligarchy-2014-4

But, the law isn't crap if he paid he would still be able to graze the lands. He CHOSES not to pay squatting doesn't equate to ownership.

But, lets say we are an Oligarchy the right should be outraged. Yet, the march to the beat of a drum that keep them from living in reality. All they care about is their right to bare arms and all the folks on Welfare that are stealing from them. Yet, the vote in heads of corporations that drive down wages and living standards in the hopes that they are free.

 

[Harambe]

That's really what you took out of that?

You must really be one hell of an analyst.

I am. I'm not the analyst that accepts the past as the best option, just the analyst that finds a better way for a brighter future.

Conquering countries is the way of the past. Finding a new way to do things is the future.

You see conversion from old school unix based systems to Web sphere/access/oracle all the time. In order to do that, you have to go back to the old unix systems, rip out the data, reformat it and put it back in. Correctly identifying that data is a huge piece of the puzzle.

 

[Harambe]

But, the law isn't crap if he paid he would still be able to graze the lands. He CHOSES not to pay squatting doesn't equate to ownership.

But, lets say we are an Oligarchy the right should be outraged. Yet, the march to the beat of a drum that keep them from living in reality. All they care about is their right to bare arms and all the folks on Welfare that are stealing from them. Yet, the vote in heads of corporations that drive down wages and living standards in the hopes that they are free.

The law is crap, as his family should be grandfathered out of grazing fees. Moreover, he has over 1000 head of cattle, BLM told him to reduce it to 150 which essentially killed off all his buddies ranches in the area.

 

[Hantlers]

I am. I'm not the analyst that accepts the past as the best option, just the analyst that finds a better way for a brighter future.

Conquering countries is the way of the past. Finding a new way to do things is the future.

You see conversion from old school unix based systems to Web sphere/access/oracle all the time. In order to do that, you have to go back to the old unix systems, rip out the data, reformat it and put it back in. Correctly identifying that data is a huge piece of the puzzle.

I don't see us conquering lands and taking them over too much anymore.

Should we just give the land back (that people have paid for), because we feel bad about it? That doesn't solve anything.

The law is crap, as his family should be grandfathered out of grazing fees. Moreover, he has over 1000 head of cattle, BLM told him to reduce it to 150 which essentially killed off all his buddies ranches in the area.

His family never paid to buy the land, you can't just give it to them. That's like saying a family that has rented a house for 20 years should be given the house because they've rented it that long.

Also, they didn't tell him to reduce his herd size, they told him the maximum amount of cattle he could graze on that section was 150. Believe it or not, that's pretty common. It's done to protect the ground so that it doesn't get overgrazed.