Mark Cuban's afraid of the witchhunt. he might think he is next target of the witchunt

[One Brow]

do you see me as a bigot.

incase you do not know my view. simple: Mariage is for procreaiton. same sex mariages therefore are not allowed because no matter what they do procreation does not happen.

Would you forbid someone from marrying an 80-year-old woman? Your silence on this is telling, because I'm fairly sure you would allow for this, even though there is no chance of procreation. That indicates you are deceiving someone, probably yourself.

 

[Stoked]

Do we agree we are mostly discussing the first and/or second definition? Because I perfectly comfortable with saying that I have seen no arguments opposed to gay marriage that are agreeable to reason, reasonable, sensible, show an exercise of reason, are based on sound judgement, or use good sense. Which arguments against gay marriage would you say are agreeable to reason, reasonable, sensible, show an exercise of reason, are based on sound judgement, or use good sense?

No, just because I have not seen such a rational argument against gay marriage does not mean no such argument exists. However, since many people have attempted to put forth a rational argument against gay marriage and none have done so, I hold that no such argument exists provisionally.

All this says is that you do not think the arguments have been rational. Personal opinion. That hits right back into my original point. If you cannot see anything different, and you admitted that you have not, then why must the faalt lie with them?

Seems to me that you are incapable of seeing that side in any light but the one in your head. Smacks of all this bias and bigotry you speak of.

 

[One Brow]

cus honestly if i was inc harge of hiring people.
and 2 candidates where exactly the same.
but one was in a same sex mariage, i would porbably pass him over,

he would have to be head and shoulders above the other candidate.

That would be bigotry.

 

[One Brow]

Thank you for answering my question. Basically it is not rational becuase you said so. Got it.

Apparently, you agree, at least by your silence assent that you can't find a rational argument.

 

[Stoked]

Apparently, you agree, at least by your silence assent that you can't find a rational argument.

I changed it as it was more confrontational than I wanted.

Also I will be MIA for a while so I may not get back to you again today.

 

[One Brow]

All this says is that you do not think the arguments have been rational. Personal opinion.

The principles of reason are well-established. Something is sensible when it can be immediately perceived by all observers. A judgment is sound when it can be shown to be true based on evidence. It's not just personal opinion. I like lemon cake better than chocolate cake. That preference is personal, as is the preference of chocolate cake over vanilla cake. That's personal opinion. Arguments against gay marriage can be examined for their internal consistency and conformity to observations. So far, these arguments fail in one or both of these tests. It's not a personal opinion that they fail. They just fail.

 

[Stoked]

The principles of reason are well-established. Something is sensible when it can be immediately perceived by all observers. A judgment is sound when it can be shown to be true based on evidence. It's not just personal opinion. I like lemon cake better than chocolate cake. That preference is personal, as is the preference of chocolate cake over vanilla cake. That's personal opinion. Arguments against gay marriage can be examined for their internal consistency and conformity to observations. So far, these arguments fail in one or both of these tests. It's not a personal opinion that they fail. They just fail.

lol, sometimes your word dancing to spruce up a basic theme makes me smile.

I truly believe that you dismiss the other sides arguments simply on your distate for religion. You dismiss it and its tenents completely. As such anything that comes from that must be unreasonable.

Basically you do not like it so it is unreasonable. Sigh.

Well keep fighting your fight irrational fight.

 

[gandalfe]

cus honestly if i was inc harge of hiring people.
and 2 candidates where exactly the same.
but one was in a same sex mariage, i would porbably pass him over,

he would have to be head and shoulders above the other candidate.

No, that's not bigoted AT ALL...

 

[gandalfe]

lol, sometimes your word dancing to spruce up a basic theme makes me smile.

I truly believe that you dismiss the other sides arguments simply on your distate for religion. You dismiss it and its tenents completely. As such anything that comes from that must be unreasonable.

Basically you do not like it so it is unreasonable. Sigh.

Well keep fighting your fight irrational fight.

Religion (a position one must hold by faith and faith alone) is, by its very nature, antithetical to reason.

 

[One Brow]

I truly believe that you dismiss the other sides arguments simply on your distate for religion. You dismiss it and its tenents completely. As such anything that comes from that must be unreasonable.

Anything based on faith is by definition irrational, but that includes my humanism every bit as much as your Mormonism.

While I'm in favor of legalizing marijuana and prostitution, I recognize there are rational arguments against either one. While I am in favor of raising the minimum wage, I recognize there are rational arguments against it. In cases like this, I try to make my decision based on the preponderance of the evidence and what seems to do the most good or cause the least harm.

However, I'm still waiting to hear an argument based on reason and/or sound judgments against gay marriage.

 

[Stoked]

Anything based on faith is by definition irrational, but that includes my humanism every bit as much as your Mormonism.

While I'm in favor of legalizing marijuana and prostitution, I recognize there are rational arguments against either one. While I am in favor of raising the minimum wage, I recognize there are rational arguments against it. In cases like this, I try to make my decision based on the preponderance of the evidence and what seems to do the most good or cause the least harm.

However, I'm still waiting to hear an argument based on reason and/or sound judgments against gay marriage.

Hahaha but I am sorry no.

ir·ra·tion·al/ɪˈræʃənl/
adjective
1. without the faculty of reason; deprived of reason.
2. without or deprived of normal mental clarity or sound judgment.
3. not in accordance with reason; utterly illogical: irrational arguments.
4. not endowed with the faculty of reason

Unprovable does not equal irrational. No matter how mush you wish it to be so. You simply refuse to allow for anything different than the definition you wish to impose on the other side of this debate.

How fitting. Seems to me you would only accept them as rational if they gave up their religion and how it affects their view on life. Not tolerant and accepting at all.

I'm bored of the topic for now. Have fun justifying to yourself that all the intolerance and irrationality is one sided.

 

[One Brow]

Hahaha but I am sorry no.

ir·ra·tion·al/ɪˈræʃənl/
adjective
1. without the faculty of reason; deprived of reason.
2. without or deprived of normal mental clarity or sound judgment.
3. not in accordance with reason; utterly illogical: irrational arguments.
4. not endowed with the faculty of reason

Unprovable does not equal irrational.

Reason, sound judgement, logic: all of these are things that use proof. That which uses no proof is not reasonable, not sound, not logical in any meaningful way, and not rational.

No matter how mush you wish it to be so. You simply refuse to allow for anything different than the definition you wish to impose on the other side of this debate.

I'm using the definitions you are offering.

How fitting. Seems to me you would only accept them as rational if they gave up their religion and how it affects their view on life.

I just described my own belief system of humanism as irrational. Did you miss that part?

 

[gandalfe]

Unprovable does not equal irrational.

UNPROVEN does not equal irrational. But if something is unprovable, then, yeah, it is irrational (and probably false). Doesn't mean you can't have rational thoughts about it, but... GIGO.

 

[Stoked]

UNPROVEN does not equal irrational. But if something is unprovable, then, yeah, it is irrational (and probably false). Doesn't mean you can't have rational thoughts about it, but... GIGO.

Since that abscence of God is unprovable does that make athiesim is irrational? Does that by extension make any arguments influenced by athiest beliefs irrational?

No, it does not.

 

[moevillini]

I guess to me this idea that all those that oppose some idea, right, group. movement... (for example gay marriage) must mean that they are bigots and hateful. That they MUST be, no other eplanation. No allowance for different levels or reason for disagreement. Well, it rings hollow and smacks of bias and hypocrisy.

Are those that oppose for reasons based on hate? Absolutely, beyond debate. Does that apply to everyone? No even close. It allows no room for varying opinions, reasons or personalities.

I pretty much agree with these comments. Opinions change and evolve. What once seemed like fact is disproved. There are cultural differences. I'm not necessarily a fan of cultural relativism, but sometimes it's the best way to look at things. To arbitrarily label everything as "hate" is counterproductive.

It is not that black and white.

there's some major irony right there...

 

[One Brow]

Since that abscence of God is unprovable does that make athiesim is irrational?

A claim that no sort of God can possibly exist is an irrational claim. However, atheism does not require one to claim that no sort of God can possibly exist.

Does that by extension make any arguments influenced by athiest beliefs irrational?

Atheism is a lack of belief, not a belief. There are no atheist beliefs.

 

[gandalfe]

Since that abscence of God is unprovable does that make athiesim is irrational? Does that by extension make any arguments influenced by athiest beliefs irrational?

No, it does not.

I should have been clearer in my wording. A POSITIVE claim that is unprovable is irrational. We cannot, for example, prove that Superman does not exist. But we have seen no evidence for him, therefore, it is rational to believe that he does not exist.

 

[gandalfe]

Atheism is a lack of belief, not a belief. There are no atheist beliefs.

So much this.

 

[Stoked]

Atheism is the belief that there is no God. If it can not be proven one way or the other than it is a belief.

 

[[size/HUGE] fixed [/size]]

Atheism is the belief that there is no God. If it can not be proven one way or the other than it is a belief.

just lol